propercartridges Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 None of the shot looks as good as Proper Cartridges lead shot , don't know where Hull get there lead from ,but I think express comes from Turkey , the express shot looked better than the others , Hull shot was not very shiny and quite black my components are the best money can buy in the standard form the hight of brass I am told does nothing in the ballistics but even when I open a box I like to see big brass but at the end of the day you r putting that empty case in the bin my shot and every pellet I have bought to make over 6 years and 18 000 000 cartridges has been tower dropped shot not the short drop blieminster system and you can see it really shows my cases are cheddite with cx2000 primer wads are again guilandi or b p or cheddite powders pb Clermont vectan and cz explosia if you want copper or nickel shot add about 600 euros per ton so I think I give good value for money thanks George 07714 323 909 powered by vectan make it count Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
propercartridges Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 What's the quantity of powder in each cartridge. Looking on Express cartridges the English sporter is a less powder softer slightly slower shooting Power Red. Superfasts will be the same as other cartridges by Hull and as for one gram less lead shot, the tolerances allowed can leave a 28g cart at 27g or 29g figgy not to get into a cartridge lead amount but when I was loading cartridges for peter Wilson the Olympic gold medal winner at double trap we were told that it was half a gram either way so 27.5 or 28.49 pherhaps somebody on here can correct me thanks George powered by vectan make it count tel 07714 323 909 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
widgeon man Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 International cartridge testing that is correct George, same for 24g. However most cartridges( sporting, club carts, game carts) I doubt are this exact! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisPCarter Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 I do think we get ripped off with "game" cartridges which are just the same, only half a shot size larger and suddenly they are nearly double the price. I'm sure there's a lot more to it than just the same powder, wad and primer though. There's cases, crimp types and then the quality and hardness of shot, shot coatings, care in assembly, tollerances and overall quality giving consistent results. There must be a lot more waste when manufacturing the top cartridges that have to meet higher quality standards. After spending a few hours at the weekend pattern testing about 15 different cartridges in 12 and 20 bore I certainly noticed the difference with the mid to top price cartridges. They gave more even, denser and tighter patterns and felt nicer to shoot too. Am I good enough to make use of that difference? Probably not right now but I'd like to know I'm using the best I can afford. When I miss I'd like to KNOW it was my fault and not because I used a **** cartridge. I'd never buy the top of the range but I choose the best I can for my limited budget. If I'm just having a blast and don't care about results then I'll bring out the really cheap stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 it is very easy to get +/-5% specs with carts. cook Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonepark Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 My favourite pigeon (clay or live) cartridge is white gold, no8it for clays and no7.5it for live, but they also kill rabbits, crows, pheasants and woodcock very nicely as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
propercartridges Posted April 19, 2016 Report Share Posted April 19, 2016 Did a bit of investergation tonight how about this take a look at the four cartridges on the left is an express English Sporter , next on the right is is a Hull soveringn , Next on the right is a Hull pro one then last a Hull Pro one DTL .All the same powder ,All the same wad, all Hull the same primer . The price are per 1000 1, Express English Sporter £139 2, Hull Soverign £236 3, Hull Pro-one £225 4, Hull DTL300. £220 Do you think we are being ripped off ? Can a primer and 6 mm more brass make £97 difference hey deershooter watch that powder does not go in your tea watch you don't get a few flakes in your sugar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figgy Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 George your right per the .5 of a gram either way. That's my point 27g carts are not always 1g less shot the could have around the same or be 2g different. Budget clay carts are the biggest market, maybe not the most proffit per slab but large volumes make it worth while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deershooter Posted April 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 figgy not to get into a cartridge lead amount but when I was loading cartridges for peter Wilson the Olympic gold medal winner at double trap we were told that it was half a gram either way so 27.5 or 28.49 pherhaps somebody on here can correct me thanks George powered by vectan make it count tel 07714 323 909 Don't understand this one George look at double trap rules As with all Olympic disciplines (Double trap, Olympic Trap & Olympic Skeet), approved cartridges must have a maximum load of 24 grammes with a shot size no greater that 2.5mm (No7)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted April 21, 2016 Report Share Posted April 21, 2016 It's called Marketing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anser2 Posted April 23, 2016 Report Share Posted April 23, 2016 (edited) Not defending cartridge makers , but a big part of the difference in costs between game and clay shells is economics of scale. Far more clay cartridges than game cartridges are sold so the makers can load in bulk with long runs without having the change the loading components. ie its cheaper to make half a million clay shells of the same load ( per cartridge ) than 100,000 game shells. Edited April 24, 2016 by anser2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisPCarter Posted April 23, 2016 Report Share Posted April 23, 2016 Not defending cartridge makers , but a bog part of the difference in costs between game and clay shells is economics of scale. Far more clay cartridges than game cartridges are sold so the makers can load in bulk with long runs without having the change the loading components. ie its cheaper to make half a million clay shells of the same load ( per cartridge ) than 100,000 game shells. Yes I've noticed with 20 gauge cartridges (these are mainly "game" types) that everything from around 23g to 30g in different wads and shot sizes there is only about £15 a slab difference between the cheapest and most expensive. I can only put this down to the fact that they are all short runs whatever they are making so the overall quality is better and the actual component cost doesn't make so much of a difference. If you compare it to 12 bore clay and game stuff it varies from about £45 to £95 a slab - a £50 difference, yet there's the same amount of shot etc in them as the 20 gauge versions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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