Baldrick Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 We took delivery of 2,750 Norfolk Black turkeys earlier this summer, to rear for Christmas, to help out a well known turkey supplier in Essex. They are cooped up immediately in front of our farm office in a large copse, surrounded by 4'-high stock mesh on (1.5" x 1.5" softwood) fence posts. The fencing was recommended by the supplier of the birds. We've managed to keep on top of disease issues and the birds seem to be faring well. Checking on the birds on Tuesday morning was a little more eventful than usual: 58 turkey carcasses strewn across the adjoining crop of winter wheat, three fenceposts snapped clean off at ground level and the wire mesh fencing flattened into the mud, plus about 900 turkeys bimbling around on the adjoining fields (what a fun job that was, rounding that lot up...). My first instinct was of course to blame it on poachers, vandals or some other human intervention. However we are on heavy clay soil here and have had little rain since Monday, and as such, any human footprint or 4x4 tyre print would be clearly obvious. Furthermore we have CCTV on the only access point leading to this copse, and the farm manager and I were both working in the farm office until gone midnight last night, with the blinds up. We didn't see any lights or hear any noise whatsoever. There was no sign of humans around that fenceline, and believe me, I checked thoroughly at first light. What was clearly evident was badger tracks - hundreds of little pawprints, all over the flattened fence and leading right into the turkey's enclosure. None of the other sections of fence had been knocked down, nor burrowed under. The turkeys' food was strewn everywhere - and I mean like someone had packed the feeders with C4 explosive. Badgers don't strp carcasses like the ones we found - that can only be pinned on foxes. There were a lot of fresh fox tracks evident, again leading in and out of the enclosure. Needless to say we have ripped out all the fencing today, hooked a post borer up to a tractor and put in fenceposts good enough to withstand cattle. Is it beyond the realms of possibility that badgers could break down a fence to get access to (some fairly pungent) poultry feed? Has anybody ever encountered anything like this with rearing pens or free-range poultry units? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Elvis Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 :look: Dude thats a ****** but yes and recently. I have a new boss who is an old student of mine from waaaaay back.She has a small holding on Canvey island. She has the best chicken coop i have ever seen, seriously heavy duty wire, lovely coop/shed, nicley made, however a badger got his claws in and wedged apart the shed itself .......now i dont know if the badgers killed all the chickens, 50 odd, but the dmage getting in was defo badger, you should see the claw marks on the shed.There are a lot of badgers there, not to mention "Friendly" foxes that other people in the stable feed!!!! Offers of a cull(foxes of course) were greeted with looks of horror...except for from my boss!! :look: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackbart Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I think the fence posts are a bit flimsy at 1.5 x1.5 and the fence aint high enough to keep charlie out at only 4 foot high.I would be suprised still,if a billy could snap three posts off if they were covered in mesh as that would take a lot of pressure.I know they are destructive but that is a different kind of damage to digging or breaking into a shed which they are very good at. I suppose it will be too difficult to do a head count as i would guess it was man made and then billy and charlie took advantage afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapwing Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 Bit off on timing maybe but any chance it might have been a young roebuck snapping the posts, with opportunistic thievery by the subterranean brigade after the event? Sounds to have been a tiresome and expensive nights activity. (I wont suggest building a henge round the copse and wiring it in until next grockle season) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 Bit off on timing maybe but any chance it might have been a young roebuck snapping the posts, with opportunistic thievery by the subterranean brigade after the event? Sounds to have been a tiresome and expensive nights activity. (I wont suggest building a henge round the copse and wiring it in until next grockle season) Nope, there's no roe in that area. Absolutely sure of it. But a henge may work. Do you know a reliable supplier of monoliths and menhirs who could quote for the work (please don't say Asterix and Obelix)? Yes, the fenceposts were clearly insufficient, but regarding the height of the fence, we hadn't had a single problem with foxes til this week (and the turkeys have been in situ for months). We reared 750 turkeys last year, in a smaller enclosure surrounded by poly netting on bumble pins - not one loss to foxes, mysteriously. I'm less concerned about the foxes, my good friend Mr Nosler having caught up with two of them last night. It's more the destruction caused by the badgers. The copse is near to two badger setts, including the one in the graveyard that I have ranted about before. Having had an inexperienced harvest worker arrested and cautioned in 2007 for an accidental spillage of slug pellets (which killed two badgers), we cannot afford to get caught fighting back against the little black and white tossers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I still like the three 'S' method. I'm sure you have a backhoe which makes a deep hole. I don't have any direct experience with badgers aside from tripping over a dead one in the field once. But given the stories, their physical abilities, and what I've seen in documentaries on them, I wouldnt put it past them for what you're seeing. Thanks Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 stupid question here but why isn't it all linked up to the biggest mains electric fencer you can lay your hands on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I still like the three 'S' method. I'm sure you have a backhoe which makes a deep hole. We have a 22-tonne 360 excavator on the farm, which is big enough to dig some fairly large holes. We also have a fully-suppressed .308 with an Archer sight... stupid question here but why isn't it all linked up to the biggest mains electric fencer you can lay your hands on? It's an odd situation where the owner of the birds (the vendor) supplied all the housing, feed and other materials, and we (the farm) provide the labour. However, under the contract, we still have a duty to supply 2,000 turkeys on 21st December, and we have to pay the cost of any shortfall in numbers. Hence we're keen to prevent any more incidents, without having to fork out for electric fencing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 by my reckoning you've already lost 3K of turkeys or there abouts can't you rob an energiser and some wire from a pheasant pen which shouldn't be needed now, even buying new for the few hundred pounds it would cost its the only really effective means of control Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 No, we've lost somebody else £3k of turkeys. We only have to reach into our pockets if we fail to supply the agreed quota. Having talked to the supplier, we are getting a lot less deaths due to disease/weather than other farms, so providing we nip the vermin problem in the bud, we won't be any worse off. That sounds a little blasé, I grant you, but there is no way we are dabbling in any other weird livestock enterprises ever again after this Christmas. No badger is going to overcome today's new stock-proof fencing, and if we keep the fox population at bay, we should meet the quota. Driving through the village (in the direction of the bonfire) in the JCB loadall with the bucket full of decomposing and mangled turkeys got a few odd looks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavman Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 did you get any pics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I wouldn't talk too soon, badgers get through most fences, I saw a weld mesh one the other day they'd pushed up. Still as long as its acceptable losses thats good still seems strange to keep birds without electric fencing to keep the predators away. But hey you couldn't want for a better fox magnet for some cracking shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 did you get any pics? I didn't, but the farm manager took some. I will try to locate them. I wouldn't talk too soon, badgers get through most fences, I saw a weld mesh one the other day they'd pushed up. Still as long as its acceptable losses thats good still seems strange to keep birds without electric fencing to keep the predators away. But hey you couldn't want for a better fox magnet for some cracking shooting Yes, I agree that a lack of electric fencing seems to be asking for trouble, but the supplier stated that it was not necessary. If they were my birds I would use Keepsafe fencing, dug deep, and on proper round posts, with two lines of electrified wire at nose height. And maybe a few Claymore AP mines on trip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George1990 Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I really fail to understand why badgers are a fully protected species. I think they've always been protected in my lifetime. Does anyone know the reason for the decision to protect them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 (edited) I really fail to understand why badgers are a fully protected species. I think they've always been protected in my lifetime. Does anyone know the reason for the decision to protect them? The Protection of Badgers Act 1992 was implemented to make gassing and/or digging setts a criminal offence, together with badger baiting. When the entire British cattle (and farmed venison) industry has collapsed, maybe the Act will be repealed. Even the prospect of a derogation in order to enable site-specific culls is pure fantasy, even if the Tories get in next May. I am all for a full-scale eradication of the species. They contribute absolutely ****-all to the natural environment. Edited October 16, 2009 by Baldrick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George1990 Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 The Protection of Badgers Act 1992 was implemented to make gassing and/or digging setts a criminal offence, together with badger baiting. But what was the reason for this? Were they in decline or something? It doesn't say you can't shoot them then :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baldrick Posted October 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 George, I haven't read the Act myself, but pointing a gun at a badger always leads to trouble. That is unless you have access to some earthmoving equipment, a landfill site or a verge on a motorway. Remember that it's a criminal offence to be in possession of a dead badger, including any part of a badger carcass. A close friend of mine is a vet in the local practice, and he has been requested by badger welfare lunatics to conduct post-mortem examinations of badgers found at the side of the road, to look for evidence that the badger was killed by means other than a chance encounter with a passing HGV. They are looking for copper/lead fragments within the carcass, evidence of Cymag/Carbofuran/metaldehyde (slug pellet)/paracetamol poisoning, mauling by dogs etc. The badger group local to me will happily pay a vet to conduct these examinations of intact carcasses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr salt Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 I like badgers , but they will kill chickens and turkeys,thats a fact. I dont shoot them, i have had chance ,but dont. If i kept birds that were being attacked and killed by them, things would be different. where i shoot there are no cows so the whole T.B thing is not worth going into. Anyway badgers only spread bofine tb (cow tb) which they cought from cattle in the first place. I dont think foxes and badgers work together,tho its a fact badgers will use old foxes holes . So you have to be sure its a fox you are gasing not a badgers set(iam not for gasing anything myself) Best just leave them be. If you going to kill one ,for what ever reason,just dont tell anyone. scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George1990 Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 I have no wish to shoot them myself, just that you listed only digging, gassing and baiting. I personally have nothing against them, and think they're a delight to watch. I do, however, wonder why people who wish to control for means of protecting their livelihood cannot do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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