fenboy Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 (edited) I had a day yesterday where thing really did not go as planned I have been watching good numbers of pigeon for the last few days going across my permission to feed elsewhere and then returning to a well used sitty tree,so I though I would try and decoy them onto some wheat under the flight line, I had the perfect hide set up which blended in perfect a dozen dead birds on cradles for decoys and one on the flapper and as it was very windy another on a floater. Just got myself in the hide and in came the first one perfect got him and four more in the next 15 mins so 5 for 5 great I thought I am on for a good day from then on they hardy commited to the pattern at all and I shot like stevie wonder ! ended up with 18 in four hours for around 40 shots ,not bad you may think at a little worse than 2 for one but to be honest I know I can do better indeed I once shot 97 in a hour and half for 112 shots, the difference being I at that time had my beloved winchester 101 (RIP ) I am now using a beretta 391 auto and I am just not gettin the same results I took it for fitting and was told its fine but my shooting has gone to pot, I dont know if its because I dont go as often as I once did or the fact I have only had chances for a few birds here and there rather than really getting stuck into some but its playing with my head now :wacko: Edited May 10, 2011 by fenboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Why not take the beretta down to your local Clay Ground and have a few rounds of sporting clays, perhaps its just that you need some practise with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon123 Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Why not take the beretta down to your local Clay Ground and have a few rounds of sporting clays, perhaps its just that you need some practise with it. Totally agree with 'Cranfield' on this one as it must be well worth a try ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Just because a gun fits you it doesn`t necessarily mean you`ll hit well with it. Fit in essence means that the gun throws where you want and doesn`t smack you, but you still need to gel with a gun for best results. I can`t shoot semi auto`s as well as O/U`s either. Having said all that your ratio is not that bad at all given the wind and maybe you just shot as you should to begin with but got a little over excited as things hotted up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 (edited) I have had a few rounds of clays with it and the results were indifferent on those as well,as for getting over excited I would not really think that is the case I have been shooting pigeons for the best part of 30 years now, I have had the auto a year now and really am losing confidence that I will ever shoot it to my best,in fact I have stuck it in the wanted section now for a swap with a over/under I think its got to go ! Edited May 10, 2011 by fenboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 You handle the excitement better than me then , the thing is to keep looking untill you bump into the right gun, it will happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Getting too excited can be a cause for erratic shooting, but frustration is the most common cause. Whatever the sport, often the harder you try the worse you get, ask any golfers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosd Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 (edited) Not trying to teach you how to suck eggs but are the two guns choked the same? Have you changed cartridges, cartridge weight? Is it possible that you are using the same cartidge but the two guns throw a different pattern? Just a thought even though one in two is not a bad ratio on live quary! Edited May 10, 2011 by Cosd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudpatten Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 You really do need to go to a good shooting instructor who will sort out a whole raft of issues, including eye dominance which can creep up on you as you get older, and correct gun fit. Not least will he also sort out your shooting style. A correctly fitted gun is only part of the solution. It`s no good on its own if you keep pointing it in the wrong place which you patently do! It is`nt cheap but I`d been shooting indifferently for 15 years before I went. The results were a revelation.I`m still not the worlds best shot but I do at least know where and why I missed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Not trying to teach you how to suck eggs but are the two guns choked the same? Have you changed cartridges, cartridge weight? Is it possible that you are using the same cartidge but the two guns throw a different pattern? Just a thought even though one in two is not a bad ratio on live quary! Yes I used to shoot imp cylinder and half mostly in my 101 now use either 1/4 0r 1/2 usually. As for cartridges I was and still am one of those who would happily shoot anything within reason i am using a decent cartrige at the moment (winchester 30gram 6.5 shot). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Essex Hunter Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Why not take the beretta down to your local Clay Ground and have a few rounds of sporting clays, perhaps its just that you need some practise with it. Since when does a clay pigeon fly like a real one! If you have to go to a clay ground, consider getting on a flush rather than a target that will come out the same nearly every time. With a good flush, it you will get you swinging at targets as close as you can to pigeons that are diving in and out of your pattern. 17yrs ago, I had a 28" Spanish O/U before my Browning 325 and it took me a good year to feel comfortable with it. Give it time there is no quick fix, like lots of sports (as I have said before) you have to be comfortable, just look at all sports people the make sure they are ready before they commit to a shot etc. TEH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 You really do need to go to a good shooting instructor who will sort out a whole raft of issues, including eye dominance which can creep up on you as you get older, and correct gun fit. Not least will he also sort out your shooting style. A correctly fitted gun is only part of the solution. It`s no good on its own if you keep pointing it in the wrong place which you patently do! It is`nt cheap but I`d been shooting indifferently for 15 years before I went. The results were a revelation.I`m still not the worlds best shot but I do at least know where and why I missed. Its not eye dominace as I do and always have shot with one closed ,I know you shouldnt but its always worked well enough for me, I have had several guns over the years baikals, berettas,miroku,winchester etc and shot very well with them all,two different gunsmiths says it fits fine,without trying to sound like I am blowing my own trumpet i always considered myself to be a excellent shot and cant really understand why I have gone from such to so,so unless its the gun/gun fit perhaps if I decide to persevere I will get a third opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted May 10, 2011 Report Share Posted May 10, 2011 Since when does a clay pigeon fly like a real one! If you have to go to a clay ground, consider getting on a flush rather than a target that will come out the same nearly every time. With a good flush, it you will get you swinging at targets as close as you can to pigeons that are diving in and out of your pattern. 17yrs ago, I had a 28" Spanish O/U before my Browning 325 and it took me a good year to feel comfortable with it. Give it time there is no quick fix, like lots of sports (as I have said before) you have to be comfortable, just look at all sports people the make sure they are ready before they commit to a shot etc. TEH At the various Clay Grounds I go to the sporting layouts give you at least two different targets a stand. A round is going to be at least 5, possible 10 stands, so that is at least 10 to 20, possibly 30 targets. Quite a variety. A flush is a good idea as well, if you can find a Clay Ground that lays one on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudpatten Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I understand what you`re saying about eye dominance, it was just a suggestion about one of the component parts that go to making a good shot. Like you, I shoot with one eye closed so I don`t think that that is the root of your problem either. With the greatset of respect, regarding gun fit. If you are completely satisfied that the two gunsmiths who examined your gun for fit are in fact qualified to give you a technical opinion, then so be it. It really does not follow that the bloke behind the counter in the gun shop is always an expert on fit. The stock dimensions of the guns that you describe are radically different and although you made them fit you, it is a physical impossibility that they all actually fitted you, despite what the bloke in the gunshop said. The main thing I found with a good instructor is the insight it gives you into the mechanics of any given shooting style. Understanding why you miss is as important as knowing how you hit the target. I used to think I was a reasonable shot until I realised that perhaps I was`nt if I could`nt diagnose why I was constantly missing, and correct it. Bite the bullet mate. Go and see a good coach. Respectfully,until you do that you are just faffing about and won`t solve the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairman Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I had a day yesterday where thing really did not go as planned I have been watching good numbers of pigeon for the last few days going across my permission to feed elsewhere and then returning to a well used sitty tree,so I though I would try and decoy them onto some wheat under the flight line, I had the perfect hide set up which blended in perfect a dozen dead birds on cradles for decoys and one on the flapper and as it was very windy another on a floater. Just got myself in the hide and in came the first one perfect got him and four more in the next 15 mins so 5 for 5 great I thought I am on for a good day from then on they hardy commited to the pattern at all and I shot like stevie wonder ! ended up with 18 in four hours for around 40 shots ,not bad you may think at a little worse than 2 for one but to be honest I know I can do better indeed I once shot 97 in a hour and half for 112 shots, the difference being I at that time had my beloved winchester 101 (RIP ) I am now using a beretta 391 auto and I am just not gettin the same results I took it for fitting and was told its fine but my shooting has gone to pot, I dont know if its because I dont go as often as I once did or the fact I have only had chances for a few birds here and there rather than really getting stuck into some but its playing with my head now :wacko: I am considered to be a good shot on both clays and pigeons and went through the same or similar situation as you. I have a number of different guns in semi auto, o/u and side by side and all shoot and handle different. As you say you are happy with the gun fit ect, try the following, Weigh your 391 and compare it to the weight of your winchester and I bet that there is considerable difference. This would mean that your swing speed will be effected and will cause you to either shoot behind or as in my case with a 391, in front. If the barrel length is different, this will also have an effect. Shooting at clays may help with swing speed but only if you treat the clay as a snap shot and look away until the last second then mount and shoot like you would expect to shoot at a pigeon. Get someone who is also a good shot to stand behind you as you shoot this method and if you are missing, they should be able by looking along your gun barrel as you fire, see the point in relation to the clay that you are shooting at. As I own a clay club, I can tell you that you are not the only one to have had this problem and you should find that once you get your swing sorted, things will fall into place. I have just looked at the weight of the two guns and depending upon model, there could be a difference of almost one pound with the 391 being lighter. Lighter gun, less effort required to swing so faster swing so shooting forward of target. Regards Chairman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Thanks for all the advise offered,yes the beretta auto is lighter than the 101 I had even though the winchester was the xtra light version. I guess I will persevere for a while and see if we gel together I have shot ok ish with it in spurts just not consistant, if that fails then I will look at seeing a coach or getting rid of it !. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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