Gordon R Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I suspect the majority of people would share that sentiment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I disagree with capital punishment, I always have and always will. There should be no place for state sponsored murder in this day and age. On the subject of drugs, there is only a market for drugs because use them, simple. Efforts would be better spend understanding why so many Indonesian people feel the need to turn to drugs and do more to address the root cause. If you fail to deal with the root of the problem, executing their suppliers isn't going to solve a damn thing. P.S. This is supposed to be a forum of responsible, law abiding, and hopefully level headed licensed firearms holders, sadly some of you aren't giving that impression at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) I disagree with capital punishment, I always have and always will. There should be no place for state sponsored murder in this day and age. On the subject of drugs, there is only a market for drugs because use them, simple. Efforts would be better spend understanding why so many Indonesian people feel the need to turn to drugs and do more to address the root cause. If you fail to deal with the root of the problem, executing their suppliers isn't going to solve a damn thing. P.S. This is supposed to be a forum of responsible, law abiding, and hopefully level headed licensed firearms holders, sadly some of you aren't giving that impression at all. so because we have a different opinion to yourself about the death penalty for drug traffickers,,makes all of us non level headed firearm holders ? how do you come to that conclusion also why are we not law abiding for having an opinion Edited April 29, 2015 by evo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 so because we have a different opinion to yourself about the death penalty for drug traffickers,,makes all of us non level headed firearm holders ? how do you come to that conclusion also why are we not law abiding for having an opinion Just have a think how an anti might read some of the comments on this thread... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) evo - sadly, a difference of opinion is sufficient for some to stick label on you - and a not very nice one at that. Are antis also against the death penalty? Bit of a quantum leap in logic. Edited April 29, 2015 by Gordon R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) evo - sadly, a difference of opinion is sufficient for some to stick label on you - and a not very nice one at that. Are antis also against the death penalty? Bit of a quantum leap in logic. Not a quantum leap at all if you think about it. I haven't labelled anyone, I just suggested some may view some of the comments and opinions on this thread as being incompatible with the values many might expect of a licensed firearms holder. Edited April 29, 2015 by MartynGT4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Just have a think how an anti might read some of the comments on this thread... I personally don't care what an anti reads, I am law abiding, but that still does not change my opinion that those traffickers got what they knew was coming to them , it is that country,s law so if they don't abide by that then they will face a firing squad, greed greed greed that's what they do it for, they are not interested in what misery it causes what they do as long as they have money and a flash lifestyle,, if any anti,s disagree with my opinion then that's their choice but it doesn,t make them or me a law breaking person as you suggested no matter what opinion we have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Not a quantum leap at all if you think about it. I haven't labelled anyone, I just suggested some may view some of the comments and opinions on this thread as being incompatible with the values many might expect of a licensed firearms holder. I thought the only qualities you had to have was being honest and law abiding,there is nothing wrong with having strong opinions on any subject Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I personally don't care what an anti reads, I am law abiding, but that still does not change my opinion that those traffickers got what they knew was coming to them , it is that country,s law so if they don't abide by that then they will face a firing squad, greed greed greed that's what they do it for, they are not interested in what misery it causes what they do as long as they have money and a flash lifestyle,, if any anti,s disagree with my opinion then that's their choice but it doesn,t make them or me a law breaking person as you suggested no matter what opinion we have I haven't said you've broken the law or not now have I. The point I was making, and I wasn't picking on you, was that some of the comments and opinions in this thread might give a bad impression, especially for people entrusted to hold firearms. The fact that you don't care what an anti reads only enforces my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I thought the only qualities you had to have was being honest and law abiding,there is nothing wrong with having strong opinions on any subject Depends what that opinion is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 holding a firearm does not preclude that person from having an opinion. It in no way effects their ability to legally own a gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Depends what that opinion is. I have it sussed - any opinion other than the poster's. Very blinkered. :whistling: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 holding a firearm does not preclude that person from having an opinion. It in no way effects their ability to legally own a gun. Did I say it effects their ability to legally own a gun? I have it sussed - any opinion other than the poster's. Very blinkered. :whistling: Pot kettle black Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Depends what that opinion is. Again ,if it is within the law that opinion can be anything you choose.you do not have to become subservient to the authorities just because you have been granted a firearms certificate.In life i generally find that people who are willing to stand up and say what they think are the people most content with themselves because they have no worry about what someone else might be thinking. Be yourself, not what you think others want you to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Again ,if it is within the law that opinion can be anything you choose.you do not have to become subservient to the authorities just because you have been granted a firearms certificate.In life i generally find that people who are willing to stand up and say what they think are the people most content with themselves because they have no worry about what someone else might be thinking. Be yourself, not what you think others want you to be. You're perfectly free to have any opinion you wish, I just have an opinion that some opinions are probably best not shared on a public forum. I am standing up and saying what I think, I have no fear what anyone on here may think about that and I'm quite content with myself thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 It is interesting that a few posters have intimated that a strongly held opinion is somehow counter to a behaviour expected of a firearms holder. I think I can understand where they are coming from and why, but it saddens me a little that it seems we almost need to be apologetic (not the right word, but a better one escapes me for now, maybe subservient) and somehow discount our own opinions for fear of offending or inflaming others who are anti firearm ownership. If an opinion is well informed and reasoned then we should never back away from expressing that for fear of offending others, there in lies the roots of fascism. Sure express opinions sensitively as deliberately seeking to offend is ignorant, but someone finding offence in something is very different to intent to offend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 You're perfectly free to have any opinion you wish, I just have an opinion that some opinions are probably best not shared on a public forum. I am standing up and saying what I think, I have no fear what anyone on here may think about that and I'm quite content with myself thanks But you seem to be concerned about what others may say,why do you worry about other peoples thoughts on subjects? they are not your thoughts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 But you seem to be concerned about what others may say,why do you worry about other peoples thoughts on subjects? they are not your thoughts I am concerned that the things some people are saying on this thread reflect badly on our community and sport. Is that so wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) It is interesting that a few posters have intimated that a strongly held opinion is somehow counter to a behaviour expected of a firearms holder. I think I can understand where they are coming from and why, but it saddens me a little that it seems we almost need to be apologetic (not the right word, but a better one escapes me for now, maybe subservient) and somehow discount our own opinions for fear of offending or inflaming others who are anti firearm ownership. If an opinion is well informed and reasoned then we should never back away from expressing that for fear of offending others, there in lies the roots of fascism. Sure express opinions sensitively as deliberately seeking to offend is ignorant, but someone finding offence in something is very different to intent to offend. I agree with much of what you have said here. I accept there probably hasn't been an intention to offend but we also have to respect the fact that public opinion of the shooting community should be important to us all and, intentions aside, expressing what some may consider to be incompatible extreme opinions is likely to do our community more harm than good. Edited April 29, 2015 by MartynGT4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 Some have strong opinions for the death penalty some against and some not so sure,that in general is a cross section of society,and shows we have a healthy debate going,if you worry about how this is going pop over to the ARRSE forum go into the NAFFI bar section,you will probably think that no soldier should be let lose with a plastic knife and fork let alone a rifle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I get where you're coming from Martyn, but I don't draw a link between the two. You could argue having a very conservative view towards crime and punishment is perhaps all the more compatible with firearm ownership, it demonstrate, very strongly, respect for the law and the consequences of breaking it. It does make for a good discussion though, but probably one that warrants its own thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) If anyone thinks they can solve the worlds drugs problems on this thread then good luck I personally think it's time for a change - when people say 'war on drugs' these days they do so with the full knowledge it can't be won and that there's been no progress in curbing drug supply or consumption in the last 40 years. The definition of madness is doing the same thing time and again and each time hoping for a different result. And yet the prisons continue to fill up, a few mules got shot this week and the bad guys crack on and keep getting rich. As an aside, word on the street is that the new roadside drug testing kits are the prelude to a relaxation on cannabis. Maybe the way the government can cut the deficit is by copying Colorado eh? Edited April 29, 2015 by Mungler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartynGT4 Posted April 29, 2015 Report Share Posted April 29, 2015 I get where you're coming from Martyn, but I don't draw a link between the two. You could argue having a very conservative view towards crime and punishment is perhaps all the more compatible with firearm ownership, it demonstrate, very strongly, respect for the law and the consequences of breaking it. It does make for a good discussion though, but probably one that warrants its own thread. That is another way of looking at it. I agree with you, but perhaps there is a line where that conservative view crosses into territory which increasingly becomes less compatible? Either way, It would be a good discussion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fagus Sylvatica Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 Below is an extract taken from The Sydney Morning Herald, pertaining to the execution of the Brazilian prisoner; Rodrigo Gularte who had been diagnosed with schizophrenia in his teens, long before he committed the crime. Do you think he deserved to be shot ? Father Charles Burrows, who provided spiritual guidance to condemned Brazilian man Rodrigo Gularte, said the men met their fate without blindfolds, staring straight ahead. "Everyone was looking forward, it seems everyone accepted their fate," Father Burrows said. He said it was difficult because Gularte, who was diagnosed with schizophrenia when he was a teenager, was mentally ill. Gularte talked to animals and was afraid of electromagnetic waves from satellites watching him above his prison on the island of Nusakambangan. In his deluded state, he believed Indonesia had abolished capital punishment and established a prisoner extradition agreement with Brazil, which meant he could go home next year. "We didn't think [the execution] would happen," Father Burrows said. "It is finished. It's all done." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted April 30, 2015 Report Share Posted April 30, 2015 His delusion seemed very specific about offences he was committing. :hmm: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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