Mini_death Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 helo! i think i have found the forum that has nice and relitivly normal people on it! i was wondering what kind of equipment i should invest in... for a real newb im 16 but thats all going to change in about 4 days now :thumbs: and i was thinking about getting my firearms license (allready downloaded it and filled most of it in and have spoken to local police as most of them are my next doors) But i was wondering if im rushing into it all a bit too fast. i have a tendancy to do this My firearm history is very limited. i have been with the atc and got wing marksman on the L98 (cadet version of the SA80 and its very annoying, big fat cocking handle, mag sat right at the back, dodgy mag relise etc etc) but i did fire the No8 rifle and a Anschutz which i thort was really nice, even if i did have to reload it each time. Thus now that im almost 17 i decided that i wanted to get a .22 rimfire rifle mainly for use on my aunts farm for 'pest control' aka pigeons and rats and target practise. But what i was wondering was if i was to get it could i keep it at my house (in bucks) and also be able to take it up to my aunts farm (north yorks) and if i can what rules and regulations are there? I have tried to look up this stuff on govt. webbies and asked police but non of them are certain and some are muttering stuff about this anti-social behaviour bill thats being played around with so im utterly baffled as to what i can or cant do. so in short, what would be a good .22 rimfire gun to get? (.22LR rather than a shotgun as i dont think my mom would let me keep one of those in the house) what paperwork would i and or my aunt need for me to own it and take it up north to her farm? What kind of storage do i need, my atc they are in a giant safe but i dont think that would be feesable in my house. and any other useful, or randomly interesting information that you wish to pass on. thanx so much, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mini_death Posted January 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 (edited) sorry i forgot to mention, i have also done a little air rifle shooting round the farm and at home again, 'pest control' and target practice along with some straight forward pigeon shooting with a shotgun. also the gun im looking at is the Ruger K77/22RSP as im a fan of synthetic stocks as they have the kinda modern look about them and the iron sights are good until id get the cash for a propper scope, and i could use it on my cadet range, but i stil have to ask about that to check its ok with Shorty. I think the 20" barrel would be better for me aswell cos im no goliath (excuse all grammar and spelling mistakes please, its late and im tired :thumbs: ) Edited January 14, 2006 by Mini_death Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fubar Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 helo! i think i have found the forum that has nice and relitivly normal people on it! i was wondering what kind of equipment i should invest in... for a real newb oh yeh were is were is this forum you talk about :thumbs: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teal Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 Have you got an airifle? I think an FAC(you still need firearms certificate) rated one would be ideal for what you want, or perhaps even a 12ft/lbs. You don't really want to be firing a .22 rimfire around buildings which is where I presume some of the rats/pigeons might be. Also from the safety angle you never want to fire a .22 rimfire upwards where there is no safe backstop. You can quite happily whack off a lot of prey and do the target practise with such an airifle. As for storage for any firearm you must have a locked and secure gunsafe which is bolted to the wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 (edited) As funds for a 17 year old are normally low you dont need the added expense of a gun cabinet / ammo safe if you get a sub 12ftlb. And it can be fired in and around buildings and trees with less backstop consideration or damage to roofing materials. Make it a springer too and you'll have little to carry between home and the two farms, weight and bulk wise. Especially important to consider if you'll be using public transport?. In fact all you'll really need is the gun, gunbag (for carrying in public)and pellets. :thumbs: cheap and cheerfull - and when you subsequently apply for a FAC as funds gather, you'll have acquired experience that will give weight to the FAC application. Edited January 14, 2006 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mini_death Posted January 14, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 k thanx but i got tired of firing a sub 12ft/lb and it had to be re cocked each time, making follow up shots a pain. and on the farm i have masses of space to fire it onto, even the group of trees that the pigeons sit in is in the middle of one of the biggest fields. but il take ur advice and get a new air rifle. thanx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whippet.22 Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 A rimfire would be no good for shooting pigeons anyway, you can't fire a rifle into trees mate. That's about the most unsafe thing you could do. I'm surprised that your mum would allow you a rifle but not a shotgun, i think you need to explain the her that a shotgun is far 'safer' than a rifle i.e the shot travels A LOT less further than a rimfire bullet and loses it's energy quickly. I get hit by falling shot all the time when beating and it doesn't do anything, I wouldn't want to get hit by a falling bullet though. If you had a shotgun you could take pigeons on the wing (when they are flying), you could also learn how to use decoys which is a very fun and (in theory) easy way to shoot them. You can also use it on ground game upto about 40 yards. :thumbs: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browningstalker10g Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 i agree with whippet, your better off with a shot gun and with the fact pest control might not be good enuff reason to get a fac, if its not your own farm or one you work on and its not somewere close buy, they may not be to happy, they would need to view the land aswell and if its another force constabulary from were u live it might cause alot of hassel for u, even though 22c isnt that powerful they are still ******* dangerous, with rifles u never shoot unless u have sufficent backstop so shooting in to trees is a no no, but as was said shotguns are a much shorter range and the shot looses velocety very quickly, also with different chokes and shell type you have alot of freedom to get the sort of set up u like, be it a wide short range or a tight longer range, decoys are your best bet and a hide, pop downs some decoys and wait , they will come, and u will find the blighters are good sport and taste amazing, u can also use a shotgun for clays and lampng localy to were u live, there shood be shooting grounds nearby, but u can only use the rifle when u have sufficient land and they r less versatile for use, i have smaller and larger caliber rifles, i use a tikka tactical .308 for deer stalking a 22 for some pestcontrol but i use my shotguns all the time for just about anything, wildfowling, lamping pest clays etc, so after all the waffle get a shotgun they r far more worth it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peck Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 Mini_death, i will try and give you a sensible answer to your question. Firstly change your name to something less aggresive. Secondly try and find someone local to you who can be your mentor and help you, not only with your FAC application but who can help you with your shooting skills and finding somewhere local to shoot. If you are successfel with you application you will have to keep the rifle at your home address securly locked in a gun cabinet that is approved by the home office, the keys to which only you have access to. If you can get your aunts farm authorised for shooting a .22lr rifle you will have to transport the rifle with you every time you wish to shoot. As a first time applicant you will have to name every parcel of land you wish to shoot over on your FAC application, if granted all land will be stated on your FAC exactly where you can shoot, you cannot just go out and get permission from the land owner and then go out and shoot, it has to be entered on your FAC, all the land you shoot over will have to have been approved by the local constabulary, therefor your local police will have to contact the police in North Yorks and get it approved if it has'nt already. You say shooting pigeons rats and target practice, firstly when you think of shooting pigeons you think of them as perching in trees etc, this a definate no no, if you missed the pigeon the bullet will travel up to 1 mile, no matter how isolated the area, there is a posibility that when the bullet comes down it could hit someone and seriously injur them, if this happened you would never forgive yourself, rats are another problem, you will probably shooting them at close quarters, ok but you will have to watch out for a possibility of richochet. target shooting, as with all shooting you will have to make certain that you have an adequate back stop. Rifle, i would advise you get something not too expensive, preferably new, you can get a brand new rifle for approx £200-£300, you can get a new 3-9 x 40 scope for approx £60, a moderator for approx £30. All this will last you for years and years, when and if you decide that you want to take your sport more seriously you will be older and more experienced and will have more idea of exactly what it is that you want from the sport and can then upgrade if you wish. Is there a local target rifle shooting club near you? do you want to shoot competitivly? if so go along and see what they have to offer, maybe they have a sporting gun section. I could go on and on but this will keep you going for now. I hope this post answers some of your questions, i am sure you will have a lot more, but rather than say why not do this and that i hope i have been of some help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browningstalker10g Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 sensible answer i may of gabled but mine was fairly sensible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peck Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 browningstalker10g. i was composing my reply when yours was posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browningstalker10g Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 my apologies, i shall think before i type!! your answer was more to the point though and more useful, although the police are funny about land like u say u have to declare it all before u shoot and i feel that if your had the rifle to shoot on another farm far away they may not be happy with the rifle being taken away to somwere unsuitable for shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 my apologies, i shall think before i type!! your answer was more to the point though and more useful, although the police are funny about land like u say u have to declare it all before u shoot and i feel that if your had the rifle to shoot on another farm far away they may not be happy with the rifle being taken away to somwere unsuitable for shooting these days that is not entirely true. you will most likely get a condition on your ticket meaning you can shoot any cleared land without telling the firearms dept. (much better than the old closed tickets) this does still mean your aunts land needs to be cleared though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peck Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 browningstalker10g. I think he will be very luck to get this land approved for his use. He needs to get someone local to help him. He will find it very difficult on his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browningstalker10g Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 yes someone local with knowledge of the area and a grasp on shooting laws would be a great help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
browningstalker10g Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 just an afterthough but 22's are fine for rabits, especialy when lamping, but rats and anything that can fly is not realy appropriate quarry for such a weapon in my personal opinion, and air rifle would be better for rats anyway, for pigeons invest in a hide, some decoys and scatter some seed, as u shoot more use the pigeons uve already bagged as extra decoys. and but the end of the day you should have a nice little bag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTaylor2k4 Posted January 15, 2006 Report Share Posted January 15, 2006 start with an air rifle, then if you like it in a couple of years get a rifle IMO without prior hunting experience you will not be safe handling a .22LR or similar, as said above you will still get a good bag, tbh maybe more, most of my kils were tree top jobbies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mini_death Posted January 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 wow! thanx loads of great comments. I have amended my decision and il try going for a shot gun. Also my aunts farm has been checked already as there was a guy who used to shoot on it, not sure if he still does but i can ask. Also i have checked that if my aunt gets a firearm license she can keep the gun with her at the farm as i would have minimal use for it in an urban area and the adults probably wouldnt like the idea of a shotgun in an area mostly populated by 12s and under. I didnt know a .22 could go a mile! thats astounding. il have a look at the local rabbit life etc befor i think again about a .22 seems like not such a hot idea now but still life is made for making mistakes. P.S. im sorry if anyone finds my screen name offencive its not ment to be. its just an old joke from when i was little and i ran around looking like death. (scyth, hood, egg timer etc) if i have another complaint about it i will change it but for now il keep it as it is now i have explained it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargeant Bang Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 If your Aunt has the FAC, she'll also have any subsequent firearm, lets say a .22LR in her name too. In which case I'm pretty certain that means you're still not allowed to use it, even if she accompanies you. Hopefully if I'm wrong one of the knowledgeable chaps on here will correct my remarks. If she gets a Shotgun License and buys a shotgun then I think you can use that, provided she accompanies you, even though it's her land. Help me out lads.... anyone disagree or knows different? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 So it would be her rifle on her land? Then yes this is fine as long as he stays within site and sound of the rifle owner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 If your Aunt has the FAC, she'll also have any subsequent firearm, lets say a .22LR in her name too. In which case I'm pretty certain that means you're still not allowed to use it, even if she accompanies you.Hopefully if I'm wrong one of the knowledgeable chaps on here will correct my remarks. If she gets a Shotgun License and buys a shotgun then I think you can use that, provided she accompanies you, even though it's her land. Help me out lads.... anyone disagree or knows different? if the land is cleared, and he got an FAC with permission to either shoot cleared land or named land (and had his aunt's land named) then at 17 he could use what ever FAC gun he was allowed to purchase on his own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 Has anyone ever tried getting land cleared without a FAC? just curious - maybe she could get it cleared for his gun ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughiep Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 As a first time applicant you will have to name every parcel of land you wish to shoot over on your FAC application, if granted all land will be stated on your FAC exactly where you can shoot, you cannot just go out and get permission from the land owner and then go out and shoot, it has to be entered on your FAC, all the land you shoot over will have to have been approved by the local constabulary, therefor your local police will have to contact the police in North Yorks and get it approved if it has'nt already. This bit isnt exactly correct, you must put 1 piece of land down which you wish to shoot on and this must be cleared by the FEO..it is not written onto your FAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted January 17, 2006 Report Share Posted January 17, 2006 from my experiance....and as i have said many times now, you just list some cleared land, or as said, name one or more pieces you wish to be cleared, and this will happen, then you will be given a certificate which allows you to shoot your FAC rifle/s on any cleared land. it does not have to be written on your certificate nor do you need to inform plod. this is how i am told all new certificates are being issued (might be miss informed) i believe it is a method of saving police time, so they dont have to keep on giving you new certificates when you get new land or want new land to shoot on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roblade Posted January 22, 2006 Report Share Posted January 22, 2006 Hi there just came accross this thread, rfom the sounds of it the only thing putitng you off an air rifle is the lack of a follow up shot and having to cock it every shot, have you consisdered a multi shot PCP air rifle such as the S410 ok so initial costs are a little higher than a shot gun or rimmie, but safe to use on almost any land you have permision to shoot on and perfect for rats though field craft does have to be pretty good for the pigeons. As has been said earlier a rimmie is no way meant to be used for shooting into trees, yes i know some do it but it should not be done! and as for rats with a rimmie i think you might find it slight over kill LOL check out the airgun section on what peolpe think about air rifles for pest control, you will find very few people shoot with a spring rifle in the fields these days, most prefer the quiet easy approach of PCP rifles, quick flick of the bolt and second shot is on its way before the quarry know whats happening. ROB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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