daystate 177 Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 When out with Max to and from the field I put him on his lead a chocker lead as was told this would stop him but all it does is make him pant so every few meters I'm stopping to rest him, is there a better way to get him to walk to heel or at least slow down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbird Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) Omg there's nothing worse than being taken for a drag!! I've just sorted out a dedicated lead puller for a chap and in two days she is now walking beautifully off lead past noisy machinery, other dogs and through fields of sheep as well. How I do it (May not suit all dogs) and will take time. Get rid of the choke chain, blooming awful things and get a slip lead. Make sure the slip lead is put on the correct way so that any pressure is taken off as soon as the lead goes slack. One easy way to do it is this. Have the dog sit and stay beside you. Take one step forward, leaving the dog at stay. Pat your leg saying 'heel' or whatever it is you say. Encourage the dog to come beside you and sit it again. (Do not yank on the lead and say 'heel' at the same time because that often teaches the dog that 'heel' means he's going to get a yank and therefore to really put his back into pushing against it - what do you do if somebody pulls you back? You resist.) Tell him what a marvellous little munchkin he is. Give him a tiny treat if that's his thing. Increase the distance gradually but every time the little blighter begins to pull sit and stay him again. Be prepared, this will be a LOT to begin with. Also work in some turns, ie sit the dog beside you and do a stride or to to one side or the other. Stop and call him to heel. This forces him to keep his attention on you and is a little bit more interesting for him. Whilst all this is going on do not allow the dog to sniff at the ground, this is his version of two fingers, 'I'm not really interested in what you have to say' type thing. He must be focused on you and looking at you often. When the dog is walking in the right position a big 'good BOY and a treat as you are walking along will let him know what he's doing is the correct thing at that exact point in time. TIMING is the key here, plus dont lean down to him, have him reach up a little for it or he'll just try and scoot along faster forward to reach your hand, if you get me? (Don't worry, treats can be totally phased out, they're just a tool to let the dog be confident that what he's doing is right.) This has the added benefit that he should also learn to sit when you stop as well. If on the way to the field he starts to pull uncontrollably and is doing your fruit take him home OR sit and stay him whilst you walk ahead a few yards, take a few deep breaths, count to ten and try and control the urge to shoot the little darling. When you're calm then call him to your side or better still go back to him, give him a tickle under the chin ( after all, he has been a good boy for sitting and staying, and we don't want him to associate that with anything negative or feel insecure - that's how creepers are made) and bring him to heel again. Ideally, if you have time, retrace your steps back with him so he learns that pulling quite literally gets him nowhere. I'm not sure if I've explained this very well and there are squill ions of different ways of doing it but hope it helps anyway. I love teaching dogs to walk nicely at heel lol Edited February 27, 2015 by bigbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazbev Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 Nice one, some great tips there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkshireandy Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 I have a large dog and had issues with this for a while. It didn't help that he was also stubborn. I had a police dog handler/trainer help me with my dog. I used a slip lead to correct his pulling too. If you are unsure how to fit it properly I'll tell you what I do. Get one that has the leather stopper on the lead like Ancol have on their leads (or something similar). Put the slip lead over the dogs head and ensure it is high up the dogs neck just behind the jaw line. There is a slight indentation in the dog where its neck muscles end and the jaw/head starts. This is where the lead should sit firmly so it doesnt slip down. If it slips down the neck it starts to pull on the chest area where the dog is strong and encourages him to pull. Once you have the lead on correctly and out walking there should be no tension on the lead when the dog is walking where you want them. If the dog starts to pull say NO! in a firm voice and then give a correction on the lead. A correction would be a short sharp tug with the lead across your body (as if pulling from your hip to opposite shoulder). This will pull the dog towards you under control as you will have control of the dogs head and not trying to fight his whole body weight. keep doing this every time the dog pulls but relax the lead after a correction and when the dog is doing what you want. Also initially praise the dog when he is doing what you want with a treat or pat/stroke. You need to reinforce the good behavior that they show. Nothing will work instantly or after 1 session, its takes time and patience from yourself to get this right. Don't lose your temper as its not the dogs fault if he doesn't understand something they haven't been trained to do. As mentioned above its all about timing with dogs and the effort you put in will be rewarded with a dog that does what you ask. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbird Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) There you go, advice from opposite ends of the spectrum Hopefully one of them or something in between will sort you out Edited February 27, 2015 by bigbird Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daystate 177 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 Thanks all my bad the lead is a slip lead with a rubber stop that can be moved I will try him on this training 1st thing was thinking I'd need roller skates and just hold on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbird Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 Thanks all my bad the lead is a slip lead with a rubber stop that can be moved I will try him on this training 1st thing was thinking I'd need roller skates and just hold on! Good luck! You'll only get out what you put in, hopefully soon your Heelwork will be putting us all to shame :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkshireandy Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 You can PM me or give me a call if you want any help or info. Happy to help Daystate 177 I know what its like to have a dog that is hard work (mine is a 8 stone american Bulldog who now walks to heel.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayano3 Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 I often see a guy with a young spaniel doing lead work on my way to work. He was using a long lead and was spinning the lead slowly in front of him and the dog if you get the picture. I've not used this method myself but I guess it would discourage the dog from pulling. I much prefer the gentle approach myself and bigbird seems to have it right in my eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul223 Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 As with all things it's easier to start off being nice, taking the 'more flies with honey' approach, then if that does not work going harder, start off hard and it's difficult to change back to a softly softly approach Personally id go with bigbirds way, encourage rather than beast, it's a better way to train Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michufc Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 When out with Max to and from the field I put him on his lead a chocker lead as was told this would stop him but all it does is make him pant so every few meters I'm stopping to rest him, is there a better way to get him to walk to heel or at least slow down hi matey hope you are all well and max is doing well his sister used to pull on the lead as well like made for a little bit then did one on one training with her sat her up and said heel as i moved off and always started with my left foot forward first once she went past my leg she was told no short little tug on the lead and changed directions soon as she was by my side again told her heel and repeated until i could get her to walk round the block off the lesd but like big bird says it takes time. it made me sick keep turning in different directions nearly left a mess on the pavement lol i have seen people yank there dog to do back flips and give the attitude of they will get the message but there are lot softer ways matey. all the best mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosd Posted February 27, 2015 Report Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) Like one of the previous posters have said. This will give you quick results as he won't pull if a slip lead is used high on his neck and just behind the ears. When you correct him you should simply say NO and a quick correction via the lead. I've seen people keep saying heal. Confuses the dog and associates it with doing something wrong. heal should be used when you tell him what you want, the NO command if he is doing it wrong. Mine was quite tough to get to heal but this worked very quickly and he is now pretty good. Edited February 27, 2015 by Cosd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee-kinsman Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) I think before any correction takes place it is important to be sure the dog understands "heel". Stop taking him to a place that he associates with play and freedom and countless stimulants like scent, birds, other people and dogs and teach him to walk to heel in your garden or home. I use a piece of cheese I can hold in my hand and the dog can just nibble when I close my fist round it. Show the cheese to the dog and bring your hand into your leg, the dog should follow the cheese, with the cheese in your hand place your hand firmly on the side of your leg and as he gets into the position of heel say heel and take a few steps. If you are holding the cheese correctly the dog should be just able to lick and nibble at the edge. Take five steps and stop telling your dog to sit as you stop, your dog might move to the front, gentle but firm reposition the dog to your side ensuring the he remaims sat and reward him with a little piece of cheese. Continue with the exercise for 5 mins, do that twice a day at the most and theres no need to take the dog for any other walk, in order to succeed it is important to remove any contradictions to what you are teaching or temptations to ignore, keep the dog on the lead to help keep his attention however if you start somewhere like your garden or in your house you shouldn't need the lead, the cheese will be incentive to remain in the heel position. All the best, Lee P.S. I'm only in Swadlincote if you fancy meeting for a clearer demo of what I'm saying. Edited February 28, 2015 by lee-kinsman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E.w. Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 I have a large dog and had issues with this for a while. It didn't help that he was also stubborn. I had a police dog handler/trainer help me with my dog. I used a slip lead to correct his pulling too. If you are unsure how to fit it properly I'll tell you what I do. Get one that has the leather stopper on the lead like Ancol have on their leads (or something similar). Put the slip lead over the dogs head and ensure it is high up the dogs neck just behind the jaw line. There is a slight indentation in the dog where its neck muscles end and the jaw/head starts. This is where the lead should sit firmly so it doesnt slip down. If it slips down the neck it starts to pull on the chest area where the dog is strong and encourages him to pull. Once you have the lead on correctly and out walking there should be no tension on the lead when the dog is walking where you want them. If the dog starts to pull say NO! in a firm voice and then give a correction on the lead. A correction would be a short sharp tug with the lead across your body (as if pulling from your hip to opposite shoulder). This will pull the dog towards you under control as you will have control of the dogs head and not trying to fight his whole body weight. keep doing this every time the dog pulls but relax the lead after a correction and when the dog is doing what you want. Also initially praise the dog when he is doing what you want with a treat or pat/stroke. You need to reinforce the good behavior that they show. Nothing will work instantly or after 1 session, its takes time and patience from yourself to get this right. Don't lose your temper as its not the dogs fault if he doesn't understand something they haven't been trained to do. As mentioned above its all about timing with dogs and the effort you put in will be rewarded with a dog that does what you ask. +1 this is by far the best advise I've trained dogs for a long time and use the same method works every time, I have never given a dog treats whilst training as this can lead to problems later on in there training reward for the dog is praise and stroke him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee-kinsman Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 As with other training methods they can all lead to problems later on if not used discriminately. Yanking a dog on the lead that doesn't understand the position of heel can lead to a dog that nervously lags behind. I'd start positively to teach the expectation then use firmer methods for correction when you are certain the dog understands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subsonicnat Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 It All Starts at the Beginning: HEEL///SIT/// STAY///. If you cannot read the alphabet, You Will Never Learn Anything.. people tug gently at the dog and it means nothing, A training school taught me that.. Your voice and (1) good Yank, is all it takes.. When the lady in question had my very over wheight LAB, jumped up me as it came past me sitting on a bench, after its feet left the ground, she was only about 4ft 6". when it came past again, it never even looked at me. That dog was walking to heel within 1 week, NO I did not have to repeat the said correction, but it remembered it very clearly. Used to know a bloke who bit the dogs ear till it bled, He ruined the dog doing that, it cowered every time it was let out the van.. That is NOT the way to go, let it know who the boss is ONCE, and ONCE ONLY. Your voice is the way to the dogs behaviour, gentle does it from then on, soft when very good, harsh when Wrong.. Even Humans respond to this, try it on the misses.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbird Posted February 28, 2015 Report Share Posted February 28, 2015 I think before any correction takes place it is important to be sure the dog understands "heel". Stop taking him to a place that he associates with play and freedom and countless stimulants like scent, birds, other people and dogs and teach him to walk to heel in your garden or home. I use a piece of cheese I can hold in my hand and the dog can just nibble when I close my fist round it. Show the cheese to the dog and bring your hand into your leg, the dog should follow the cheese, with the cheese in your hand place your hand firmly on the side of your leg and as he gets into the position of heel say heel and take a few steps. If you are holding the cheese correctly the dog should be just able to lick and nibble at the edge. Take five steps and stop telling your dog to sit as you stop, your dog might move to the front, gentle but firm reposition the dog to your side ensuring the he remaims sat and reward him with a little piece of cheese. Continue with the exercise for 5 mins, do that twice a day at the most and theres no need to take the dog for any other walk, in order to succeed it is important to remove any contradictions to what you are teaching or temptations to ignore, keep the dog on the lead to help keep his attention however if you start somewhere like your garden or in your house you shouldn't need the lead, the cheese will be incentive to remain in the heel position. All the best, Lee P.S. I'm only in Swadlincote if you fancy meeting for a clearer demo of what I'm saying. Lee knows his stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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