Beardo Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 Roe deer numbers 'changing woodland ecosystems' The increasing abundance of roe deer appears to be having an impact on woodlands, a study has suggested. Researchers found that sites with the highest abundance of the native animals had the lowest shrub layer vegetation cover and a lower number of birds. It is described as the first study of its kind in the UK to examine the possible impact of just one species of deer on the natural environment. Details were presented at the British Ecological Society's annual meeting. A team from Durham University and the Food and Environment Research Agency (Fera) carried out the study to investigate: roe deer density and the structure and diversity of vegetation in British woodlands, abundance and diversity of plants and birds in British woodlands. Full article... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-20713190 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 It's interesting but I can't help but think they really should be mentioning muntjac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardo Posted January 2, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 funnily enough that was my exact comment on my friend's facebook post from whence i got the link... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 2, 2013 Report Share Posted January 2, 2013 I keep thinking about it every time I hear a piece on deer numbers increasing, if they are included in the numbers it's swaying things seriously. I like muntjac but can't help but wonder if they are a serious problem for more native flora and fauna in the making Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 The Muntjac is a valid point, many of those areas shown are prime Muntjac territory and as we all know the Muntjac is, pound for pound, the most destructive of all deer in this country. Without doubt Roe numbers are on the up but I am confused as to why it appears the Roe is getting all the blame here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 Roe are very selective and diverse in their diet, perhaps the damage is because they might as such target the rarer plant life? Deer management in the UK is a mess though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 The spread of Roe deer is really interesting, in my area where Fallow, Muntjac and wild boar are increasing and finding it easy to adapt to hunting pressure ( Forest of Dean/West Gloucestershire). Roe on the other hand are struggling, they have been about for quite a few years but they just don't seem to be able to get a firm hold, maybe its the other species pushing them out. There is some ( though I don't think scientific) evidence that Munties putting pressure on Roe populations but I do some culling of Munties in Wiltshire and there are loads of Munties and loads of Roe( can't shoot the Roe as their heads are to valuable to the estate ). A friend of mine has a nice patch of stalking in the Leominster area, was fallow, they started seeing the odd Roe, within ten years its become alive with them. On the otherhand Roe have been seen in the lower Wye valley(Gloucestershire) for over ten years, plenty of mixed woodland and arable but the population stays low, if I see them on any of my patches its observe only. I think Muntjac numbers increase much quicker in areas that are managed for pheasant shooting, the fox numbers are kept low, and fox are a main predator of baby Munties, maybe foxs predate the very young Roe in the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 The spread of Roe deer is really interesting, in my area where Fallow, Muntjac and wild boar are increasing and finding it easy to adapt to hunting pressure ( Forest of Dean/West Gloucestershire). Roe on the other hand are struggling, they have been about for quite a few years but they just don't seem to be able to get a firm hold, maybe its the other species pushing them out. There is some ( though I don't think scientific) evidence that Munties putting pressure on Roe populations but I do some culling of Munties in Wiltshire and there are loads of Munties and loads of Roe( can't shoot the Roe as their heads are to valuable to the estate ). A friend of mine has a nice patch of stalking in the Leominster area, was fallow, they started seeing the odd Roe, within ten years its become alive with them. On the otherhand Roe have been seen in the lower Wye valley(Gloucestershire) for over ten years, plenty of mixed woodland and arable but the population stays low, if I see them on any of my patches its observe only. I think Muntjac numbers increase much quicker in areas that are managed for pheasant shooting, the fox numbers are kept low, and fox are a main predator of baby Munties, maybe foxs predate the very young Roe in the same way. Fox defiantly prey on Roe kids, research in Scandinavia backs this up very firmly. Roe are pushed out by Fallow I have experienced this, numbers of Roe are on the rise around myself as some greedy mindless fools totally over shot the Sika Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 should the Sika be there in the first place though? not like they are really native. There is a lot about deer stalkers that is very much focused on their own sport rather than anything else. Look at the people transporting and releasing muntjac that isn't in the best interests of the native flora and fauna they are stalkers looking after their own sport with no respect for the rest of the eco system. The same could be said for "managing" most non native species Boar are another that if a few get their own way and they get properly established will be a large problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 should the Sika be there in the first place though? not like they are really native. There is a lot about deer stalkers that is very much focused on their own sport rather than anything else. Look at the people transporting and releasing muntjac that isn't in the best interests of the native flora and fauna they are stalkers looking after their own sport with no respect for the rest of the eco system. The same could be said for "managing" most non native species Boar are another that if a few get their own way and they get properly established will be a large problem. The Sika we have here in Bowland are as native as Fallow, they were brought in from Parscourt Ireland many hundereds of years back after the Noble men hunted out the Fallow yet were unsuited quarry to hunt with hounds on horseback. Roe in northern England are in the main also an introduced species (some may have come down from Scotland in more recent times) having been brought in from mainland Europe and released on an island in Lake Windermere. If anyone is interested the introduced genes are noted by the incidence of multiple and prominent gorget patches as compared to Scottish animals. The English native Roe was largely hunted out as it was permitted game of the common man so was snared, trapped and hunted without mercy for food. I don't doubt that much preserving of Boar and munties goes on in the interest of sport for some, likewise illegal translocations but you cannot compare those with the Bowland heard of Sika though they are non the less damaging for forestry through their bole scoring habit. Muntjac are far newer and far more damaging and wild boar became extinct in the UK for good reason as the countryside changed just like the wolf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted January 3, 2013 Report Share Posted January 3, 2013 Here in the fens which has never been a great area for deer I have seen more Muntjac this year than perhaps the previous 15 years put together , there is a increasing amount of roe too. I think there are going to be major problems if they get really established as often unless shooting from a high seat the only safe backstop is likely to be around two miles away !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gimlet Posted January 8, 2013 Report Share Posted January 8, 2013 (edited) Fox defiantly prey on Roe kids, research in Scandinavia backs this up very firmly. Roe are pushed out by Fallow I have experienced this, numbers of Roe are on the rise around myself as some greedy mindless fools totally over shot the Sika Where I stalk there is no game shooting and we shoot foxes purely to protect fawns. There is no question that they take the new-borns. Its hardly surprising Roe numbers are rising where too many 'commercial' stalkers are taking out all the dominant bucks to get their lease money back, neglecting costly doe culling and creating territorial vacuums and breeding free-for-alls. Exactly what happens with foxes in fact, when people belt over all the alpha dogs in spring when they're feeding cubs and easy to shoot. Edited January 8, 2013 by Gimlet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 9, 2013 Report Share Posted January 9, 2013 We have no other deer except Roe in the Eden Valley,though Reds and Fallow exist less than an hours drive away.We have noticed quite an increase in Roe numbers in the last year or so,but numbers do fluctuate,so they may just be passing through,as there is no increase in the number of farmers wanting 'rid',so we're assuming there's no noticeable damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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