pellets

[zilon]

Hi does any one know if crossman powapell are the same as webley powapell,,!! cheers

[UKPoacher]

Hi does any one know if crossman powapell are the same as webley powapell,,!! cheers

 

I've not used Powapell, but I can't detect any diference physically or when shooting between Crosman Accupel and Webley Accupel.

[spiceychilli57]

Webley bought the brand so they just renamed them webley powerpell, meant to be the same thing

 

Im my opinion they are nowhere near as well made and consistant as they were when they had crossman on the lid, i used to love accupels and so did my rifle, bought new tin and not impressed not buying another one

 

Spicer

[UKPoacher]

You can still get the Crosman version.

[Dekers]

Webley bought the brand so they just renamed them webley powerpell, meant to be the same thing

 

Im my opinion they are nowhere near as well made and consistant as they were when they had crossman on the lid, i used to love accupels and so did my rifle, bought new tin and not impressed not buying another one

 

Spicer

 

 

Ok, we all live and learn but this is news to me, are you saying Crossman do not exist anymore and the brand/name is owned by Webley?

[spiceychilli57]

it must have been in a magazine at some point, all the places i go for pellets have webley accupels rather than crossman now so it made sense

 

if you look to buy a ratcatcher its a webley crossman ratcatcher

 

I might be mistaken but they definately arent the quality they used to be

 

Spicer

Edited November 5, 2010 by spiceychilli57

[zilon]

it must have been in a magazine at some point, all the places i go for pellets have webley accupels rather than crossman now so it made sense

 

if you look to buy a ratcatcher its a webley crossman ratcatcher

 

I might be mistaken but they definately arent the quality they used to be

 

Spicer

Thanks everyone

[Clubshot]

Most Webley Branded Pellets have been dropped in last Closure of Webley's

 

What Gun and have you Tried UK made Defiants

 

 

http://www.defiantpellets.com

 

 

BOB/R

Edited November 11, 2010 by Clubshot

[UKPoacher]

Most Webley Branded Pellets have been dropped in last Closure of Webley's

 

What Gun and have you Tried UK made Defiants

 

 

http://www.defiantpellets.com

 

 

BOB/R

 

I have tried them in several guns. They are ****! That's why there's tumbleweed blowing through the Defiant Pellets Forum

[Sha Bu Le]

I have tried them in several guns. They are ****! That's why there's tumbleweed blowing through the Defiant Pellets Forum

Got a freebie ?? tin of Webley powa pells when I bought my lightning xl. For accuracy can't fault them ....better than me.

However at short 15 yard range they are a serious over penetrating pellet. When shooting a pigeon or cd at 15 yards and I know i've hit but the bird flies off I think oh ****.

Trying different pellets atm gun seems to like BSA Elites (domed) & its not too bad with Milbro Match wadcutters but it does not like Biz pest control hollow points. Inch out & down to the right @15 yards at 25

Some of the lads on here reckon their lightnings lurve RWS super domes so going to try some.

 

ATB..Bri

Edited November 11, 2010 by Sha Bu Le

[UKPoacher]

Apart from being wayward these penetrating pellets do just that. Penetrate and leave the quarry wounded rather than dead. This is how I like a pellet to perform; A JSB Exact from the chest cavity of a squirrel compared to the unfired pellet on the left.........

 

 

That deformity means better transfer of energy, and a better liklihood of a clean kill.

 

Superdomes are great pellets for the money. They are harder than JSB Exacts / AA Fields,but have a shallower dome meaning that they collapse well. My HW77s used nothing else.

[garden gun]

We use RWS superdomes and superpoints. Domes for squirrel, rats and bunnies - points for feathered quarry. Do the job a treat - a lot of clean kills particularly if you hit the chesyt cavity (fur) or get a good head/spine shot (feather).

[Sha Bu Le]

We use RWS superdomes and superpoints. Domes for squirrel, rats and bunnies - points for feathered quarry. Do the job a treat - a lot of clean kills particularly if you hit the chesyt cavity (fur) or get a good head/spine shot (feather).

 

Some good comments re superdomes, bought a tin today in Carlisle dark when I got home so I'll try them tomorrow

 

ATB

Bri

Edited November 13, 2010 by Sha Bu Le

[The Duncan]

Some good comments re superdomes, bought a tin today in Carlisle dark when I got home so I'll try them tomorrow

 

ATB

Bri

Frankly, sod energy transfer and body shots , with a legal limit air rifle, the only way of safely switching off your quarry instantaneously, is with a brain shot. It's the only humane place: you destroy the brain, the animal dies immediately, any movement after an accurate shot to the cranium is just involuntary muscle reflex.

If you hit a rabbit in the chest area - perhaps just puncture it's lung, it could take days to die! Not what we're after, surely gents? Airguns are not rimfires, and the wound tract just isn't the same!

What distance would you bet a thousand pounds of your own money that you could hit a pound coin 3 times out of 3?

Most top level FT shooters say 25 yards; I think that's a touch short myself, but the point is with our quarry, the cranium size is about a pound coin sized target: rabbit between ear and eye, same, if a bit tighter for Woodie, or grey squirrel or rat.

If you can hit a £1 coin at your chosen hunting range, then you're ready to hunt at that range; if not, practise!

That's the great challenge of air rifle hunting - getting in close and being accurate enough to put that pellet 1/2 inch perfect to do the job properly.That's what air rifle hunting is about IMHO of course :yp:

Edited November 16, 2010 by The Duncan

[Dekers]

The Duncan

 

I understand the point you are attempting to make but I have to say if you can shoot a pigeon in the head then you can also stop a rabbit with a heart shot.

 

25-35 yard Air rifle shots are easy with the right tool and known distances, the problems with air rifles of sub 12ft lb comes with distances in the field, the drops are like falling off a cliff, particularly the .22 and .25.

 

So, if you can master the right part of the head shot with any given quarry distance then fine, and distance is a lot harder at night as well, but if you are that good the heart will do just as well. A 12 ft lb will penetrate enough at sensible distance to make it to the heart of a bunny!

 

ATB!

Edited November 17, 2010 by Dekers

[UKPoacher]

Frankly, sod energy transfer and body shots , with a legal limit air rifle, the only way of safely switching off your quarry instantaneously, is with a brain shot. It's the only humane place: you destroy the brain, the animal dies immediately, any movement after an accurate shot to the cranium is just involuntary muscle reflex.

If you hit a rabbit in the chest area - perhaps just puncture it's lung, it could take days to die! Not what we're after, surely gents? Airguns are not rimfires, and the wound tract just isn't the same!

 

 

Absolute ******!

 

If you hit a rabbit, squirrel or pigeon in the chest cavity with a pellet that stays in - i.e. transfers all its energy into the quarry it dies almost immediately. You might get a short run or jump just like when a deer, boar or fox are shot in the chest, but they die almost instantly. You can't breathe with a hole in your chest cavity. It needs a vaccuum to operate. The lungs will collapse.

 

The only time I've known quarry make off any distance is when using Defiants or Logun Penetrators where the pellet passes straight through. They still die, but not as quickly as when they've been slammed with a good lead pellet.

 

 

Secondly, the biggest and least mobile killing target area of a pigeon is its chest. Its head is tiny in comparison and is always on the move.

 

Just for the record I've hit squirrels bang on in the cranium - lights out! And then seen them get up a few minutes later. One had a bit of brain poking out of the hole, but I needed a second shot to finish it off. Some rodents have strong skulls especially to reinforce the upper jaws. Brain shots aren't always the answer.

[The Duncan]

The Duncan

 

I understand the point you are attempting to make but I have to say if you can shoot a pigeon in the head then you can also stop a rabbit with a heart shot.

 

25-35 yard Air rifle shots are easy with the right tool and known distances, the problems with air rifles of sub 12ft lb comes with distances in the field, the drops are like falling off a cliff, particularly the .22 and .25.

 

So, if you can master the right part of the head shot with any given quarry distance then fine, and distance is a lot harder at night as well, but if you are that good the heart will do just as well. A 12 ft lb will penetrate enough at sensible distance to make it to the heart of a bunny!

 

ATB!

Fair points made Deker, I just think that due to pellet deflection on impact with the ribcage, it is very hard to be certain of hitting the heart.

With an FAC rated rifle,I'd be more inclined to agree with you. A cranial shot is pretty much guaranteed to have a pretty certain kill.

Then again, if you've been getting clean kills at good ranges with heart shots, then maybe I've been missing a trick!

What would you reckon the 'clean kill' rate would be, out of 10 for example?

:yp:

 

Cheers,

 

Duncan

[mike9965]

heres one that doesnt miss shape on impact this was shot at a steel target holder

 

Edited November 18, 2010 by mike9965

[inshallah]

The Duncan

 

So, if you can master the right part of the head shot with any given quarry distance then fine, and distance is a lot harder at night as well, but if you are that good the heart will do just as well. A 12 ft lb will penetrate enough at sensible distance to make it to the heart of a bunny!

 

ATB!

 

Yes, but the heart is about the same size as the brain. So, same size target, but nowhere as easy to pin down as the brain. I can't believe anyone could identify the POI needed on a rabbit for a heart shot, at any angle.

[garden gun]

It is IMHO down to the normal behavious of the quarry species. Bunnies grazing will keep the head "still" long enough to squeeze off a shot. Squirrels do bounce around and getting a pure head shot in is more difficult, conversley chest is less well armoured and so a chest shot (particularly if through the back/spine) is a goer. Feathered quarry have a habit of moving head around rapidly and corvid heads are particulary hard. Back shot to chest avoiding breast padding is an instant killer. However, in most cases you can shoulder shot, stop flight and then finish off - not entirely one shot humane I agree, but..........

[Dekers]

Fair points made Deker, I just think that due to pellet deflection on impact with the ribcage, it is very hard to be certain of hitting the heart.

With an FAC rated rifle,I'd be more inclined to agree with you. A cranial shot is pretty much guaranteed to have a pretty certain kill.

Then again, if you've been getting clean kills at good ranges with heart shots, then maybe I've been missing a trick!

What would you reckon the 'clean kill' rate would be, out of 10 for example?

:yp:

 

Cheers,

 

Duncan

 

 

I can shoot reasonably well and would always choose the shot depending on what I have in my hand and quarry, distance etc. So the answer is probably 10/10. However, nobody is that good and so we move into debatable territory.

 

One point I will make VERY strongly though is a comment I hear all too often..."If you aim for the head you either kill instantly or miss altogether!" ......******!

 

ATB!

Edited November 18, 2010 by Dekers

[Dekers]

Yes, but the heart is about the same size as the brain. So, same size target, but nowhere as easy to pin down as the brain. I can't believe anyone could identify the POI needed on a rabbit for a heart shot, at any angle.

 

 

Chap, believe what you will there is always someone who can, everyone has a different knowledge and skill level!

 

As Always in shooting there is often debate and not necessarily a RIGHT answer, the answer is commonly take the shot you are confident with!

 

ATB!

[The Duncan]

Some really good points being made here and I'm glad there is some debate going on.

 

Points I want to come back to:

 

 

Deker is dead right when it comes to confidence in the shot - if you know what you are doing and feel certain a clean kill will be the result of your shot, then go for it. Obviously, if you're getting 'runners', something needs addressing!

I personally don't have the confidence in a sub 12fpe pellet connecting with the heart and not being deflected by the rib cage to any degree of reliability, so I stick to brain shots in airgun quarry - if they present a difficult target due to behaviours, I relish the challenge.

Heart shot with my Rimmie? That's a no brainer - massive bullet expansion and fragmentation leaves such a wound tract that even if the heart doesn't sustain a direct hit, secondary impacts do the job rapidly, and blood loss is immense, meaning the animal loses consciousness almost immediately in any case.

FAC air? I would be more confident of chest shots than with a 12fpe rifle.

I also agree that going for the headshot doesn't guarantee a clean kill or clean miss - that is balderdash! A touch low and you could just glance a woodies neck, or puncture its crop and the now injured bird would fly off. A brain shot, on target does guarantee a clean kill. We must all be ready for the need for a fast 2nd shot though - if an animal bolts as you squeeze the trigger, for example, a final killing shot could be necessary.

 

 

UKPoacher "Secondly, the biggest and least mobile killing target area of a pigeon is its chest. Its head is tiny in comparison and is always on the move."

You can definitely take a woodie between the shoulder blades from behind - there's no defence or protection of its vital organs from that side. However, I couldn't condone taking chest shots at woodies with a legal limit air rifle - first the pellet has to travel through inches of chest muscle, then somehow it has to have enough energy left to break through the breast bone and finally into the heart or lungs, the breastbone acts like armour plating around the birds vitals. Personally I find a chest shot on a Woodie deplorable, with a legal limit air rifle.

You are spot on about the grey squirrel - bl**dy tough skulls they have! A hollow point at sub 30 yards range with a close to the limit air rifle seems to be necessary with these - the impact lets out one hell of a crack doesn't it? And claret everywhere from a headshot :blink:

 

ATB one and all!

 

Good to have some different points of view

Edited November 18, 2010 by The Duncan

[UKPoacher]

You can definitely take a woodie between the shoulder blades from behind - there's no defence or protection of its vital organs from that side. However, I couldn't condone taking chest shots at woodies with a legal limit air rifle - first the pellet has to travel through inches of chest muscle, then somehow it has to have enough energy left to break through the breast bone and finally into the heart or lungs, the breastbone acts like armour plating around the birds vitals. Personally I find a chest shot on a Woodie deplorable, with a legal limit air rifle.

 

Let's get one thing straight. A woodie's breast bone isn't armour plated. A pellet penetrates it quite easily. Secondly, hit the bird anywhere in the chest except full on, directly on the middle line, and the pellet will miss hardest part of the breast bone. The flaired off parts are like wafers. Thirdly, have you measured a woodie's breast meat? Obviously not if you decribe it as being 'inches'.

 

I aim for just under the shoulder where there is no bone and it kills instantly.

[The Duncan]

Let's get one thing straight. A woodie's breast bone isn't armour plated. A pellet penetrates it quite easily. Secondly, hit the bird anywhere in the chest except full on, directly on the middle line, and the pellet will miss hardest part of the breast bone. The flaired off parts are like wafers. Thirdly, have you measured a woodie's breast meat? Obviously not if you decribe it as being 'inches'.

 

I aim for just under the shoulder where there is no bone and it kills instantly.

Ok armour plated is possibly an exaggeration but bare in mind we're talking sub12-ers here, and I've seen others chest shooting woodies and getting shall we say, 'mixed' results.

Having said that, the just under-the-shoulder idea sounds more promising, do you mean from a profile view?

I've had big old woodies whose breast meat is a couple of inches thick, even an average must be over an inch :yp:

Other than headshots, the only place I shoot them is between the shoulder blades and they crumple instantly.

 

Cheers

 

Duncan

Edited November 18, 2010 by The Duncan