Non lead testing

[Mice!]

I realise this won't be of interest to many, but as I've done some testing I thought I'll post it anyway. 

I did a lot of reading and followed topics on lead free pellets when there was a chance the lead ban may have come in.

I've got one permission that now requires lead free, and a possible new place to shoot that would need to be lead free as well. 

Now I didn't read much positive about non lead pellets,  but I hadn't tried any till last month,  I'd been given samples in .177 but the pellets didn't look great, and I wasn't willing to mess with the accuracy of my .177 rifle.

The .177 pellets are seriously light 4-6 grains, so I did some more reading and looked at what's available in .22 as I have a spare rifle, as you do.

Looking at pellet weights and what was available I bought samples of H&N Barracuda (12.4g) and JSB Exacts (10.75). One article I read said the pellets can be very dry compared to lead and suggested adding some lube, so that's what I did.

Both pellets looked brilliant,  and I wanted the heavier pellet to be the more accurate. 

To start off I was only shooting at 16mtrs,  not a lot of use I know, but my garden was wet through so this was the max safe range I could get without trampling up and the wet grass.

It's fair to say I was very surprised, I zeroed with lead then started shooting the H&N, changed pellets and the target and shot some of the JSBs and the group was tighter, now lead free isn't supposed to group, I've seen posts from folk putting up far worse groups and saying how good a gun is grouping.

Now zoom in on the pellets,  a big factor with these pellets is they don't brake up, my normal backstop is a few sheets of lead over a thermalight block, and other than rifling marks the pellets look untouched!! They have cut the lead to bits and York chunks out of the block, lead does not do this.

This is a few sheets of lead shot from a few metres setting the power on a .177 AA 410

All stopped dead, then bellow is the lead free shot at 20 & 25mtrs. 

They have cut clean through the lead, then been stopped by the block, my guess is shooting against a normal metal pellet catcher the pellets are going to be pinging everywhere!!!!

After I'd done the test at 16mtrs,  a few weeks afterwards I also shot some dead squirrels,  I just positioned the squirrels in front of the above targets and took a single shot, each one punched straight through    ( live squirrels won't sit nicely for you 😉)

It was almost a month before I got around to doing further testing, and I'd also bought some bags to shoot off, wow what a difference they make, I normally get a small amount of movement with my heart beat but on the sand filled bags nothing.

I set up, adjusted the scope then took the first shots, I'm using an old Webley Axsor,  the head position is very fussy on this gun, and the trigger could do with being a bit lighter, but I've not really messed with it yet.

Starting at 20mtrs,  three pellets through practically the same hole 😳 that'll do, then back to 25mtrs. I set my squirrel feeders between 20- 25mtrs so that's the accuracy I'm needing. 

Red areas points to the direction cardboard was when shooting.

I was hitting a bit low, wasn't quite settled on the first few shots, but again the pellets were grouping, settled in ( the mag doesn't load smoothly,  takes a bit of force to close, this is with any pellets,  it's the same with an empty mag)

I finished off with the Red dot in the middle,  two dots @25 metres, dot is 13mm

The pellets shot so well I'm tempted to try them through the Rapid,  but anytime I've tried a pellet it doesn't like its only ever been one shot, you can feel when this gun doesn't like a pellet.

To say I'm pleased is an understatement and shocked, these at least are accurate and the H&N might well tighten up given chance.

I shot two pellets over the chrono, being the weight of a .20 pellet I was expecting them to be going really fast, but they were going 640 ish,  giving about 10.9 ft/lb ( I did write the figures down, 643 & 646 I think?)

It's worth saying again if you got this far, be careful where you shoot non lead, it's a definite risk of ricochet, and I'd be surprised if ranges allow it.

So now I need to order more pellets,  then the final test, which is shooting squirrels off a feeder.

Hopefully this is of interest to a few of you 👍

[Weihrauch17]

Great write up and very interesting findings, like you I had only read very bad things about none Lead pellets.

[Mice!]

57 minutes ago, Weihrauch17 said:

Great write up and very interesting findings, like you I had only read very bad things about none Lead pellets.

Thanks, from reading others posts and articles I'd expect the .177 to be going too fast and be unstable,  but some have had success with them.

But I don't like really light weight pellets, the .22 weighing what a .20 weighs fits the bill.

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, good post 👍 never thought of trying lead free pellets yet but your testing looked very interesting, 👍

[Mice!]

13 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, good post 👍 never thought of trying lead free pellets yet but your testing looked very interesting, 👍

Cheers mate, I think you'd have to have a reason to use them, my guess is you'd have to be extra careful around buildings or roofs, because they won't splat like a lead pellet would, ferals on girders are probably out of bounds, and it's these things that make air rifles so useful. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

4 hours ago, Mice! said:

Cheers mate, I think you'd have to have a reason to use them, my guess is you'd have to be extra careful around buildings or roofs, because they won't splat like a lead pellet would, ferals on girders are probably out of bounds, and it's these things that make air rifles so useful. 

Hello, What rifle were you using ? i use a P15 and FX Verminator in 22 , ratting mostly maybe a few greys and blackies this year if they become a pest in the grain store, what would be a good one try, my lead ones are JSB Jumbo,

[Mice!]

23 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, What rifle were you using ? i use a P15 and FX Verminator in 22 , ratting mostly maybe a few greys and blackies this year if they become a pest in the grain store, what would be a good one try, my lead ones are JSB Jumbo,

I'm using a Webley Axsor,  something else I've read off a few lads is that it can take a while getting the accuracy back after shooting non lead, it's not something that I would choose to do unless there was a good reason,  lead would be my first choice.

[Ultrastu]

Excellent write up  mice .I've not tried any .22 lead free  but agree they might be the way forward over .177 for energy retention. 

I've got in  lead free .177 .jsb exact . These shoot well from my bsa's as does the barracuda greens .energy is OK also around 10.5 fpe . 

But like you said the risk of ricochet   Is huge and Safety  glasses is a must at all times .I wouldn't use them un less forced to .

[Mice!]

6 hours ago, Ultrastu said:

Excellent write up  mice .I've not tried any .22 lead free  but agree they might be the way forward over .177 for energy retention. 

I've got in  lead free .177 .jsb exact . These shoot well from my bsa's as does the barracuda greens .energy is OK also around 10.5 fpe . 

But like you said the risk of ricochet   Is huge and Safety  glasses is a must at all times .I wouldn't use them un less forced to .

Cheers Stu,

I've read that the  .177 Exacts are good, but lads can't get hold of them now, I'm guessing with the lead ban not going ahead the companies don't see a need for the pellets?

Any idea of the FPS the .177 were doing,  I was concerned with the accuracy thinking the pellets would be going at silly speeds, and out of my Super Carbine I didn't expect them to be stable?

 

[Ultrastu]

840 fps  ish .not much faster than a falcon accuracy  plus at 7.4 grns . Which is no where  near the limit for stability .

I've get great accuracy  from jsb 8.4s at over 1000 fps  

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, Ultrastu said:

840 fps  ish .not much faster than a falcon accuracy  plus at 7.4 grns . Which is no where  near the limit for stability .

I've get great accuracy  from jsb 8.4s at over 1000 fps  

That's interesting,  I thought being so light they'd be a lot quicker, but I guess the material sapps the speed not being as efficient through the barrel.

Then with them being so light in  .177 I wondered if they'd get blown around. 

[Ultrastu]

6.8 grns isn't too light really 

I do have some 5 grn flat heads and they shoot pretty good out to 25 yds at around 900 fps 

[Mice!]

1 hour ago, Ultrastu said:

6.8 grns isn't too light really

Just a lot lighter than I want to be using mate, plus the lighter lead pellets are often shorter as well, which the R10 mag doesn't like.

[Ultrastu]

Fair enough.  The jsb lead free is the same shape,as the jsb heavy so its a longer pellet than usual same with the barracuda greens  same shape as the lead barracuda.  So will work fine in bsa mags . I couldn't say a fast .177 is going to ricochet less than a slower .22  as basically they will  all bounce about dangerously  . I have a lead sheet  back stop similar to yours and the  5 grn flat heads bounced out of it and back up to 20 yds  😳 .unless you have something like a pile of  grain  back stop or  soft soil /mud  I wouldn't use them . I've said before they should be banned on safety grounds . Maybe present this to your perm owners  .

You could always try copper coated pellets . Best of both worlds perhaps. 

[Mice!]

53 minutes ago, Ultrastu said:

have a lead sheet  back stop similar to yours and the  5 grn flat heads bounced out of it and back up to 20 yds  😳 .unless you have something like a pile of  grain  back stop or  soft soil /mud  I wouldn't use them . I've said before they should be banned on safety grounds . Maybe present this to your perm owners  .

You wouldn't expect that from a full powered rifle,  it's the sort of thing I get with the PP700W at 10mtrs knowing it's not even 6ft/lb

One place is to do with timber and out of their control,  the other the land owner wants the shot squirrels for his BOP and so wants non lead using 🤷‍♂️

[Ultrastu]

For the squirrels maybe use a heavy penetrating lead  .177  (so a jsb heavy or bismag) head shoot them .the pellet will go right through and if your not sure it has  ,just cut the head off before giving to the birds . Too simple really .

Not sure exactly  what the timber  business is .but traditionally any steel shot into trees is very bad for a the tree, but more so any machines that will cut the tree later   chain saws  milling machines etc .

Lead is soft so doesn't cause a problem .these lead free  tin zinc aloys  are almost as hard as steel. So have the same issues  😕.  

[Mice!]

8 hours ago, Ultrastu said:

For the squirrels maybe use a heavy penetrating lead  .177  (so a jsb heavy or bismag) head shoot them .the pellet will go right through and if your not sure it has  ,just cut the head off before giving to the birds . Too simple really .

Not sure exactly  what the timber  business is .but traditionally any steel shot into trees is very bad for a the tree, but more so any machines that will cut the tree later   chain saws  milling machines etc .

Lead is soft so doesn't cause a problem .these lead free  tin zinc aloys  are almost as hard as steel. So have the same issues  😕.  

I agree with everything you've said mate, and have already suggested it, most of my squirrels shot side on have the pellet pass through, but the bloke says lead is a no, and it's very close to home 😅

With the timber it's about there not being lead on the land, everything has gone non toxic, despite it having been used for how many years 🙄

[figgy]

Great that Mice nice to see some positivity for lead free options. Only by testing your own combo do you know what works and what doesn’t 👍

[Mice!]

4 hours ago, figgy said:

Great that Mice nice to see some positivity for lead free options. Only by testing your own combo do you know what works and what doesn’t 👍

Cheers mate, I read some good reviews online, but like you say you have to try for yourself,  I read comments from some saying that the accuracy was unusable for squirrels or live quarry,  I may have just got lucky?? 

[figgy]

Some seek one hole group for every type of shooting. So long as accurate enough to the job humanly it’s all I look for.  
I find all pellets from the last few years a bit iffy, get a good batch for your barrel great but most are only ok. 
 

Goid that you found some that work in yours 👍