Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) Irun a small shoot with a few mates we put a few birds down, some go in a wood which on one side of i dont have the shooting rights but i have permission to stand guns on, last night we were finishing up feeding when we heard someone shooting it actually sounded like he was in the wood. but he said he wasnt but he was shooting birds going to roost in the trees overhanging the field, he told us he was doing vermin control for the farmer on a stubble field in the dark ! sound like a likely story. i think he was poaching what do you think ? Edited October 31, 2011 by Flashgun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako751sg Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Due to the lack of facts in your post,im not going to think about it anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 If he's on land he has permission on it doesn't matter what's growing in it (or not, ie stubble) or what time of day or night it is. As long as he's shooting on his permission with birds landing on his permission he has every right to do so. It's not morally right and it's not really the done thing to shoot other peoples game but it's not poaching either imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 If he's on land he has permission on it doesn't matter what's growing in it (or not, ie stubble) or what time of day or night it is. As long as he's shooting on his permission with birds landing on his permission he has every right to do so. It's not morally right and it's not really the done thing to shoot other peoples game but it's not poaching either imo. I agree with this too. If every single one of your birds entered his permission, he has legal right to shoot every one of them, if he wishes to do so! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I agree with this too. If every single one of your birds entered his permission, he has legal right to shoot every one of them, if he wishes to do so! he was on his permission shooting my birds out of my trees! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docholiday Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 so he was on his ground shooting across his/your border at birds, (not yours I am afraid they are wild) which were on your side of the boundary ?? have I got it correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 (edited) he was on his permission shooting my birds out of my trees! Sorry mate but if those trees overhang a field he's got the shooting rights on then, like it or not, he's well within his rights to shoot them! Edited October 31, 2011 by carpentermark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako751sg Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 he was on his permission shooting my birds out of my trees! No he wasnt.He was shooting birds going in to roost in your trees,but on his land and he told you this is.You only think he wasnt,which isnt good enough.All in all,i think this story is an unlikely one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 so he was on his ground shooting across his/your border at birds, (not yours I am afraid they are wild) which were on your side of the boundary ?? have I got it correct thats correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 No he wasnt.He was shooting birds going in to roost in your trees,but on his land and he told you this is.You only think he wasnt,which isnt good enough.All in all,i think this story is an unlikely one. thats funny didnt think you were going to comment anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I think you should go back and punctuate and paragraph your first post, to make it easier to read. As it stands it doesnt really make much sense. Sako has a point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I can solve this right now.... You asked if he was poaching??? 1. Was he on your land? 2. Was he shooting over your land? 3. Did the birds he shot fall on to your land? 4. Did he cross your land whilst armed? 5. Was he shooting game out of season? 6. Was he using an artificial light source to shoot birds at night? 7. Did he have permission to shoot on the land he was shooting? If the answer to the first 6 is 'NO' then he WAS NOT poaching! For what it's worth i think he's bang out of order shooting your birds, but if we start calling people poachers when they're not then we might as well join the anti brigade or become police men!!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheasant Feeder Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Firstly even though you may have released the birds, if they are on his land then they are his birds. Secondly if he is stood on his land and so long as his shot falls within the boundary of his land then he has not commited the offence of armed trespass. As I understand it the only claim you have to the birds at the time of him shooting them are that they are roosting in trees, whose trunks are on your land but the branches are over your neighbours land. The only offence which may have been commited is taking game at night. Night poaching Under the Night Poaching Act 1828 it is an offence at night to unlawfully take or destroy any game or rabbits on any land, open or enclosed, this includes public roads, paths and verges. Night is one hour after sunset to one hour before sunrise. It is an offence to enter or be on any land, with any gun, net engine (snare) or other instrument (lamp, slip lead) for the purpose of taking game. The use of a light to take game birds is an offence under section 5 of the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981. Anyone found committing night poaching may be arrested by the owner or occupier, their gamekeepers or servants or person assisting them, on the land or adjoining highway, road or path, and a police officer. I'm not sure if the above includes land where he has permission to be as it does state 'any land'. Or if the time of the incident was more than an hour after sunset, or if any lamp was used. Not very neighbourly behavoir I admit, but as poaching is a criminal offence I suspect there may be no offence commited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highseas Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 in my mystic chrystal ball i see 5 pages or a locked topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 he's illegally discharging a weapon over your land then. he would also fall foul of shooting game birds if he only had vermin permission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Okay i take on booard all of your comments , i have resolved the problem i spoke to the land owner this evening and it is now sorted. thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Joe Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Okay i take on booard all of your comments , i have resolved the problem i spoke to the land owner this evening and it is now sorted. thank you. So what was the outcome then..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 He only had permission to shoot pigeons off a crop and he had no reason to be there as it was only a stubble field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 he's illegally discharging a weapon over your land then. he would also fall foul of shooting game birds if he only had vermin permission That would surely be an issue between the shooter and the farmer issuing permission, nothing to do with gamekeeper?! Im not trying to be arguementative its just things like this p-sses me off, its hard enough getting permission, keeping permission and staying the right side of the LAW as it is without the shooting community making there own laws or interpreting them as they choose when it suits!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 He only had permission to shoot pigeons off a crop and he had no reason to be there as it was only a stubble field. Dont agree? im sure the farmer has given him permission to shoot pigeons and protect crops. Ive been shooting pigeons over stubble for the past few months and i have EVERY reason to be there because crops or not the pigeons you shoot would be the same pigeons eating the crops when sown, therefore you ARE still protecting crops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 That would surely be an issue between the shooter and the farmer issuing permission, nothing to do with gamekeeper?! Im not trying to be arguementative its just things like this p-sses me off, its hard enough getting permission, keeping permission and staying the right side of the LAW as it is without the shooting community making there own laws or interpreting them as they choose when it suits!! i was just asking the forum what they thought i was not making my own laws or interpreting them so get a life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardo Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 why ever not? if Flashgun has an understanding with the farmer and then someone with vermin permission starts shooting the game birds he's put down, he has every right to be annoyed. strictly speaking it's a legal issue anyway - if he only has vermin rights and is shooting game, then he's poaching (it may not be on Flashgun's land, but he's poaching from the farmer). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashgun Posted October 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Like i said problem is resolved end of. thanks .end of post. why ever not? if Flashgun has an understanding with the farmer and then someone with vermin permission starts shooting the game birds he's put down, he has every right to be annoyed. strictly speaking it's a legal issue anyway - if he only has vermin rights and is shooting game, then he's poaching (it may not be on Flashgun's land, but he's poaching from the farmer). Thank you nick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpentermark Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 i was just asking the forum what they thought i was not making my own laws or interpreting them so get a life. "get a life"........... Nice one!!! Just watch who you call a poacher, it's talk like that, that gets certificates revoked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark g Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 I can solve this right now.... You asked if he was poaching??? 1. Was he on your land? 2. Was he shooting over your land? 3. Did the birds he shot fall on to your land? 4. Did he cross your land whilst armed? 5. Was he shooting game out of season? 6. Was he using an artificial light source to shoot birds at night? 7. Did he have permission to shoot on the land he was shooting? If the answer to the first 6 is 'NO' then he WAS NOT poaching! For what it's worth i think he's bang out of order shooting your birds, but if we start calling people poachers when they're not then we might as well join the anti brigade or become police men!!!!!!!!! we have a similar situation on 2 of our boundaries and funnily enough both of the legal poachers are former policemen, i see them as just another pain in the ****, thankfully they work public sector hours and someone is usually up and dogged in before the smart ***** think about getting out of thier pit no contest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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