southrop Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Interested to hear views on how shooters prefer POI set-up for sporting, 50:50, 60:40 or other or is the concensus there is no concensus because it does'nt really matter too much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beretta Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 your choice so long as you know where it is. if you only shoot with one eye open dont go 50/50 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 So little between the two don't bother about it, shoot a couple straight incomers and trap birds with full- soon tells you where the centre of the pattern is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southrop Posted January 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Would you recommend shooting clays rather than using a pattern plate to check poi? If so, why is that? Tx for replies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Fit wise 99% of the time a plate is a waste of time, as you can pretty much make the gun do what you want. Shotguns are designed to be swung and shot, and as such I always set guns up on a straight trap bird and a mid range, say 40 yard hanging teal type target. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southrop Posted January 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Interesting, tx Ed. I think you are right. Pattern plates can cause all sorts of non-problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COACH Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Yep! I'm with Ed on this one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southrop Posted January 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 But you can simulate a going away trap bird on a plate and it is maybe more consistent? If you mount on a mark on the plate from say 25 yds from a gun down position and fire immediately the gun is mounted is that not the same as shooting a going away trap target? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 Still not the same as swinging and shooting at a clay. I shot a pattern plate years ago when I had the new chokes made for my gun. Pattern looked good and that was all I would ever want to use one for. For me, setting up is best done on clays by far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 (edited) The vast majority of people shoot sporters which have that classic, almost visual, drop at comb, these usually produce a sight picture almost devoid of any rib at all. A dead flat shooting gun coupled to a low rib sight pic can spell trouble. This is because even experience shooters will inevitably head lift to get a better view of the bird which is bad news. My thoughts are that you're better off with a little rib ( a lot in my case) and a 40/60, as Ed and others have implied the pattern plate can tell a different story to that of your scores. Edited January 11, 2012 by Hamster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southrop Posted January 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 with an adjustable rib you can still shoot 50:50 ie flat with a figure 8 sight picture. I was interested in PW'ers preferences for flat or higher shooting guns for sporting. As I see it, a gun that shoots 50:50 means you have to cover the bird with the bead, rather than float it on the bead with 60:40 to centre the pattern. Whilst as Ed suggests there is not a lot of difference between the two, I think your actually shooting technique will determine what is best for you, ie if you are an instinctive type shot stick to 60:40 and if you are more of a 'precise' shot 50:50 might be ok, horses for courses I think. Take the point on the pattern plate though as not good for gun fitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobSki Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 with an adjustable rib you can still shoot 50:50 ie flat with a figure 8 sight picture. I was interested in PW'ers preferences for flat or higher shooting guns for sporting. As I see it, a gun that shoots 50:50 means you have to cover the bird with the bead, rather than float it on the bead with 60:40 to centre the pattern. Whilst as Ed suggests there is not a lot of difference between the two, I think your actually shooting technique will determine what is best for you, ie if you are an instinctive type shot stick to 60:40 and if you are more of a 'precise' shot 50:50 might be ok, horses for courses I think. Take the point on the pattern plate though as not good for gun fitting. I am a returning clay shooter. I am by no means experienced as I only shot local, non competition stuff before I stopped and have just decided to return to the discipline. I have just bought a new DT10 and after doing so, decided I would get some instruction/help from a coach. I was taken to a pattern plate where shots were fired and adjustments made to the combe of the gun until the pattern was centred on the image and roughly 60/40 above/below the image. What I did notice was recoil. Before any adjustments to the gun were made, I was kicked quite hard on the cheek bone. After the work on the pattern plate, the felt recoil on my face was very much less infact I would say non existent. BUT the recoil always felt harsher when shooting the pattern plate than it did when shooting clays. This is the bit I can't understand and why I have bothered you all with this post. Why would shooting a clay from both gun down or pre-mounted positions produce less felt recoil than when shooting at the pattern plate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emmsy Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 because your always moving when shooting a clay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted January 14, 2012 Report Share Posted January 14, 2012 Also recoil is worse when your expecting it if you want to check a gun works or similar and let one off at sky intentionally if chiffon hurts! Do the same at a clay it doesn't! All in the mind? 60:40 can help unless you shoot alot of dropping incomers you have a fair margin for error working on 30" spread at desired range that's 2 whole clays in every direction at 50:50 Over simplified I know but how the hell can you miss with that I think missing is more of a skill just look at the top shots they can't miss for toffee! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 15, 2012 Report Share Posted January 15, 2012 (edited) BUT the recoil always felt harsher when shooting the pattern plate than it did when shooting clays. This is the bit I can't understand and why I have bothered you all with this post. Why would shooting a clay from both gun down or pre-mounted positions produce less felt recoil than when shooting at the pattern plate This is a well documented and well understood phenomenon actually. Pattern shooting is usually done in a very deliberate rifle style format, you are aware of exactly the moment you pull the trigger and also where you're aiming. Having fired your focus is not diverted onto the other clay either . Shooting moving targets takes a lot of your conscious mental effort away as you're concentrating on hitting hopefully two targets one after the other. The task doesn't end even if you hit them as often your sub conscious is looking at the pieces for useful information to carry forward onto the next pair. Even watching the smoke from successful shots can divert attention away from the recoil. You may find that even the noise seems harsher when shooting statically. Edited January 15, 2012 by Hamster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southrop Posted January 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2012 HDAV, does my hypothesis that 50:50 suits more deliberate Shooters and 60:40 more instinctive sound right. Don't want to "over think" the subject but the idea just interests me. If you have floated the clay above the barrel for years ala 60:40 moving to 50:50 is tricky as you need to blot out the clay to centre it. Take your point though about the forgiving nature of the pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted January 15, 2012 Report Share Posted January 15, 2012 HDAV, does my hypothesis that 50:50 suits more deliberate shooters and 60:40 more instinctive sound right. I dont think so the reason for high patterning guns is to give clear view of the target Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobSki Posted January 15, 2012 Report Share Posted January 15, 2012 Thanks for your replies chaps, much appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COACH Posted January 16, 2012 Report Share Posted January 16, 2012 This is a well documented and well understood phenomenon actually. Pattern shooting is usually done in a very deliberate rifle style format, you are aware of exactly the moment you pull the trigger and also where you're aiming. Having fired your focus is not diverted onto the other clay either . Shooting moving targets takes a lot of your conscious mental effort away as you're concentrating on hitting hopefully two targets one after the other. The task doesn't end even if you hit them as often your sub conscious is looking at the pieces for useful information to carry forward onto the next pair. Even watching the smoke from successful shots can divert attention away from the recoil. You may find that even the noise seems harsher when shooting statically. Yep! absolutely. Also of course the adjustment on the comb could of been made so that you had a little less drop at the heel...or back end of the adjuster which will also affect the recoil. Maybe even a bit of cast adjustment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 i use plates for patterns and to see if the gun shoots straight. it can bring up some unusual things, a gun i have seen has a bent barrel, it has been well and truely bent, but, it shoots spot on, if you didnt know it was bent, it would take you a while to figure its been bent to shoot straight. after that, an array of targets, from straight away. straight incomers for poi issues, then left to rights, but those arnt totally nessasary... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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