12borejimbo Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 Does he sell spam too. What an earth does that mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 (edited) I will explain what both supplements do and how they affect you, I will also try and stamp out any rubbish your friends have told you! Most people that supplement their body’s have little or no idea how it affects you and end up wasting their money. I will try to help you out on this one. For you and most likely your friends, Creatine Phosphate will do nothing, but have a placebo effect. If you feel it will help you out then take it, if you want to take it because you feel it will actually have an effect on your body then don't waste your money. Creatine phosphate simply helps replenish your own creatine stores when you train (we have a small reserve stored in our cells). When we exercise the myosin and actin (rachet like system of micro fibres deep inside the muscle) contract to shorten the muscle in the presents of ATP - Adenosine triphosphate and calcium. When ATP is used for energy it gets broken down into ADP - Adonsine diphosphate- a useless waste product that can't be stored or used for energy, this is where creatine comes in... Creatine lends one of it's phosphate atoms which quickly binds to the ADP to create ATP and gets resynthesized back into a useable compound for energy. Now this sounds super dooper useful, but really unless you are a top athlete where every millisecond counts and you need every legal advantage over your opponents then your wasting your time and money. If how ever, your diet is perfect to the calorie, your rest is perfect to the second every set and every workout, you are constantly overloading your muscles / anaerobic energy system, your sleep cycles are perfect to the 1/4 hour, if your workouts are constantly regular and you have been training for a long time and train correctly then you may see a slight advantage in recovery periods and a slight increase in strength gain (1 extra rep or help doing your 1 RM). Back to you, creatine will have next to no effect in your circumstance. On to protein, It's a useful supplement which won't just "repair your muscles and make-em huge". Protein also helps to keep your blood glucose levels high throughout the day (ones that contain carbs as well as protein that is). If blood sugar levels drop because your muscles are using the energy and have run out of muscle glucose stores from a poor diet low in cards, your pancreases releases a hormone Glucagon to maintain homeostasis within the blood. Your body will do this because the only macronutrient your brain can use to function is blood glucose and clearly a necessity for your brain to keep working... If this is the case and blood glucose levels are low your liver will break down lean muscle tissue, convert it into glucose and put it back in your blood basically cannibalising your own muscle for energy (muscular atrophy). This is why diet is far more important that a supplement. Not only this, but this process is known as ketosis producing ketones in the blood stream, this is extremely acidic and can lead to further complications. It shouldn’t be used as a meal replacement more to supplement a perfect diet. I go back to my first point if everything to do with your training and rest isn't perfect, you are simply wasting your time and money. Hope that helps. Edited May 21, 2012 by Spara Dritto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0850 Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 I will explain what both supplements do and how they affect you, I will also try and stamp out any rubbish your friends have told you! Most people that supplement their body’s have little or no idea how it affects you and end up wasting their money. I will try to help you out on this one. For you and most likely your friends, Creatine Phosphate will do nothing, but have a placebo effect. If you feel it will help you out then take it, if you want to take it because you feel it will actually have an effect on your body then don't waste your money. Creatine phosphate simply helps replenish your own creatine stores when you train (we have a small reserve stored in our cells). When we exercise the myosin and actin (rachet like system of micro fibres deep inside the muscle) contract to shorten the muscle in the presents of ATP - Adenosine triphosphate and calcium. When ATP is used for energy it gets broken down into ADP - Adonsine diphosphate- a useless waste product that can't be stored or used for energy, this is where creatine comes in... Creatine lends one of it's phosphate atoms which quickly binds to the ADP to create ATP and gets resynthesized back into a useable compound for energy. Now this sounds super dooper useful, but really unless you are a top athlete where every millisecond counts and you need every legal advantage over your opponents then your wasting your time and money. If how ever, your diet is perfect to the calorie, your rest is perfect to the second every set and every workout, you are constantly overloading your muscles / anaerobic energy system, your sleep cycles are perfect to the 1/4 hour, if your workouts are constantly regular and you have been training for a long time and train correctly then you may see a slight advantage in recovery periods and a slight increase in strength gain (1 extra rep or help doing your 1 RM). Back to you, creatine will have next to no effect in your circumstance. On to protein, It's a useful supplement which won't just "repair your muscles and make-em huge". Protein also helps to keep your blood glucose levels high throughout the day (ones that contain carbs as well as protein that is). If blood sugar levels drop because your muscles are using the energy and have run out of muscle glucose stores from a poor diet low in cards, your pancreases releases a hormone Glucagon to maintain homeostasis within the blood. Your body will do this because the only macronutrient your brain can use to function is blood glucose and clearly a necessity for your brain to keep working... If this is the case and blood glucose levels are low your liver will break down lean muscle tissue, convert it into glucose and put it back in your blood basically cannibalising your own muscle for energy (muscular atrophy). This is why diet is far more important that a supplement. Not only this, but this process is known as ketosis producing ketones in the blood stream, this is extremely acidic and can lead to further complications. It shouldn’t be used as a meal replacement more to supplement a perfect diet. I go back to my first point if everything to do with your training and rest isn't perfect, you are simply wasting your time and money. Hope that helps. Possibly one of the most comprehensive and sensible replies I've seen on this subject! Both on here and also in sport forums I frequent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 Take some medical advice chap, as things like that can cause elevated cholesterol and triglyceride levels (the latter can be nasty even if you're young). I was sitting next to a bodybuilder in a waiting room this very day who had this identical issue due to an excessive protein intake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 I will explain what both supplements do and how they affect you, I will also try and stamp out any rubbish your friends have told you! Most people that supplement their body’s have little or no idea how it affects you and end up wasting their money. I will try to help you out on this one. For you and most likely your friends, Creatine Phosphate will do nothing, but have a placebo effect. If you feel it will help you out then take it, if you want to take it because you feel it will actually have an effect on your body then don't waste your money. Creatine phosphate simply helps replenish your own creatine stores when you train (we have a small reserve stored in our cells). When we exercise the myosin and actin (rachet like system of micro fibres deep inside the muscle) contract to shorten the muscle in the presents of ATP - Adenosine triphosphate and calcium. When ATP is used for energy it gets broken down into ADP - Adonsine diphosphate- a useless waste product that can't be stored or used for energy, this is where creatine comes in... Creatine lends one of it's phosphate atoms which quickly binds to the ADP to create ATP and gets resynthesized back into a useable compound for energy. Now this sounds super dooper useful, but really unless you are a top athlete where every millisecond counts and you need every legal advantage over your opponents then your wasting your time and money. If how ever, your diet is perfect to the calorie, your rest is perfect to the second every set and every workout, you are constantly overloading your muscles / anaerobic energy system, your sleep cycles are perfect to the 1/4 hour, if your workouts are constantly regular and you have been training for a long time and train correctly then you may see a slight advantage in recovery periods and a slight increase in strength gain (1 extra rep or help doing your 1 RM). Back to you, creatine will have next to no effect in your circumstance. On to protein, It's a useful supplement which won't just "repair your muscles and make-em huge". Protein also helps to keep your blood glucose levels high throughout the day (ones that contain carbs as well as protein that is). If blood sugar levels drop because your muscles are using the energy and have run out of muscle glucose stores from a poor diet low in cards, your pancreases releases a hormone Glucagon to maintain homeostasis within the blood. Your body will do this because the only macronutrient your brain can use to function is blood glucose and clearly a necessity for your brain to keep working... If this is the case and blood glucose levels are low your liver will break down lean muscle tissue, convert it into glucose and put it back in your blood basically cannibalising your own muscle for energy (muscular atrophy). This is why diet is far more important that a supplement. Not only this, but this process is known as ketosis producing ketones in the blood stream, this is extremely acidic and can lead to further complications. It shouldn’t be used as a meal replacement more to supplement a perfect diet. I go back to my first point if everything to do with your training and rest isn't perfect, you are simply wasting your time and money. Hope that helps. Text book perfect bang on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulr5604 Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 PHD stuff is pretty good stuff certainly much more palatable than most. I would agree it was my preferred supplement when I used to do weight training have a look at www.bodyactiveonline.co.uk some good deals and 90% of the time it gets delivered next day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silpig5 Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 I will explain what both supplements do and how they affect you, I will also try and stamp out any rubbish your friends have told you! Most people that supplement their body’s have little or no idea how it affects you and end up wasting their money. I will try to help you out on this one. For you and most likely your friends, Creatine Phosphate will do nothing, but have a placebo effect. If you feel it will help you out then take it, if you want to take it because you feel it will actually have an effect on your body then don't waste your money. Creatine phosphate simply helps replenish your own creatine stores when you train (we have a small reserve stored in our cells). When we exercise the myosin and actin (rachet like system of micro fibres deep inside the muscle) contract to shorten the muscle in the presents of ATP - Adenosine triphosphate and calcium. When ATP is used for energy it gets broken down into ADP - Adonsine diphosphate- a useless waste product that can't be stored or used for energy, this is where creatine comes in... Creatine lends one of it's phosphate atoms which quickly binds to the ADP to create ATP and gets resynthesized back into a useable compound for energy. Now this sounds super dooper useful, but really unless you are a top athlete where every millisecond counts and you need every legal advantage over your opponents then your wasting your time and money. If how ever, your diet is perfect to the calorie, your rest is perfect to the second every set and every workout, you are constantly overloading your muscles / anaerobic energy system, your sleep cycles are perfect to the 1/4 hour, if your workouts are constantly regular and you have been training for a long time and train correctly then you may see a slight advantage in recovery periods and a slight increase in strength gain (1 extra rep or help doing your 1 RM). Back to you, creatine will have next to no effect in your circumstance. On to protein, It's a useful supplement which won't just "repair your muscles and make-em huge". Protein also helps to keep your blood glucose levels high throughout the day (ones that contain carbs as well as protein that is). If blood sugar levels drop because your muscles are using the energy and have run out of muscle glucose stores from a poor diet low in cards, your pancreases releases a hormone Glucagon to maintain homeostasis within the blood. Your body will do this because the only macronutrient your brain can use to function is blood glucose and clearly a necessity for your brain to keep working... If this is the case and blood glucose levels are low your liver will break down lean muscle tissue, convert it into glucose and put it back in your blood basically cannibalising your own muscle for energy (muscular atrophy). This is why diet is far more important that a supplement. Not only this, but this process is known as ketosis producing ketones in the blood stream, this is extremely acidic and can lead to further complications. It shouldn’t be used as a meal replacement more to supplement a perfect diet. I go back to my first point if everything to do with your training and rest isn't perfect, you are simply wasting your time and money. Hope that helps. im sure thats what i said ! :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diceman Posted May 21, 2012 Report Share Posted May 21, 2012 my protein is good and always discounts on offer on the website,i got 2kg of impact whey for £30 most other brands are twice the price and do nothing different. Direct from the factory in bulk you would be paying less than £2/kg for protein powders. Nice little earner for a bit of fancy packaging... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Marty Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 I always find Chicken Curry bulks me up but a run to the loo normally sorts it lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren m Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 I will explain what both supplements do and how they affect you, I will also try and stamp out any rubbish your friends have told you! Most people that supplement their body’s have little or no idea how it affects you and end up wasting their money. I will try to help you out on this one. For you and most likely your friends, Creatine Phosphate will do nothing, but have a placebo effect. If you feel it will help you out then take it, if you want to take it because you feel it will actually have an effect on your body then don't waste your money. Creatine phosphate simply helps replenish your own creatine stores when you train (we have a small reserve stored in our cells). When we exercise the myosin and actin (rachet like system of micro fibres deep inside the muscle) contract to shorten the muscle in the presents of ATP - Adenosine triphosphate and calcium. When ATP is used for energy it gets broken down into ADP - Adonsine diphosphate- a useless waste product that can't be stored or used for energy, this is where creatine comes in... Creatine lends one of it's phosphate atoms which quickly binds to the ADP to create ATP and gets resynthesized back into a useable compound for energy. Now this sounds super dooper useful, but really unless you are a top athlete where every millisecond counts and you need every legal advantage over your opponents then your wasting your time and money. If how ever, your diet is perfect to the calorie, your rest is perfect to the second every set and every workout, you are constantly overloading your muscles / anaerobic energy system, your sleep cycles are perfect to the 1/4 hour, if your workouts are constantly regular and you have been training for a long time and train correctly then you may see a slight advantage in recovery periods and a slight increase in strength gain (1 extra rep or help doing your 1 RM). Back to you, creatine will have next to no effect in your circumstance. On to protein, It's a useful supplement which won't just "repair your muscles and make-em huge". Protein also helps to keep your blood glucose levels high throughout the day (ones that contain carbs as well as protein that is). If blood sugar levels drop because your muscles are using the energy and have run out of muscle glucose stores from a poor diet low in cards, your pancreases releases a hormone Glucagon to maintain homeostasis within the blood. Your body will do this because the only macronutrient your brain can use to function is blood glucose and clearly a necessity for your brain to keep working... If this is the case and blood glucose levels are low your liver will break down lean muscle tissue, convert it into glucose and put it back in your blood basically cannibalising your own muscle for energy (muscular atrophy). This is why diet is far more important that a supplement. Not only this, but this process is known as ketosis producing ketones in the blood stream, this is extremely acidic and can lead to further complications. It shouldn’t be used as a meal replacement more to supplement a perfect diet. I go back to my first point if everything to do with your training and rest isn't perfect, you are simply wasting your time and money. Hope that helps. am i missing something -- i thought if you dont take extra protein your body will not recover and cannilabilse its own muscle ,but you say its a waste of money - what do mean i,d like to know how much protein is too much and at what point will it make you fat rather than help produce lean muscle thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Apologises if I’ve confused you. "On to protein, It's a useful supplement" It's very good, but if you train, have a shake, don't eat for 5 hours then eat mc Donald’s, and go out and drink in town, you waist your money, it will simply be stored as fat under the skin and any progression you make in that session has gone to waste as your body won't recover effectively. If you train to failure, overload your muscles / anaerobic system, have a shake to replace glucose levels and help to repair the damaged muscle fibres ( I use the term lightly, it's far more complicated than that), sleep for 7 - 8 hours don't skip any meals, eat low GI complex carbohydrates and an adequate amount of protein, low saturated fats, or better mono / poly unsaturated fats and drink enough water, during the day, throughout your session and before bed, then yes they will help you achieve your goals.. 26 grams is the most amount of protein your body can absorb in one sitting, protein companies are rubbing their hands when we buy shakes with huge amounts of protein in because you will store it as fat or **** it out and waist extra $$$ for no reason. It's better to split a shake up into 2 sittings, half scoop after a workout the other half 30 mins - 1 hour after if the shake is high in protein. You want a ratio of 3:1 carbohydrates to protein and after a workout is the only time I'd say have a mixture of complex and simple carbohydrates. Normally try and stick with complex. Follow this by a meal 2 hours after. Diet is 70% of the way we look, if the diet and everything else is wrong then supplements are a waist of money. If everything else is right, supplements are useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) Just to add, Ketosis only really happens when there is a near complete depletion of carbohydrates in the system, Gluconeogenesis is when your body converts lean muscle tissue (Amino acids) into blood glucose still causing atrophy, but Ketosis happens when you are purely using fats or amino acids as energy, not just for conversion into blood glucose. Either way, it's not cool! Edited May 22, 2012 by Spara Dritto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Just to add, Ketosis only really happens when there is a near complete depletion of carbohydrates in the system, Glyconeogenesis is when your body converts lean muscle tissue (Amino acids) into blood glucose still causing atrophy, but Ketosis happens when you are purely using Glucose as energy, not just for conversion into blood glucose. Either way, it's not cool! Protein? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) Yes, protein is made up of amino acids, when converted into glucose is known as Gluconeogenesis. Edited May 22, 2012 by Spara Dritto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buckaroo23 Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Maxiraw.com two shakes a day, one in the morning at 0830 a decent meal at 1200 another small meal at 1530 gum at 1700 for 40 mins then another shake straight after the work out then a good tea, it's the same company as maxi muscle but stripped down no adds to it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hedd-wyn Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Whatever happened to good old steak and eggs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) What I was unsure about was the bit where you said burning pure glucose leads to ketosis Edited May 22, 2012 by guest1957 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Lol, sorry my mistake! changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Whatever happened to good old steak and eggs? £££££££££££££££££££££££££££ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hedd-wyn Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) £££££££££££££££££££££££££££ True, Canada geese and acorns it is then Edited May 22, 2012 by hedd-wyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrispti Posted May 22, 2012 Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 True, Canada geese and acorns it is then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren m Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Apologises if I’ve confused you. "On to protein, It's a useful supplement" It's very good, but if you train, have a shake, don't eat for 5 hours then eat mc Donald’s, and go out and drink in town, you waist your money, it will simply be stored as fat under the skin and any progression you make in that session has gone to waste as your body won't recover effectively. If you train to failure, overload your muscles / anaerobic system, have a shake to replace glucose levels and help to repair the damaged muscle fibres ( I use the term lightly, it's far more complicated than that), sleep for 7 - 8 hours don't skip any meals, eat low GI complex carbohydrates and an adequate amount of protein, low saturated fats, or better mono / poly unsaturated fats and drink enough water, during the day, throughout your session and before bed, then yes they will help you achieve your goals.. 26 grams is the most amount of protein your body can absorb in one sitting, protein companies are rubbing their hands when we buy shakes with huge amounts of protein in because you will store it as fat or **** it out and waist extra $$$ for no reason. It's better to split a shake up into 2 sittings, half scoop after a workout the other half 30 mins - 1 hour after if the shake is high in protein. You want a ratio of 3:1 carbohydrates to protein and after a workout is the only time I'd say have a mixture of complex and simple carbohydrates. Normally try and stick with complex. Follow this by a meal 2 hours after. Diet is 70% of the way we look, if the diet and everything else is wrong then supplements are a waist of money. If everything else is right, supplements are useful. interesting thanks- i was unaware that the max the body can use at one time was only 26grams , so adding an extra scoop would do more harm than good . some protein shakes ive used claim 19 to 22 grams per scoop and i usually add 2 scoops , but i,ve seen some protein offering 44grams per serving Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sticky96 Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Thank you all for the replies and special thanks to Spara Dritto for his huge "essay" on the subject. After reading all these posts and seeing that many people have said that a good diet is essential, I have still decided to go for a supplement as my current diet is right for what I do but I find myself needing something to take immediately after doing some intense exercise, I cannot just eat regular food as it will not benefit me as a result of the fast release carbs, and it isn't convenient to cook something either. The supplements I am looking at are MyProtein Recovery XS or Hurricane XS, had anyone used these to good effect and have you seen positive gains after exercise. Sticky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 No worries, I'm glad I could help. My personal favourite shake (they call it a weight gainer - It's not) is Muscle Fury's "MASS FURY" The best shake I've taken and I stick to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 (edited) No worries, I'm glad I could help. My personal favourite shake (they call it a weight gainer - It's not when compared to some shakes, I'd consider it an every day shake) is Muscle Fury's "MASS FURY" The best shake I've taken and I stick to it. If you really wanted to take creatine, take it with your shake and use Reflex - Creapure creatine, a refined pure creatine. All the best! Edited May 24, 2012 by Spara Dritto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.