i.r. illumination

[fieldwanderer]

I've decided to start getting the bits together to make myself a fairly simple n.v. setup as I seem to have an abundance of lamp shy foxes at the moment (many thanks to one of the local keepers I think ).

 

Anyway, I'd like some help when it comes to the i.r. side of things as I really know next to nothing about this. I have a couple of favourite spots that see me waiting out and calling from a raised, hidden position, it works well but the foxes are usually at about 150-225yds and I'm unsure if this is even very realistic for a fairly low cost diy n.v. setup.

 

I'm currently using one of these;

 

http://www.gizchina.com/2014/08/01/review-ultrafire-cree-xml-t6-2000-lumen-flashlight/

 

which is good out to about 200yds if there's no mist/fog about, I'd been thinking about tinkering with it to get even more range but I'm coming around to thinking it'd be good to convert it with an i.r. led if possible because I managed to find a decent mount for it and I'm generally happy with everything. I know the emitters and drivers are out there but would like a bit more of an idea about what I'm doing before I start spending money or hacking anything about.

 

I can take the torch apart and measure the driver, emitter and any voltages / currents if it's any help.

 

That's about as much as I know really except 940nm is invisible to us so likely to be a better choice given my predicament, so please start as basic as you like

[FalconFN]

940 nm certainly is more covert but if you are planning to use an add-on type of unit then the range will be very limited. 850 nm will give you the range and will be pretty unobtrusive at 150 yards.

 

I'd be tempted to just buy a t20 for £30 and save yourself the hastle and probable disappointment of converting your existing torch for £15.

 

Edit. The T50 torch may be a better bet as it will increase your range, and depending on mag, scope, camera and lens type you could find the T20 isn't quite enough.

Edited March 8, 2015 by FalconFN

[fieldwanderer]

Fair enough, if you know of a good way of mounting any of them?

 

The mount I'm using is adjustable (elevation and side to side) but would probably be too low for a larger front lens on the torch - though I'd like to go with something good quality wise.

[fruity]

As falcon fn says without a doubler on my t20 struggles past 100 yrds but fine up to that distance

 

Ant supplies do some nice mounts

[evo]

lets not forget all that you can throw as much light out as you want but if the camera cant see it then your weeing in the wind,

 

do not use 940nm as you will be wasting your time because the normal ccd cameras out today struggle to see the IR light,

 

good luck with whatever it is your trying to achieve

 

atb Evo

 

fruity,,if you are struggling to get past 100yrds with your t20 then something is wrong, ie the camera your using is not upto the job and/or the oslon black is not running properly,with a standard t20 I can get 250yrds easy and with a doubler on it then the ranges are getting silly, with a 66mm lens on then I am seeing the flag easily on a par 5

but if your struggling to get a 100yrds with one then I,m sorry but something is not right

[fruity]

lets not forget all that you can throw as much light out as you want but if the camera cant see it then your weeing in the wind,

 

do not use 940nm as you will be wasting your time because the normal ccd cameras out today struggle to see the IR light,

 

good luck with whatever it is your trying to achieve

 

atb Evo

 

fruity,,if you are struggling to get past 100yrds with your t20 then something is wrong, ie the camera your using is not upto the job and/or the oslon black is not running properly,with a standard t20 I can get 250yrds easy and with a doubler on it then the ranges are getting silly, with a 66mm lens on then I am seeing the flag easily on a par 5

but if your struggling to get a 100yrds with one then I,m sorry but something is not right

I'm using an e700 Camera

A few people have said the same thing evo.

 

I put a thread up the other day regarding batteries , my cheap 18650 Are sh## so I've ordered some good quality ones hoping that will help

[fieldwanderer]

I was going to go with an e700 too but I'm looking at options other than a bulky screen, that's beside the point at the moment though.

 

Thanks for the heads up about which leds to go with

[evo]

its not your batteries mate, it might be the way the camera is set up , it could be the oslon black not performing how it should, there are so many things it could be but with the e700 you should be getting well over 200yrds easily,

 

can I ask what scope your using ?

[sitsinhedges]

I bought an E700 recently but was very disappointed. Sent it back for a refund.

[fruity]

its not your batteries mate, it might be the way the camera is set up , it could be the oslon black not performing how it should, there are so many things it could be but with the e700 you should be getting well over 200yrds easily,

 

can I ask what scope your using ?

Problem sorted.

It's the pil , litrally just changed it over using one my mate has bought for his but not fitted yet and has made a massive difference , as you state almost twice the distance

I'll send it back or get a new one

 

Thanks for the info evo, it's appreciated

Edited March 8, 2015 by fruity

[FalconFN]

its not your batteries mate, it might be the way the camera is set up , it could be the oslon black not performing how it should, there are so many things it could be but with the e700 you should be getting well over 200yrds easily,

 

can I ask what scope your using ?

Yup, I made my first add on with a cheapo Sony Super HAD camera and I could see well over 200 yards with a T20 - mind you I've gone scopeless now so I can get that range with the T20 on low power!

[evo]

Problem sorted.

It's the pil , litrally just changed it over using one my mate has bought for his but not fitted yet and has made a massive difference , as you state almost twice the distance

I'll send it back or get a new one

 

Thanks for the info evo, it's appreciated

no prob buddy ,,anytime

[evo]

Yup, I made my first add on with a cheapo Sony Super HAD camera and I could see well over 200 yards with a T20 - mind you I've gone scopeless now so I can get that range with the T20 on low power!

scopeless is the way to go,,BUT its a pain in the backside re zeroing if the rifle gets knocked, lol, loved my scopeless build and we could see unreal distances, great way to go with the nv but I much prefer the evolution 20,

[fruity]

no prob buddy ,,anytime

It was a good one I bought too, can they be fixed or no ? .

[fruity]

but I much prefer the evolution 20,

 

More info please :)

[evo]

are you running it from a 18650 battery ? if yes then I can knock you a pill up no problem

[fruity]

are you running it from a 18650 battery ? if yes then I can knock you a pill up no problem

18650 yes , rather than send the faulty one back can the one I have be fixed I mean or no ?

[evo]

it can be fixed if its the driver but if its the oslon led then the answer is no

[fruity]

it can be fixed if its the driver but if its the oslon led then the answer is no

Oslon led yes , I'll send it back then see what they say

Thanks

[mick miller]

I wouldn't recommend scopeless over an add-on at all. I think, unless you buy a Drone Pro, home made ones are horrid. No decent zero adjustment, ugly reticule without any holdover points, likely limited use in daytime, and really, to use it at night and get the kind of definition required for head shooting rabbits, you're going to need some IR. I suppose if you want to plod around simply gut shooting everything it would do.

 

Build an add-on and you still have a great optic in the daytime, great reticule at night with holdovers if you need, built correctly it shouldn't add more than 90mm to eye relief, but, consider that you shoot with your eye off a day scope and with your eye pressed into an add-on the actual increase in eye relief is only around 40-50mm.

 

A decent camera should be able to see a couple of hundred yards with a T20. I know I bang on about my builds performance, but with a T20 I could shoot comfortably out to 200 yards with a scope magged up. With a T60 I can see over 600 yards on mid magnifications and shoot out to 350 yards magged up and the torch on full. It's a shame, the cameras I found were the utter dog's danglies for light gathering but due to a shortage in the sensor supply, are now discontinued. I reckon I could build about another 10 units and then no more.

 

E700 is the one everyone seems to use, I have one here but never got around to doing anything with it. I digress.

 

Everyone has there own preferred sources of IR less. I've had a few slightly iffy ones from home builders in the past that I only ever use RS components now. Problem with that is the torch requires a lot of modifications to get a 20mm star led to fit. Good luck with your build and please post some pics when it's done. Good luck.

Edited March 12, 2015 by mick miller

[colin lad]

I wouldn't recommend scopeless over an add-on at all. I think, unless you buy a Drone Pro, home made ones are horrid. No decent zero adjustment, ugly reticule without any holdover points, likely limited use in daytime, and really, to use it at night and get the kind of definition required for head shooting rabbits, you're going to need some IR. I suppose if you want to plod around simply gut shooting everything it would do.

 

Build an add-on and you still have a great optic in the daytime, great reticule at night with holdovers if you need, built correctly it shouldn't add more than 90mm to eye relief, but, consider that you shoot with your eye off a day scope and with your eye pressed into an add-on the actual increase in eye relief is only around 40-50mm.

 

A decent camera should be able to see a couple of hundred yards with a T20. I know I bang on about my builds performance, but with a T20 I could shoot comfortably out to 200 yards with a scope magged up. With a T60 I can see over 600 yards on mid magnifications and shoot out to 350 yards magged up and the torch on full. It's a shame, the cameras I found were the utter dog's danglies for light gathering but due to a shortage in the sensor supply, are now discontinued. I reckon I could build about another 10 units and then no more.

 

E700 is the one everyone seems to use, I have one here but never got around to doing anything with it. I digress.

 

Everyone has there own preferred sources of IR less. I've had a few slightly iffy ones from home builders in the past that I only ever use RS components now. Problem with that is the torch requires a lot of modifications to get a 20mm star led to fit. Good luck with your build and please post some pics when it's done. Good luck.

if you not using your E700 i will buy it off you as i am just about to order one

 

colin

[FalconFN]

I wouldn't recommend scopeless over an add-on at all. I think, unless you buy a Drone Pro, home made ones are horrid. No decent zero adjustment, ugly reticule without any holdover points, likely limited use in daytime, and really, to use it at night and get the kind of definition required for head shooting rabbits, you're going to need some IR. I suppose if you want to plod around simply gut shooting everything it would do.

 

Each to their own I suppose but I really need to correct a couple of things there, firstly there are some awesome home made units ('broom pro' springs to mind) and reticles are far from ugly and with 8 privacy zones available to make 6 holdover points (you can make a christmas tree if you want too) or get a reticle generator for a few quid and have multiple rets.

 

The main point is that IR is not invisible, so the less you need the better and I can get 200 yards on a T20 low setting (10% power) meaning fewer spooked bunnies and longer run times. You can see without ir pretty well under anything over a half moon and a full moon is almost as good as daylight.

 

The only 2 downsides of scopeless rigs is lack of a decent zoom and having to have a dedicated rifle, in every other way a decent diy scopless build wees all over an add on.

Edited March 15, 2015 by FalconFN

[evo]

Each to their own I suppose but I really need to correct a couple of things there, firstly there are some awesome home made units ('broom pro' springs to mind) and reticles are far from ugly and with 8 privacy zones available to make 6 holdover points (you can make a christmas tree if you want too) or get a reticle generator for a few quid and have multiple rets.

 

The main point is that IR is not invisible, so the less you need the better and I can get 200 yards on a T20 low setting (10% power) meaning fewer spooked bunnies and longer run times. You can see without ir pretty well under anything over a half moon and a full moon is almost as good as daylight.

 

The only 2 downsides of scopeless rigs is lack of a decent zoom and having to have a dedicated rifle, in every other way a decent diy scopless build wees all over an add on.

I agree but an add on is more user friendly falcon

[Dave-G]

Each to their own I suppose but I really need to correct a couple of things there, firstly there are some awesome home made units ('broom pro' springs to mind) and reticles are far from ugly and with 8 privacy zones available to make 6 holdover points (you can make a christmas tree if you want too) or get a reticle generator for a few quid and have multiple rets.

 

The main point is that IR is not invisible, so the less you need the better and I can get 200 yards on a T20 low setting (10% power) meaning fewer spooked bunnies and longer run times. You can see without ir pretty well under anything over a half moon and a full moon is almost as good as daylight.

 

The only 2 downsides of scopeless rigs is lack of a decent zoom and having to have a dedicated rifle, in every other way a decent diy scopless build wees all over an add on.

Plus they are much easier to accurately zero these days. They don't even need to be a dedicated rig anymore - fitting an IR blocking filter massively transforms the daytime imaging.

 

If evening into night is your hunting time then scopeless is the new black.

 

Bring an illuminator in your pocket in case you need it on a very dark night. Few people could possibly imagine what they are missing in terms of very covert shooting in low light unless they get to see one in action.

 

They arent as good as gen two + tubed yet - but they go a long way towards it for not much money.

 

LOL, you kept yours pretty quiet - or did I just miss it Dave (Mick)?

 

With regard to zoom this is using a fixed 135mm F2.8 lens - but it did need a T20 on medium power for headshot rabbits:

Edited March 15, 2015 by Dave-G

[mick miller]

It was all on here Dave, you clearly didn't look hard enough. I just didn't try to promote or sell it other than to friends. I definitely steered clear of the nv forum cliques!