chris1961 Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Which cartridge would suit both clays and pigeon for o/u and French semi auto (gas cycling) and above all cheap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted February 9, 2015 Report Share Posted February 9, 2015 Most clay grounds allow no higher than 28 gram , so it would have to be a 28 gram continental load so a English 7 , my favourite are Fiocchi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) Most clay grounds allow no higher than 28 gram Yeah, I never understood this. People in the business of selling clays and cartridges and they still don't understand how the bloody things work... Edited February 10, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrowning2 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Yeah, I never understood this. People in the business of selling clays and cartridges and they still don't understand how the bloody things work... I think you will find clay grounds limit the quantity and size of shot and in some cases type of shot I.e no steel shot to comply with fallout distances and noise levels. Risk assessment and insurance etc like steel shot ricoshaying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 simple answer,, ANY 28G CLAY CART 7 1/2,s ,,,, they will kill pigeons no problem,,if I had a pound for everytime this question had been asked I could of bought a new set of purdeys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) I think you will find clay grounds limit the quantity and size of shot and in some cases type of shot I.e no steel shot to comply with fallout distances and noise levels. Risk assessment and insurance etc like steel shot ricoshaying. Yup - I've seen it myself. Limiting size of shot makes perfect sense - they don't want someone shooting off a load of BBs that come down 700 yards away in the middle of the next village. Shot material I can also go with - timber plus steel shot plus chainsaw isn't a great combination. Quantity of shot, however, has no bearing whatsoever on safety or noise or anything really, which the bit I've never understood. I realise that some disciplines of clay shooting restrict the quantity of shot in the interests of fairness. However, I don't see any reason why people who want to go and practice clays outside of competition, shouldn't be free to blast 50g+ of #7½ at the targets - it's no more dangerous or noisy than shooting an ounce of 7½ at the same target. Probably marginally less so on both counts, in fact, since you can't launch huge payloads of shot at the same high velocities: lesser kinetic energy per pellet, shorter range and probably a less pronounced supersonic "crack" would be the likely outcome. Edited February 10, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Perhaps the easiest way to find out would be to ask a ground owner! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mick.j Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 It really is a safety issue - If people want to shoot 50g of 71/2 shot or home loads with god knows what in them, go and do it on there own ground. NOT on a proper clay ground. IF anything happened untoward the ground would be to blame regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) It really is a safety issue - If people want to shoot 50g of 71/2 shot or home loads with god knows what in them, go and do it on there own ground. NOT on a proper clay ground. IF anything happened untoward the ground would be to blame regardless. Ok - with apologies to the OP, why not limit them to 24 grams? Or 21 grams? Or 3 grams? That must be safe. Also tell me, is a 21g homeload safer than a 52g Fiocchi #8 load? (See here: http://www.fiocchiuk.com/site/index.php?pag=790&linea=7&titolo_prod=Magnum&prod=729) What is unsafe about it, precisely? Come on - back up your assertion with some evidence, or at the very least a reasoned argument. Otherwise it's just prejudice. Edited February 10, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Maybe their search engine ran out of fuel ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mick.j Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Ok - with apologies to the OP, why not limit them to 24 grams? Or 21 grams? Or 3 grams? That must be safe. Also tell me, is a 21g homeload safer than a 52g Fiocchi #8 load? (See here: http://www.fiocchiuk.com/site/index.php?pag=790&linea=7&titolo_prod=Magnum&prod=729) What is unsafe about it, precisely? Come on - back up your assertion with some evidence, or at the very least a reasoned argument. Otherwise it's just prejudice. Another one who cannot understand a simple explanation. Use some common. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbrowning2 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) neutron619 I agree re quantity of shot, but I guess they have to put a limit on at some point and as most grounds are affiliated to the CPSA and have insurance via the CPSA approved insurance company they play by the rules laid down by the CPSA. Re homeloads not being used or allowed due to them being dangerous, well just like the argument BASC is using to stop the total ban on lead shot where is the science and facts to prove that? no I like to think it is because any home load is better than a mass produced comercial cartridge or the ground wants you to buy the cartridges they have for sale. Cartridge for clay pigeon or decoyed pigeon then a EU import in 7.1/2 which is probably UK7 will do well for both. Edited February 10, 2015 by rbrowning2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 Another one who cannot understand a simple explanation. Use some common. Sorry, but that isn't an answer - it's avoidance of the question. Since you think I'm an idiot, please feel free to treat me like one and explain in very simple terms (I'm an idiot remember) the difference between a) shooting a commercially produced Fiocchi cartridge containing 52g of Italian #8 (i.e. Engligh #7½) shot and, b) shooting a commercially produced - let's say - Fiocchi cartridge containing 28g of Italian #8 (i.e. English #7½) shot and explain to me the reason why a) is so much more dangerous than b). I'm looking for some kind of rational explanation, not prejudice - the reason being, of course, that it is my belief that a 28g limit is based in ignorance and prejudice and I would like to be proved wrong and taught the reason that I am wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 (edited) neutron619 I agree re quantity of shot, but I guess they have to put a limit on at some point and as most grounds are affiliated to the CPSA and have insurance via the CPSA approved insurance company they play by the rules laid down by the CPSA. Re homeloads not being used or allowed due to them being dangerous, well just like the argument BASC is using to stop the total ban on lead shot where is the science and facts to prove that? no I like to think it is because any home load is better than a mass produced comercial cartridge or the ground wants you to buy the cartridges they have for sale. Cartridge for clay pigeon or decoyed pigeon then a EU import in 7.1/2 which is probably UK7 will do well for both. Paragraph #1 - glad to hear I'm not the only one. Disappointing if it is the CPSA's assertion that larger quantities of #7½ shot are more dangerous than smaller quantities of #7½ shot fired in otherwise identical conditions - one would hope they would know better. Paragraph #2 - not sure I ever mentioned homeloads - that subject was introduced by Mick.j who I'm hoping is going to answer my request above, so perhaps he can tell us why he thought that was relevant to my question regarding quantity of shot as well? I can see a reasonable argument, though frankly his assertion that liability would lie with the ground in this case is absurd, since the shooter (homeloader) would clearly be at fault and therefore liable. Paragraph #3 - agreed. Edited February 10, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 10, 2015 Report Share Posted February 10, 2015 We used to shoot 32 Grammes of lead at Registered English Sporting Competitions and 36 Grammes at Fitasc, I seem to remember the original reason for the reduction to 28 Grammes was to reduce recoil. A single pellet of 7 1/2 would travel as far as 52 Grammes of 7 1/2. That is simple physics! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.