Floating Chamber Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Talking about 'taking the ****', if we DISTILLED the urine from pubs, we wouldn't need petrol! (but the Gov. wouldn't like that!!!!!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSPUK Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa You don't work from home by any chance do you ??-- just interested that's all dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune82 Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 A little heads up for anyone interested. Energy prices are going up, countries like China & India are consuming huge amounts and are also consuming huge amounts of concrete as their cities expand. Manufacturing concrete uses huge amounts of energy and produces huge amounts of waste heat. As global warming takes effect, combined with population growth, water conservation will also become massively important as will evaporation reduction from reservoirs. Have a look at Wasabi Energy as an investment. THIS COMPANY HAS MASSIVE POTENTIAL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune82 Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Unfortunately you need money to make money - you can't get into futures with thin air. Dave I agree but you dont need huge amounts. A few hundred and you can start making some nice profits which will build and build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa You don't work from home by any chance do you ??-- just interested that's all dave Yes I do but I see clients all over the north east. 2 years ago I was filling my truck twice a week at a monthly cost of £600 (at pump prices 2 years ago, that would now cost me £800.) I sat back and planned my diary more carefully, now I only fill the truck up, on average 3 times a month.... that saved me, at todays pump prices, approx £500.... my monthly fuel bill is now £300 on average as opposed to what would have been £800!!! Just by applying a little thhought to how I ran my business. I still see the same number of clients by the way and over the same geographical area. I do not however make pointless journeys like I used to. And... I didn't need to do this... I could have absorbed the rising costs but I chose not to.... When are the rest of us going to realise that things are definately not going to get any better? You all need to choose to do something about rising fuel prices... that is not lobbying the government, or going on strike, or blockading fuel depos or going on protest rallys or even bitching and moaning on forums.... you need to choose to look at your life-styles, stop taking things for granted and work out how YOU can reduce your fuel bills..... Absolutely no one else is going to do it for you.... and it's only going to get worse.... How high do prices have to rise before you 'choose' to get off your rumps and do something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa , sorry to pick on your post in return but spare me yours and your Grandads' opinions on how I should run my affairs I absolutely need no lecture off you about responsibility and about buying a bloody bike . Unless we move house we are stuck with shift work at 2 different places plus the matter of school transport . Do not attempt to lecture me on how many cars I ought to be running . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigstevouk Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa you seem to have it all worked out, you always seem to judge other people less fortunate than your self, you don't know them or there lifes! If they wanna sprout off about whats wrong with this and that so be it, maybe it makes some people feel better just getting it there chest..... Mind you halo don't slip and choke you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa , sorry to pick on your post in return but spare me yours and your Grandads' opinions on how I should run my affairs I absolutely need no lecture off you about responsibility and about buying a bloody bike . Unless we move house we are stuck with shift work at 2 different places plus the matter of school transport . Do not attempt to lecture me on how many cars I ought to be running . I'm not lecturing you Vole, just injecting a little reality into your life... and just pointing out that if the cost of running 2 cars is becoming too expensive then you simply cannot afford to run 2 cars.. It's economics! Shifts or not you could save on fuel, I guarantee it... you may feel uncomfortable about not having your 5 seat family car all to yourself on your journeys and I'm sure picking a few work colleagues up on the way will mean the 4 unused seats may wear slightly more. Public transport 'beneath you' is it at the end of the day, you are the only person who can reduce your fuel bill... Bitching about it on here won't lower the pump prices. They will soon be above 150p a litre and I absolutely guarantee you will never see them below that level again... (there is no limit whatsoever as to where they can go) get used to it and start making adjustments. Seroious question..... If pump prices hit £5 per litre could you run your 2 cars? If not what would you do about getting to work.... I'll tell you what, forget about them reaching £5 per litre (they will at some point anyway) Take your answer to the question and apply it to your lifestyle now... then you won't have to worry about how you are going to afford to run your 2 cars! As I said in my post, I was not picking on you specifically, your post just echoed that of so many others and just made me laugh.... We have all had it far too easy for the last 40 years and, it is with some sadness, I have to announce that normality is about to return....... The pain you are experiencing now will be nothing compared to what is in store further down the line, particularly for our children and grand children. Let's stop being selfish lulling them into this false sense of security bubble... It doesn't take mutch to make adjustments and give them at least some tools to deal with what they (and us) have to look forward to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 Vipa you seem to have it all worked out, you always seem to judge other people less fortunate than your self, you don't know them or there lifes! If they wanna sprout off about whats wrong with this and that so be it, maybe it makes some people feel better just getting it there chest..... Mind you halo don't slip and choke you I haven't got it all worked out and I don't ever remember judging anyone, let alone those less fortunate than me and I thought the whole purpose of a discussion board was to have a discussion If everyone shared the same view, there wouldn't be much point would there and then it would be called a lecture board! I can't afford to run 2 cars, I only have one, does that therefore make me less fortunate than Vole... As I have said in 2 posts now, I was not picking on Vole... I was picking on the hypocritical message within his post that unfortunately too many people echo... It reminds me a little of smokers (I was one once) that moan about the cost of fags.... simple... if you can't afford them stop smoking... if you can afford them... stop moaning! And trust me.... I ain't no angel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 You having a laugh ? I can only put this down to the weirdness and distortion that the Internet imparts on communication . Sure you mean well but it is just coming across at an attempt to wind me up and you have partly succeeded . No one ever talks to me in that manner in real life so lets drop it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cannon Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 When will the price increases stop? I can remember my dad driving past garages selling petrol at 74p per litre and saying it was too dear. Cheapest I ever remember seeing it was 67p per litre. I think the problem is largely based on the tax applied to fuel. Does anyone know the cost price of 1 ltr of petrol vs. the pump price? If the government took a hit on fuel taxes their tax income would probably increase due to increased spending elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 You having a laugh ? I can only put this down to the weirdness and distortion that the Internet imparts on communication . Sure you mean well but it is just coming across at an attempt to wind me up and you have partly succeeded . No one ever talks to me in that manner in real life so lets drop it . Talked to you like what? Have I insulted you, threatened you, raised my voice to you no... absolutely not, I have perhaps raised a few points that have touched a nerve? You are the one who posted saying you don't know where you are going to find the money to run your 2 cars if prices keep going up... well, I'm here to tell you, they are going up, fast and they ain't coming down... so... you either need to find more money or do something about your fuel consumption... This is not an insult my friend this is a view of reality and if you cannot see the hypocracy in your original post you are completely delusional! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune82 Posted March 5, 2011 Report Share Posted March 5, 2011 When will the price increases stop? I can remember my dad driving past garages selling petrol at 74p per litre and saying it was too dear. Cheapest I ever remember seeing it was 67p per litre. I think the problem is largely based on the tax applied to fuel. Does anyone know the cost price of 1 ltr of petrol vs. the pump price? If the government took a hit on fuel taxes their tax income would probably increase due to increased spending elsewhere. Of course the price is increasing. We have, at current estimates, around 40 years of oil left. China and India are using a lot more than they used to. Its only going one way. I reckon at the moment around 80 pence of a litre goes to the tax man. I doubt we will see a government U turn on fuel duty as they have the massive debt to pay left over from the thieving ******** of the previous government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) Of course the price is increasing. We have, at current estimates, around 40 years of oil left. China and India are using a lot more than they used to. Its only going one way. I reckon at the moment around 80 pence of a litre goes to the tax man. I doubt we will see a government U turn on fuel duty as they have the massive debt to pay left over from the thieving ******** of the previous government. Bang on Fortune... but it's not running out of oil that's the problem and unfortunately it's the governments and OPEC that have brainwashed the public into thinking that it is. The issue lies in the fact that as oil reserves dwindle supply becomes more difficult to maintain and starts to fall off, at the same time, global demand for oil continues to rise at an exponential rate, mainly now due to China and India becoming more and more dependant of the stuff and building industrial infrastructure that needs it. The combined effect of reducing supply and increasing demand is price rise... and probably dramatic price rise. Please don't be fooled into thinking the price of a barrel of crude as quoted on the markets is the actual cost of a barrel of crude! it isn't, that is a virtual number used in commodities trading. Think about it, let's say it costs BP $50 to extract a barrel of oil and then let's assume they bang on $10 as profit, they will then sell that oil for $60. If the markets collapse and a barrel is being traded at $10, it still costs BP $50 to get the stuff and they still need to make a profit so they will still sell it to the refiners for $60.... the 2 numbers do not correlate with each other in the real world. Edited March 6, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 Talked to you like what? Have I insulted you, threatened you, raised my voice to you no... absolutely not, I have perhaps raised a few points that have touched a nerve? You are the one who posted saying you don't know where you are going to find the money to run your 2 cars if prices keep going up... well, I'm here to tell you, they are going up, fast and they ain't coming down... so... you either need to find more money or do something about your fuel consumption... This is not an insult my friend this is a view of reality and if you cannot see the hypocracy in your original post you are completely delusional! Sorry mate , you are not very good at this are you ? You need to pick your targets carefully .Ones in a similar IQ bracket for starters and ones that actually give a s++* . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) Sorry mate , you are not very good at this are you ? You need to pick your targets carefully .Ones in a similar IQ bracket for starters and ones that actually give a s++* . I really have touched a nerve haven't I.... What are you trying to say? I have always found that those who resort to hurling insults when challenged or disagreed with tend not to be in the higher IQ brackets but, I'm sure you are correct, you know me so well, I'm sure you are far more educated and intelligent than me although, that being the case, I must say that I never did find arrogance an attractive quality in a man! For the record though anyone who posts this: "Is it only me but was anyone elses spirits lifted when the Treasury was getting its' windows smashed in ?" On a public forum (or any other kind for that matter!)....... Can't have much common sense, let alone much of an IQ! 'Power to the people eh Wolfie!?' Edited March 6, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacksdad Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) I have to buy diesel, fact. Like people on here who live on planet reality, I'm sick to death of the tree huggers and dreamers who say 'use public transport' and '2 cars? not needed!' How do you get home when your shift finishes at 3 am, your car sharing mate has got to stay longer or is off sick? Buses don't run after 11pm round here and none go to the biggest industrial state near me! How do I get my van full of tools and plumbing, tiling and bathroom fitting equipment on a bus or train? As many companies have gone to the wall, a lot of people have to travel further afield in order to stay in gainful employment: fuel price increases are just another kick in the teeth for such people, who are already struggling on less income than they were 5 years ago Unfortunately there will always be some smug, know-all smart@@@@ who knows better than everyone else Edited March 6, 2011 by jacksdad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 I have to buy diesel, fact. Like people on here who live on planet reality, I'm sick to death of the tree huggers and dreamers who say 'use public transport' and '2 cars? not needed!' How do you get home when your shift finishes at 3 am, your car sharing mate has got to stay longer or is off sick? Buses don't run after 11pm round here and none go to the biggest industrial state near me! How do I get my van full of tools and plumbing, tiling and bathroom fitting equipment on a bus or train? As many companies have gone to the wall, a lot of people have to travel further afield in order to stay in gainful employment: fuel price increases are just another kick in the teeth for such people, who are already struggling on less income than they were 5 years ago Unfortunately there will always be some smug, know-all smart@@@@ who knows better than everyone else Who?... Me?... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacksdad Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 Not naming anyone, I mean in general, in life, in the pub, everywhere! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) Not naming anyone, I mean in general, in life, in the pub, everywhere! I'm no tree hugging hippy, if I was I'd drive something that did more than 20 MPG :blink: I certainly don't claim to know all the answers but it is an absolute certainty that fuel prices are only going one way and they will do it at an ever faster rate... It doesn't seem like yesterday when I was paying 80-90p a litre! All I am saying is, it's only going to get worse and the only thing any of us can do to reduce our fuel costs, or even make it affordable at all in some cases, is to see how we, as individuals can make adjustments to minimise the impact. I hear what you are saying about tools & vans etc... But there will come a time, far sooner than any of us want to imagine, when the cost of fuel will make only emergency journeys viable and where the average joe will not be able to afford the cost to use a car, just for him or her self to get to the office. At that point there may be a questionmark over the viability of owning a car full stop! (no point owning a gun if you can't afford the ammunition!) and it is then we are forced to re-evaluate how we live our lives... Personally, I would much prefer to make decisions myself and, at least in some part, be in control of how the change is managed rather than having change abruptly forced upon me! An interesting documentary, for anyone interested, is "The Power of Community - How Cuba Survived Peak Oil." Whilst Cuba didn't actually experience it's own 'Peak Oil' event, US oil embargos effectively removed oil and therefore fuel from the day to day lives of the Cubans... The effects were far reaching and immediately painful but, importantly, not insurmountable. Cuba had to change very quickly as the situation was forced upon them over a very short period of time and they now have a thriving society that doesn't depend on fossil fuels. We, on the other hand have and have had, much, much longer to come to terms with the ongoing and worsening supply & demand issues of oil. What have we done about it? Absolutely nothing... most of us (me included) go about our daily lives in blissful ignorance of what's happening around us and I fear we are in for a VERY painful shock.... VERY soon! It's a little like the old frog in boiling water experiment... drop a frog into hot water and he'll jump right back out. Put him in cold water though and slowly increase the heat and that frog will just sit there and eventually boil to death.... Sadly, western society is a little like the frog in cold water... by the time we realise it's so hot that it will hurt us, it will be waaaaay too late to do anything about it! Complacency.... man's worst enemy! Edited March 6, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacksdad Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 If only things were so cut and dried..some people NEED a car or even 2 cars to get to work and ferry kids etc. to and fro. The last job I had, a few years ago, was 3 miles from home, then the firm relocated to 27 miles away. The only way to get there was by car, on the motorway. None of my mates were put on the same shifts as me, I just had to drive there on my own, so I went from 6 miles a day to 54 with no wage rise, today that would cost me another £62 per week But it was that or the dole, luckily I had the ability and courage to set up on my own, but its not easy and most people wouldn't be able to, so they end up working more hours if available, to earn the same or less than years ago.....it it a fact and no planning or good ideas can alter that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 (edited) If only things were so cut and dried..some people NEED a car or even 2 cars to get to work and ferry kids etc. to and fro. The last job I had, a few years ago, was 3 miles from home, then the firm relocated to 27 miles away. The only way to get there was by car, on the motorway. None of my mates were put on the same shifts as me, I just had to drive there on my own, so I went from 6 miles a day to 54 with no wage rise, today that would cost me another £62 per week But it was that or the dole, luckily I had the ability and courage to set up on my own, but its not easy and most people wouldn't be able to, so they end up working more hours if available, to earn the same or less than years ago.....it it a fact and no planning or good ideas can alter that! I hear ya but what happens when filling the tank of your car takes 90% of your wage? The fact you NEED 2 cars won't stand for diddley squat if it comes down to a choice between filling them with juice and feeding your family (and I know, feeding your family may rely on using the car but at some point the cost will make it impossible!) At the end of the day, with some exceptions, cars are a luxury, not a necessity. Water is a necessity, food is a necessity... Yes, getting to and from work is a necessity but one that can be accomplished by other means, albeit quite probably less comfortable & convenient. Sadly though, we are addicted to oil and addicted to our cars... this will change... it has to change! That change will be (is being... right now) forced upon us and, as a society it will be the most painful upheavil we have ever experienced. This is actually more clear cut than you think! Fuel prices will continue to rise (oil is a finite resource and there is no real alternative in the offing.) The question is at what point will attitudes start moving from bemoaning the situation to realising they have to do something about it to survive? At some point, be it £2 per litre, £5, £10, £20...... £100... (At some point in the future, all these price points will be breached, and probably more) will we as a society start to relise that we need to change the way we live if we want to prevail... At some point we have to take our heads out of the sand and take a look around... It will be interesting though to see just how bad things get before we do! Edited March 6, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 we do what we normaly do, let the goverment walk all over us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 we do what we normaly do, let the goverment walk all over us. Oh for god's sake... this is nothing to do with governments walking all over us.... the oil is running out... it will not last forever.. there is no alternative... get used to it. in the last 10 years pump prices have risen from around 70p a litre to almost (and soon to be) 150p. That's an 80p rise.... the total amount of duty and VAT charged on fuel. If the gov't scrapped tax on fuel completely, apart from the fact the country would be bankrupt within 3 months, prices would soon be back up to 150p a litre. As the price is increasing on a faster and faster curve, unless there is more unrest in the middle east, it would happen in about 5 years... This is the future... stop blaming the governments and start realising IT IS RUNNING OUT... IT IS VERY SIMPLE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacksdad Posted March 6, 2011 Report Share Posted March 6, 2011 I've learnt how to make bio diesel Now the main problem is getting waste veg oil, as most food outlets etc. get about 50p litre from the recycling companies. I used to get a couple of gallons a week of a burger van, but he has given up as not enough people in work around his pitch! If I buy waste oil I then need Ethanol, caustic soda, gas for the heaters, containers, testing kit, plus time and effort: not viable any more And, I've had to give up my workshop, as the rent has gone up again and I cannot keep absorbing all these costs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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