Policeman inserting song titles into his evidence

[MM]

totally agree .

just remember guys , this copper has taken a shot at a human , not a rabbit or pigeon .

it may just be his way of dealing with it ,

i dont see the press running round fire stations after a fatality quoteing the remarks of those guys .

 

sadly a witch hunt in my eyes . as said before , we paid a man to do a job proberbly none of us could do .

 

??

adi

 

 

i know i couldnt do it. put in that guys situation, its a terrible choice to have to make. like you said, it might just be his way of dealing with it.

[Vince Green]

totally agree .

just remember guys , this copper has taken a shot at a human , not a rabbit or pigeon .

it may just be his way of dealing with it ,

i dont see the press running round fire stations after a fatality quoteing the remarks of those guys .

 

sadly a witch hunt in my eyes . as said before , we paid a man to do a job proberbly none of us could do .

 

??

adi

Totally disagree, He's not judge jury and executioner. We pay him to do a job but we now have to question his motives for wanting to do the job in the first place and whether he is is suitable.

 

It is not a job I would want to do, thats for sure but whoever does do it has to have our confidence. They can't shoot someone just because they are losing patience with him. In this case they should have just backed off and let him sober up.

Edited November 3, 2010 by Vince Green

[MM]

Totally disagree, He's not judge jury and executioner. We pay him to do a job but we now have to question his motives for wanting to do the job in the first place and whether he is is suitable.

 

I would say he is to a degree.

 

 

It is not a job I would want to do, thats for sure but whoever does do it has to have our confidence. They can't shoot someone just because they are losing patience with him. In this case they should have just backed off and let him sober up.

 

Stand back and let him sober up, or stand back and let him carry on drinking, then go and shoot someone?

[Mungler]

Stand back and let him sober up, or stand back and let him carry on drinking, then go and shoot someone?

 

Neighbours evacuated, situation was contained (oh yeah, just how many police in attendance?!!?) and he wasn't going anywhere - he could have been stopped from wandering out of his front door with his shotgun should he have tried.

 

I wouldn't have put the risk that high - he's got an O/U shotgun with a limited effective range (the locality upto the effective range had been evacuated).

 

It's a tough one. Was there an urgent *need* to shoot the fella when there was the option to wait or let his family talk him down.

 

Anyways, back on topic - to shoot someone and then make jokes in the inquest? Sounds like a prototypical psychopath.

[poontang]

According to his family he'd had a drink problem for some time, even been to Alcoholics Annonymous for help.

 

Maybe a case then that it's not such a bad idea that police should interview family members as to whether people are fit to hold a licence?

 

As for the copper doing what he did.............total idiot, and deserves all he gets.

[kdubya]

Neighbours evacuated, situation was contained (oh yeah, just how many police in attendance?!!?) and he wasn't going anywhere - he could have been stopped from wandering out of his front door with his shotgun should he have tried.

 

I wouldn't have put the risk that high - he's got an O/U shotgun with a limited effective range (the locality upto the effective range had been evacuated).

 

It's a tough one. Was there an urgent *need* to shoot the fella when there was the option to wait or let his family talk him down.

 

Anyways, back on topic - to shoot someone and then make jokes in the inquest? Sounds like a prototypical psychopath.

 

 

as much as I am loathe to say so I agree with mung on this one

 

KW

[death from below]

If only it was as simple as letting a chronically depressed alcoholic 'suber up' then go and arrest him - get in the real world please. He wasn't just p-isse-d, he was suffering serious mental health issues (and chronic depresion armed with alcoholism is exactly that). As for just sitting it out, that would have been an option that was considered - what you've got to remember is that the armed cops can't then just sit in a canteen somewhere hoping that he falls asleep and sobers up - they have to take strategic positions around the venue - what many fail to realise is that several neighbours refused to move out of their premises for what ever reason - some of them had young children - the limited firing range of a shotgun can still have devastating effects on a young child of some hioty tioty Chelsea resident who is too stubborn/stupid to realise that staying in their mansion is putting their kids lives at risk. He didn't deserve to die, no one ever does in those circumstances but he was highly culpable for his own death - it's the family and the one's that pulled the trigger that I have sympathy for (but not the idiot subject of this OP).

 

Once again back to the original point of the post topic, this gun cop has let himself and every other cop (not just gun cops) down and has belittled the whole operation and future jobs involving armed stand-offs. He is a simpleton who should not carry a baton, let alone a gun

[tony-devon]

sadly just another nail in the coffin for the police, and they wonder why people have little or no respect for them

 

I was working in a large station in London years ago, right by the locker rooms, bunch of traffic cops chatting, dicsussing what "break" they had scored!

 

carried on listeneing, they were playing snooker with the cars that they stopped/nicked for speeding etc etc,

 

I have driven white or silver cars ever since!

 

give the police more power and one or some of them will always abuse it, take the power away and then they are useless.

 

I think that its the usual case of 1 bad one, ruins it for 2 or 3 good ones

Edited November 4, 2010 by tony-devon

[death from below]

sadly just another nail in the coffin for the police, and they wonder why people have little or no respect for them

 

I was working in a large station in London years ago, right by the locker rooms, bunch of traffic cops chatting, dicsussing what "break" they had scored!

 

carried on listeneing, they were playing snooker with the cars that they stopped/nicked for speeding etc etc,

 

I have driven white or silver cars ever since!

 

give the police more power and one or some of them will always abuse it, take the power away and then they are useless. I think that its the usual case of 1 bad one, ruins it for 2 or 3 good ones

 

I don't believe you - another urban legend about the snooker game - as for taking away the power, that is the point about a police force, they have a power conferred on them that if they did not have, they would be as useless as members of the public that turn their heads when grannies are being robbed in front of them or women attacked - I agree with your i bad apple analogy but for every bad one, there is a thousand good ones, not a ratio of 1 to 2 or 3. FYI - traffic cops in Londo ndo not work in divisional stations, they are lumped in at traffic garages that usually also house TSG (hence my scepticism about your traffic cop story). As for people having little faith or respect, keep it as a personal statement and not a general one - I have a lot of respect and time and don't need you to act as my mouth piece.

[tony-devon]

I assume that they were traffic, as I dont know whether other officers in cars can pull drivers for offences or not, this was in Paddington I seem to remember, probably 18-20 years ago, I was an apprentice with my father going over the wiring installation of the building

 

they were the same officers that my father and I overheard laughing about pulling a drink driver, he blew a positive test, one male voice was clearly heard to say that he didnt even have to touch his radio, all this at the time of the urban legend regarding the RF being able to alter the result, wether true or not, it was an attitude that didnt impress me one bit.

 

most police are pretty good, but I have met many many of them that are little more than jumped up failures of other professions, it seems that they join the force as a last resort due to failing at everything else and being mocked by others, so they want to try and get even.

 

the older coppers are generally sound and able to use discretion, experience, manners and most importantly of all, the one thing that cant be taught, common sense.

 

maybe its just my bad luck, only had a few experiences with the police and all have been bad ones, situations that 1 ounce of common sense and caring, would have put right, and strangley all were with younger officers, maybe theres a pattern there

[death from below]

I assume that they were traffic, as I dont know whether other officers in cars can pull drivers for offences or not, this was in Paddington I seem to remember, probably 18-20 years ago, I was an apprentice with my father going over the wiring installation of the building

 

they were the same officers that my father and I overheard laughing about pulling a drink driver, he blew a positive test, one male voice was clearly heard to say that he didnt even have to touch his radio, all this at the time of the urban legend regarding the RF being able to alter the result, wether true or not, it was an attitude that didnt impress me one bit.

 

most police are pretty good, but I have met many many of them that are little more than jumped up failures of other professions, it seems that they join the force as a last resort due to failing at everything else and being mocked by others, so they want to try and get even.

 

the older coppers are generally sound and able to use discretion, experience, manners and most importantly of all, the one thing that cant be taught, common sense.

 

maybe its just my bad luck, only had a few experiences with the police and all have been bad ones, situations that 1 ounce of common sense and caring, would have put right, and strangley all were with younger officers, maybe theres a pattern there

 

You are prone to sweeping generalisations - as well as being a copper for over 20 years, I'm also a qualified sparky - I could easily make brash statements about the mental capacity of construction trade workers (especially the average sparlk)but it would be just that, ie a brash and untrue statement as I've only met a very small proportion of skilled trade people. You on the other hand, by your own words, appear to have a large amount of contact with the police (which usually means you get nicked a lot/are a busy body or just a fantasist keyboard warrior)- as for a last resort career, just have a look on the Met police website to even start to imagine the hoops and hurdles someone has to go through to even get close to joining nowadays - as for common sense, you quote that the older ones seem to be ok - they would be the ones who were, 20 years ago, making snooker and drink drive comments that you were so appalled about. You sate that most are good but then contradict yourself by quoting that many are jumped up failures ..........................................I respect your comments when you mention your own personal experiences as at least you own that bit - as for them being only bad ones, maybe again you might went to look at whyt hat is, ie are you somewhat part of whtever has happened to you or is it a case that the bad experince is completely down to the nasty cop(s) dealing with you?

[migster]

Neighbours evacuated, situation was contained (oh yeah, just how many police in attendance?!!?) and he wasn't going anywhere - he could have been stopped from wandering out of his front door with his shotgun should he have tried.

 

I wouldn't have put the risk that high - he's got an O/U shotgun with a limited effective range (the locality upto the effective range had been evacuated).

 

It's a tough one. Was there an urgent *need* to shoot the fella when there was the option to wait or let his family talk him down.

 

Anyways, back on topic - to shoot someone and then make jokes in the inquest? Sounds like a prototypical psychopath.

 

Spot on Mungler.

[UKPoacher]

18 or 20 years ago if a police officer activated their personal radio when a breathalyser was in use the breathalyser unit always gave a red 'Fail' signal. That was a ploy that was used by some officers to rack up arrest statistics. The suspect would then be taken to the station and a second breath test obtained which ultimately determined whether they were indeed over the limit or not.

 

I've never heard of the snooker, but I do not discount it. In that era almost anything was possible.

[tony-devon]

oh dear DFB, if properly read you would see that I mentioned a "few" experiences, yet you manage to turn this into be being a career criminal! hmm couldnt be further from the truth, FAC, SGC and work for RFD, never been arrested, hardly mafia material me.

 

its things like my wife breaking down on a large roundabout, she is of very petite build, but was heavily pregnant at the time, she immediately got out of the car that she had managed to roll to the side of the road.

 

she then was stood behind a barrier as she has always been told to do, and had phoned RAC and myself

 

a police car came past her, slowed down, told her that she had to move the car as it was in a dangerous place, she explained that she had rung me and RAC, they just drove off. it was nearly 35 minutes that she was left standing there, ok so its not their job to babysit or nurse people, but what was there to stop them pushing the car to a safer location about 15-20 yards away.

 

again this comes down to common sense. just some reassuring words or asking if she needed any help would have altered the whole situation, on another occasion asking her was she old enough to be driving the car and could she reach the pedals really didnt help faith in the local police much either

 

or

 

myself coming home from taking a car for MOT, to find someone had parked a car on the pavement astride a drop kerb that provided access to my drive and garage, called police who responded and said they couldnt do anything about the car, but went to town on me that the car I was driving was untaxed, yes thats because I was returning from an MOT appointment, and hence my need for access to my private property.

 

I would not say that all police are idiots, certainly not, just the ones I have met.

 

my best mate at school, his father was some high ranking officer in Harlow and Essex areas, he was sound.

 

so Im sticking to my thoughts that the older cops are the better ones

[death from below]

Yup, pretty bad experiences there - and as I would class myself as one of the older ones nowadays, thanks for the compliement mate

[Gordon R]

Whatever the family should or should not have done. Whatever the dead man himself did, doesn't excuse a Policeman from turning his death in to some kind of sick little joke. He made his own mind up to do this, in the cold light of day.

 

He has no place in the Force.

[tony-devon]

has it been confirmed that it was a joke? ie done on purpose, if you study anything for long enough you can find something to complain about or similarities etc

 

if it was done on purpose then it is pretty sick, but maybe its his coping mechanism, perhaps making jokes and making light of things is the only way that he can try and deal with it? it is afterall quite a british trait is it not?

 

thing is that he did what he thought was right, at that split second in time. hows he feeling? I havent a clue, I have never even shot an animal let alone a human, how many of us can say, yeah I kow how he is feeling?

 

right or wrong, it has happened and nothing is going to change that now

[death from below]

The shooting is not in question - that couldbe argued for and against until the cows come home - his actions were totally innapropriate - as for a coping mechanism, there is a large amount of support available in the Met for such an incident without turning to comical (or not as the case may be) entries in an evidential trail.