Underlever Rifles

[jam1e]

Winchester or Marlin in .357 or 30-30 cal ,

 

Must be Cheap

 

Pm me if you have anything that fits the bill

 

Cheers

Chris

Hi Chris,

Only an opinion, but a while ago I was watching a bit of "Under lever Cowboy" type shooting, by members at my local club. I think they were practising for some type of competition.

It looked great fun! So much so that I'm considering getting one myself. At least at some point when funds allow.... :(

Any how, on that particular day, there were around 5 shooters on the line. I asked if any of the rifles were Winchesters, as they seem the iconic Western movie rifles, to me anyhow. I was very surprised to hear that make getting a slating by all! In as much as the actions were **** and having continuous feeding jams was an issue. I was told to "stick to a marlin, they're way better"

Just an experience I thought I'd pass on. Being objective about it, I suppose you can get a "Friday afternoon" gun in almost all makes I would have thought??

Jamie

[saddler]

Hi Chris,

Only an opinion, but a while ago I was watching a bit of "Under lever Cowboy" type shooting, by members at my local club. I think they were practising for some type of competition.

It looked great fun! So much so that I'm considering getting one myself. At least at some point when funds allow.... :(

Any how, on that particular day, there were around 5 shooters on the line. I asked if any of the rifles were Winchesters, as they seem the iconic Western movie rifles, to me anyhow. I was very surprised to hear that make getting a slating by all! In as much as the actions were **** and having continuous feeding jams was an issue. I was told to "stick to a marlin, they're way better"

Just an experience I thought I'd pass on. Being objective about it, I suppose you can get a "Friday afternoon" gun in almost all makes I would have thought??

Jamie

Funny advice, given that there is an issue CALLED the "Marlin Jam"

The problem with the Winchesters is most are Model 94s, designed to handle a rifle cartridge. Luckily mine is in 45 Colt so has not been a cause of problems. Heard of Win users with 357's having issues, seemingly around cartridge lengths, etc.

 

None of them are perfect, for that you'd need to get a Model 92 Browning or Winchester

[jam1e]

All sounds complicated to me!

So for my future knowledge if I ever get round to buying one. What would be the best model to go with folks?

I'm presuming a "long" cartridge type gun at least?

Jamie

[Underdog]

No not complecated at all feller....they would not of lasted all this time otherwise.

Go for what ever you fancy.

I have owned four winnies and one marlin.

My only cf now is a win 94 in 357 and critters dont like it!

[Imperfection]

I have a Winchester 94ae (angle eject) in 357mag and its my little fun gun.Cheap to homeload (£8 per 100) and susprisingy accurate when you put your mind to it.

 

The Winchester however is the inferior rifle with the Marlin being the best,but i wanted a Winchester in particular despite its diminutive size.It dont like 38's,but cycles 357's just fine.

[ChAoS]

It looked great fun! So much so that I'm considering getting one myself.

When you've got your lever-action rifle, you will, of course, require a lever-action *shotgun* to go with it:

 

 

That's PSG rather than CAS but it's *great* fun shooting a lever gun.

 

I'm hoping to put in for a variation for rifles, soon, and a couple of lever-actions will be top of the list. I thought one in .22LR ( a Henry?) and one in .38SP/.357MAG.

 

Thing is, I know next to nothing about lever-action rifles, so I'll be following this thread with interest.

 

By the way, that's a Chiappa shotgun. Does anyone know what sort of reputation their rifles have got?

 

Regards,

 

Mark.

[station]

I have a Winchester 94ae (angle eject) in 357mag and its my little fun gun.Cheap to homeload (£8 per 100) and susprisingy accurate when you put your mind to it.

 

The Winchester however is the inferior rifle with the Marlin being the best,but i wanted a Winchester in particular despite its diminutive size.It dont like 38's,but cycles 357's just fine.

Exactly my thoughts - had a marlin which had been tricked and slicked and was so easy to ratchet.

Got a winchester now and it is more agricultural, but I much prefer it.

Like you say .357 best choice for cost and cycles them best.

 

Apparently the newer marlins have major quality issues so anyone looking for one I would advise looking for an older SYSS one.

 

ATB

[Imperfection]

All sounds complicated to me!

So for my future knowledge if I ever get round to buying one. What would be the best model to go with folks?

I'm presuming a "long" cartridge type gun at least?

Jamie

 

Go for a 30-30.

 

Fantastic calibre.

[Underdog]

I prefer the Win94 action, I like how it is exposed. Triggers are easy to work on. My current one went from 6lb to 2&1/2lb in to hours work all on standard hammer springing.

I do lighten the first stage spring! The Marlin trigger is easy to work on too.

I do not see how it is inferior to a marlin 94 at all! I like how the Win94 slips into the should like a good fitting shotgun. Marlins feel too chunky for me.

One 30/30 trapper I had use to shoot crows to beyond 150yds often.....off hand.

I was plinking with some warm homeloaded 180grners in spring at a football sized weed off hand about 400+yards and hitting all around it, just guessing hold and windage! I would not like to of been a rabbit down there!

I shot one at a magpie at 300ish but gave to much windage, hold over seemed fine though!

 

U.

[Underdog]

 

Go for a 30-30.

 

Fantastic calibre.

Good call

 

Down loads a treat to, blue dot and some 150 lead bullets, about 13 grns or so=1500fps....IIRC!

 

Use to load some 116grn lead bullets to on W231(fast pistol powder)@5grns.

[Sco77w]

I've just ordered a marlin 1894c in 38 /357. I went for the Marlin just in case I ever want to put a scope on it, with it ejecting from the side its more scope friendly. I have been hunting for a pre owned JM Marlin for a while without success as I've heard some horror stories about the Remmington made Marlins or Remlins as they have been christened by the guys on the Marlin owners forum. Ended up ordering a new one. quality issues seem to be sorted now though (fingers crossed)

Mine is in a container ship somewhere on the Atlantic at the moment. Should be with me in 3 or 4 weeks.

[jam1e]

Good call

 

Down loads a treat to, blue dot and some 150 lead bullets, about 13 grns or so=1500fps....IIRC!

 

Use to load some 116grn lead bullets to on W231(fast pistol powder)@5grns.

The 94AE looks the dogs!

Can't believe how little powder is used for the weight of the bullets in these type of rifles!

What makes the 30-30 the best option folks? Is it purely the length of the round being better to cycle?

I already reload for .204R and .223 Rem, so that would certainly be the way to go.....

I didn't know you could get that type of rifle in a .22lr. It's interesting as I have a slot on my ticket for a .22WMR, and presume I could get one in this calibre?

 

Edit - Just been watching some You-tube videos of the Win model 9422M, that free slot may not be free for much longer!...

Edited June 6, 2014 by jam1e

[Underdog]

The 94AE looks the dogs!

Can't believe how little powder is used for the weight of the bullets in these type of rifles!

What makes the 30-30 the best option folks? Is it purely the length of the round being better to cycle?

I already reload for .204R and .223 Rem, so that would certainly be the way to go.....

I didn't know you could get that type of rifle in a .22lr. It's interesting as I have a slot on my ticket for a .22WMR, and presume I could get one in this calibre?

 

Edit - Just been watching some You-tube videos of the Win model 9422M, that free slot may not be free for much longer!...

Those charge weights are for reduced loads, plinking or rabbit loads etc.

Full power loads in 30/30 are about 30grns of medium speed powders like H322,RL7 and H4895.

The cycling is a mute point.....and a Win 94ae can be scoped....the ae means angle eject.

 

Yes the 9422m is a nice rifle.

To be honest and apart from my 9422 being on offer the 22 version on ammo like CCI velocitors ain't that far behind and cheaper to run!

 

U.

[39TDS]

 

 

If anyone is interested my little 9422 is for sale or swaps for an auto or bolt 22. Nothing wrong with it by the way! I don't use it since getting the 357 but an auto would be good on the rats!

 

U.

My ticket has been in for a 1-for-1 variation for a month now. When it comes back I am wanting to buy a 9422 in lr so I am very interested in yours if you can hang on a little while.

I'm surprised it hasn't been back by now.

 

I have a 9422 in WMR and I think my plan is to sell that once I have one in lr.

My WMR is a great gun and in really good nick. Cycles perfectly, never once had a fail to fire or fail to eject. I really really like it and haven't 100% decided to sell it. The one and only reason I am thinking of selling it is because it is so loud it hurts my ears. Not excessive for the gun but I think years of shooting has caught up with my ears.

 

Regardless of either of these guns being for sale I would say if you have a chance to own a 9422 then go for it.

I have owned a Marlin 39A Mountie in .22. Everything I read said it would be a reliable, slick, accurate gun. It was none of them!! I wouldn't have one given to me based on that pile of wotsit.

[Imperfection]

I do not see how it is inferior to a marlin 94 at all! I like how the Win94 slips into the should like a good fitting shotgun. Marlins feel too chunky for me.

 

Why i think they're inferior to a Marlin is Winchester stopped producing them a long time ago and spare parts are very thin on the ground.I've had two shell lifters and last part had to be made from scratch in stainless so wasnt cheap! The main thing though is the rifle was never designed to fire a pistol cartridge so they dont cycle as well as a 30-30 for example.

 

Despite its flaws though,i love my Winchester.I never wanted a Marlin because like you they feel too chunky.

[Underdog]

My 357 win 94 loads just as well as the 30/30.

There is lots of parts available however I have never needed any except a cartridge control piece exception to the 357.

The shell lifter can be twisted if not fitted back correctly but there is no need to remove really.

Marlins are good I agree but some of the stories like often happens get blown out of proportion.

 

Bullet length is very important in most leveractions and a hundred thou long or shorter can make all the difference.

 

There are new Win94 being made but they are expensive.

There are the 92 versions from Rossi.

Pedersoli are doing the big 86.

Uberti do the 76 versions that are also highly regarded.

I have never had a failure from a Win94 in the field...got hundreds of photos.

As I said when the 357 cartridge control/stop failed it only prevented the magazine being toped up. Loading the mag from empty was unhindred.

Cycling was still fine.

The replacement was sourced locally and fitted in 1/2 an hour. I also got a friend to send me a spare one from the states for peanuts!

The 94 locking bolt rises into posistion and the floor plate is then held in place by a small detent.

Later models did not get the time needed in the fine tuning of the lever. This leaves some loading on the lever with the action closed and often easily wants to over come the detent. In stead of the rising lug doing the lock up the lever where it is conected to the bolt via a cross pin is holding the bolt forward.

This then makes for poor shooting!

The fix is simple and a small chainsaw sharpening round file is all that is needed. The eye on the end of the lever just needs relieving until all load shifts off the lever at the end of the stroke of the bolt......well worth the effort.

There should be no load on the closed lever except by the trigger interlock....depress the interlock to test.

Need a brew now lol. Sounds complecated but they are so simple really.

[jam1e]

Thanks for the updates since I fell asleep last night folks.

Anyone have any nice pictures of a Win 9422 ae they could post up for me?

Cheers

Jamie

[saddler]

Thanks for the updates since I fell asleep last night folks.

Anyone have any nice pictures of a Win 9422 ae they could post up for me?

Cheers

Jamie

possibly not...the AE was only used for the centre-fire Model 94s, as prior to the Angle Eject they threw the case straight up vertically

The 9422 is just a 9422, they've always side ejected

[Underdog]

9422.

 

94ae.

 

U.

[jam1e]

9422.

 

94ae.

 

U.

Very nice.

Have you added a non standard rear sight? And if so did it improve the accuracy by much?

Cheers UD

Jamie.

Jamie

[Underdog]

It is scoped now, my eyes are very long sighted but yes I added a Williams FP (fool proof) receiver peep.

I needed to fit a tang sight really, that would of put the peep closer to the eye and helped sharpen the front and target up but they are so expensive!

Scoped now.

 

U.

[jam1e]

Nice picture again U. Thank-you. What sort of groups are you getting with your scoped 9422 at 100 yards?

I like the thought of being able to use it with open sights at my local club, to have a bit of fun. But to also be able to put a scope on it and use it for vermin control. Especially as I don't have anything at the moment, between .22lr and .204 Ruger.

In a perfect world I'd buy a Win 9422ae and also a Win 94, or similar, in 30-30. Purely, as I've always liked the idea of owning a 30-30.

But we don't live in an ideal world, and I can only afford to buy one or the other at the moment. Also, a 30-30 will initially cost me more as I would also need to buy the dies, brass, bullets, large primers and powder for it to. Decisions decisions....

[saddler]

In a perfect world I'd buy a 9422ae...

 

Aye...all it'll take is a couple of big lottery wins...so you can buy out Winchester & get them to produce the first one

[Underdog]

Nice picture again U. Thank-you. What sort of groups are you getting with your scoped 9422 at 100 yards?

I like the thought of being able to use it with open sights at my local club, to have a bit of fun. But to also be able to put a scope on it and use it for vermin control. Especially as I don't have anything at the moment, between .22lr and .204 Ruger.

In a perfect world I'd buy a Win 9422ae and also a Win 94, or similar, in 30-30. Purely, as I've always liked the idea of owning a 30-30.

But we don't live in an ideal world, and I can only afford to buy one or the other at the moment. Also, a 30-30 will initially cost me more as I would also need to buy the dies, brass, bullets, large primers and powder for it to. Decisions decisions....

I don't really do target shooting. However do like a good plink now and then and if I do my bit it gets there just fine and seems not to be ammo fussy at all. My last rabbit with it last week was 133 paces off hand so it does very well.

When I was harvesting a lot of rabbits with it a check on paper always gave good tight clusters at 50.

I use to go for a stroll with it on the open sights, I would just do 3/4 a turn of the mount screws to remove the scope and the same opposite to put it back on and never lost zero!

 

30/30 is a great cartridge, efficient to. Can be loaded with lead and jacketed bullets from 100-180grns and due to it's moderate velocity known as a good penetrator.

Don't be put off by the na' sayers, I use to shoot mine beyond 200yds all the time at small and large. Good on running shots too!

 

[jam1e]

I don't really do target shooting. However do like a good plink now and then and if I do my bit it gets there just fine and seems not to be ammo fussy at all. My last rabbit with it last week was 133 paces off hand so it does very well.

When I was harvesting a lot of rabbits with it a check on paper always gave good tight clusters at 50.

I use to go for a stroll with it on the open sights, I would just do 3/4 a turn of the mount screws to remove the scope and the same opposite to put it back on and never lost zero!

 

30/30 is a great cartridge, efficient to. Can be loaded with lead and jacketed bullets from 100-180grns and due to it's moderate velocity known as a good penetrator.

Don't be put off by the na' sayers, I use to shoot mine beyond 200yds all the time at small and large. Good on running shots too!

 

Thanks for the info and picture U.

I had a play with a Win 9422 mag today (Used) at my local RFD.

I was very surprised at how small they are! :o Although reasonably weighty.

As I've said, I have a free .22WMR slot, I had "plastic" and my ticket with me, and was very tempted! It would be great for the close range squirrel bashing I'm doing for a farmer at the moment. The gun looked clean enough, (at first glance anyhow) but I know Roger from Bromsgrove Shooting Supplies. The only thing that gets sold at a low price in that shop, is your gun when you sell or trade it in there! Anyhow, he wanted just under £600 for the used version. I wanted to go home and do my homework on cost!

What did concern me was show short the lop was! Even with the added 1" butt extension the previous owner had added to it.

It fitted the salesman a treat. But by the his own admission he was around 5' 5", and it fitted him ok. But I'm 6' 1", and my arms are a lot longer. How does yours fit you U, and are you tall?

Cheers

Jamie