The Beater Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Hi folks, are these cartridges english shot size or european ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) I think they will be UK shot sizes. A good shell. Killed a cracking 50 yard wood pigeon the other night roost shooting and it was dead in the air . Edited January 16, 2015 by anser2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beater Posted January 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Oh, bought some and split one open and counted 238 pellets in the 29g load, isn't there round 270 in 6 shot to the oz/28g . I always check a new cartridge, thought they look a little bigger, but maybe my eyes are going!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Oh, bought some and split one open and counted 238 pellets in the 29g load, isn't there round 270 in 6 shot to the oz/28g . I always check a new cartridge, thought they look a little bigger, but maybe my eyes are going!!! I usually measure shot to check the size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beater Posted January 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I usually measure shot to check the size. Yes, a job for the vernier caliper, my uncle has one. Be helpful if they stated it on box, I know a lot of them are using european shot in the heavier game loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roostshooter1 Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Why bother keep measuring shot instead of just using a cartridge you have confidence with ? I use size 6 rc sipes over decoys and walked up shooting and then i use hull high pheasant extremes size five for roost shooting i dont bother confusing my self with english or european sizes just seems like a pointless thing to have in the back of your mind while shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Why bother keep measuring shot instead of just using a cartridge you have confidence with ? I use size 6 rc sipes over decoys and walked up shooting and then i use hull high pheasant extremes size five for roost shooting i dont bother confusing my self with english or european sizes just seems like a pointless thing to have in the back of your mind while shooting You are clearly a more wealthy man than me , if I was to use sipes for my pigeon shooting it would cost me a fortune , if you only shoot a few here and there fine but for most people shooting a lot of pigeon cartridge cost has to be a consideration and there are plenty that will do the job just as well over decoys as sipes and at a much cheaper price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roostshooter1 Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I wouldnt say i was more wealthy than anyone i do have a good job and salary but i do work an average of 75 hours a week and now with the power plant job thats going to go up again :( i will say i dont shoot massive numbers of pigeons but i do shoot alot of crows over decoys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hofk Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) European i think as the chasse pigeon were, and these are the same just a 70mm case. Edited January 16, 2015 by hofk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beater Posted January 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) Why bother keep measuring shot instead of just using a cartridge you have confidence with ? I use size 6 rc sipes over decoys and walked up shooting and then i use hull high pheasant extremes size five for roost shooting i dont bother confusing my self with english or european sizes just seems like a pointless thing to have in the back of your mind while shootingHave just about used up all my original clear pigeon 30g (clear case) that I used for over 15 years and had total faith in, I go my local supplier and he has the new clear pigeon in 32g, which is to much recoil for me through light game gun when shooting a lot or it's these Power Pigeon 29g 6s, so the latter it was. If you have confidence using high performance game carts for pigeon shooting good for you, I don't have anything in the back of my mind when shooting, I was just curious about these new cartridges. Edited January 16, 2015 by The Beater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossEM Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I bought a slab of these (Pigeon Power 29g 6's) and immediately wished I hadn't - straight back to Hull Imperial 6's for me. I use these for everything (except Wildfowl) because my gun likes them, and they're fast and light on recoil. They're more expensive but there's a massive difference in quality. Anyway, the point is that cheap cartridges don't do the job just as well. Even some of the expensive ones don't! Eley Grand Prix 28g 6's in my opinion are awful, yet they're some of the most pricey cartridges. You have to pattern your gun and find the ideal load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazzJo Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I use power pigeon for decoying and for roost shooting they come down and hit the ground dead so seems to do the job for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I bought a slab of these (Pigeon Power 29g 6's) and immediately wished I hadn't - straight back to Hull Imperial 6's for me. I use these for everything (except Wildfowl) because my gun likes them, and they're fast and light on recoil. They're more expensive but there's a massive difference in quality. Anyway, the point is that cheap cartridges don't do the job just as well. Even some of the expensive ones don't! Eley Grand Prix 28g 6's in my opinion are awful, yet they're some of the most pricey cartridges. You have to pattern your gun and find the ideal load. Regardless of price there is not a single cartridge on the market from 28gram 7.5 upwards that will not do the job perfectly fine when pigeon decoying , I have used countless brands , shot sizes and loads over the years and cannot tell the difference between any of them . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DazzJo Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 Regardless of price there is not a single cartridge on the market from 28gram 7.5 upwards that will not do the job perfectly fine when pigeon decoying , I have used countless brands , shot sizes and loads over the years and cannot tell the difference between any of them . I'll second that.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aga man Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 The only way to know about the shot size is measure it or try emailing lyalvale. The pigeon chasse load they did was european size 2.8mm but at £60 ish a slab was a bit ott for a pigeon shell imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted January 16, 2015 Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 I've used these express cartridges to good effect, but I didn't find they killed any better than the fiocchi Top1 shells that I mainly use for pigeons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossEM Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 Regardless of price there is not a single cartridge on the market from 28gram 7.5 upwards that will not do the job perfectly fine when pigeon decoying , I have used countless brands , shot sizes and loads over the years and cannot tell the difference between any of them . Hi Fenboy, same as you, I've had bad and good experiences with most brands, but it's all about confidence. I'm confident with Hull Imperial so I stick to them. I'm no snob, when I had a 20 bore I used Express steel 4s for everything because they patterned really well in my gun. I'd rather use cartridges that do the job excellently than fine! It stands to reason that cheaper cartridges are made with cheaper components so their performance will be less - it's very disappointing when you spend out on supposedly higher quality shells which turn out to be inferior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 Hi Fenboy, same as you, I've had bad and good experiences with most brands, but it's all about confidence. I'm confident with Hull Imperial so I stick to them. I'm no snob, when I had a 20 bore I used Express steel 4s for everything because they patterned really well in my gun. I'd rather use cartridges that do the job excellently than fine! It stands to reason that cheaper cartridges are made with cheaper components so their performance will be less - it's very disappointing when you spend out on supposedly higher quality shells which turn out to be inferior. I would agree confidence plays a large part in good shooting . But you may be surprised at what the difference in on some so called good quality game cartridges and cheaper alternatives , often the only difference will be a nicer box or a higher brass ! there are only a handful of component manufacturers and most of the loading companies use them . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossEM Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 I would agree confidence plays a large part in good shooting . But you may be surprised at what the difference in on some so called good quality game cartridges and cheaper alternatives , often the only difference will be a nicer box or a higher brass ! there are only a handful of component manufacturers and most of the loading companies use them . Agreed. The only game cartridges I think are genuinely and noticeably better are Gamebore Pure Gold and Hull Imperial. Eley are not what they used to be, last batch I bought were slow, fouled the barrels like black powder does and the pellets were deforming the outer case to the point where I had to push the shells in to the chamber of my gun... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roostshooter1 Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 I would just buy a couple boxes and see if you get on with them at least if you only buy say 50 you wont waste your money on a thousand and leave them sat there for years because you dont like them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 Agreed. The only game cartridges I think are genuinely and noticeably better are Gamebore Pure Gold and Hull Imperial. Eley are not what they used to be, last batch I bought were slow, fouled the barrels like black powder does and the pellets were deforming the outer case to the point where I had to push the shells in to the chamber of my gun... How slow were they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RossEM Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 How slow were they? I'm no scientist, but I'm used to minimum lead on walked up and decoyed birds at up to 45 yards. Hull Imperial and Gamebore Pure Gold are great for this type of shooting. The Grand Prix I was using were visibly behind nearly every crosser I shot at. I had to give more lead than usual which felt totally wrong! I used 2 boxes and sold the rest of the slab. They were new cartridges in the updated packaging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beater Posted January 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 (edited) This carts are bit gappy at 30yrds with 1/4 choke, a lot better pattern with 3/4 through mk60. Still 19 pigeons in an hour on the rape the other morning before they fled else where. Edited January 21, 2015 by The Beater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 This carts are bit gappy at 30yrds with 1/4 choke, a lot better pattern with 3/4 through mk60. Still 19 pigeons in an hour on the rape the other morning before they fled else where. put in full and 3/4 and then have a go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beater Posted January 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 put in full and 3/4 and then have a go. Fixed choke gun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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