955i Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Just been to the shop for some tobacco to find that it has gone up nearly £1.40 a pack since the budget :o How is this justified as I can't believe that it is anything close to in line with inflation, or is it since they threw us the bone of not adding 1p to petrol, smokers are meant to make up the shortfall??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Of course smokers should make up the shortfall Filthy habit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holly Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Just been to the shop for some tobacco to find that it has gone up nearly £1.40 a pack since the budget :o How is this justified as I can't believe that it is anything close to in line with inflation, or is it since they threw us the bone of not adding 1p to petrol, smokers are meant to make up the shortfall??? why not grow your own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Of course smokers should make up the shortfall Filthy habit Well then you would be agreeable to smokers getting better NHS/Police/Fire service than non-smokers on equivalent incomes due to the extra tax we pay? And to be fair, I'm not complaining about an increase, just the sheer amount (over 10%). Has ANYTHING else gone up by even close to that in the budget? Edited April 3, 2011 by 955i Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boromir Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 But its a fact that smokers use the NHS more than Non smokers. If you don't like the taxes on cigs you have the choice to I've up its noyt a necessity is it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boromir Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Sorry the G button on phone is bein awkward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 But its a fact that smokers use the NHS more than Non smokers. I'm afraid I would solidly dispute that statement. There are more non-smokers than smokers and plenty of long-term heavy drinkers which would utilise the NHS equally, if not more than smokers. It is not a foregone conclusion that everyone who smokes uses the NHS heavily. I have smoked for years and can count on one hand the amount of times I have even been to see the doctor, whereas my wife who has asthma and skin conditions uses the NHS at least twice a month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 love the dogs I bet they don't smoke, not many animals do, they've got more intelligence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stubby Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 just move to a town near a port, buy ya baccy most places at half price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 love the dogs I bet they don't smoke, not many animals do, they've got more intelligence Took me a moment to get the dogs thing :blink: And fair enough if you want to insult people by claiming that smokers are stupid (I think my BSc and MSc dispute that but never mind!), but if tobacco had not gone up and fuel had gone up by at least 15p, how much longer would this thread be with people complaining by now? Fuel is also often not a necessity, just a convenience. Does it matter who the government are shafting, it is the 'I'm all right Jack' mentality in this country that has allowed them to screw us all over one way or the other in the first place! Again, this is not a complaint about tobacco per se, I would be disgusted if anything had gone up by this much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) just move to a town near a port, buy ya baccy most places at half price Yeah, used to get it cheap round here apparently but the rise in taxes caused all the pubs to close so nowhere to go and get it anymore :blink: Worked out on 10 packs, it is probably cheaper for me to fly to France to get it than go to the Asda at the end of the road I thought we were part of Europe now, so how come our prices are double theirs for products made in this country? Edited April 3, 2011 by 955i Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 I'm afraid I would solidly dispute that statement. There are more non-smokers than smokers and plenty of long-term heavy drinkers which would utilise the NHS equally, if not more than smokers. It is not a foregone conclusion that everyone who smokes uses the NHS heavily. I have smoked for years and can count on one hand the amount of times I have even been to see the doctor, whereas my wife who has asthma and skin conditions uses the NHS at least twice a month. I have to agree with this statement, although i've been too and fro from doctors and hospitals in the past 3 years none of it was due to smoking, infact, while i was at papworth i was in 2 different wards, thats a total of at least 16 patients, all with some coronary disease or other, and i was the only smoker there. I'm not disputing that smoking is bad for you, i just don't believe the NHS propaganda that it's the biggest contributor to ill health. ATB, gram. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holly Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Yeah, used to get it cheap round here apparently but the rise in taxes caused all the pubs to close so nowhere to go and get it anymore :blink: i know a guy who lives in dover and buys is baccy from a guy in bradford :wacko: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boromir Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 So are people disagreeing with the 9 out of 10 people with lung cancer is related to smoking? I'm not saying other health problems like drinking should get away with it but they pay an extra tax as well. In fact I think cannabis should be legalised and taxed cause that will ease up the police and bring more money in. Only thing I don't like is the banning of smoking in pubs its not the been the same since that has happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Only thing I don't like is the banning of smoking in pubs its not the been the same since that has happened. Funnily enough even as a long-term smoker I am totally behind the smoking ban. It may be bad for me, but I do not see the need to inflict it on others so I am happy to smoke outside. In fact I do not smoke in my own house and the only place I consider 'inside' that I do smoke is in my car. And the number of people with lung cancer was not the question, it was whether smokers on the whole were more of a drain on NHS resources in general that is being disagreed with. Edited April 3, 2011 by 955i Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigstevouk Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Does it matter who the government are shafting, it is the 'I'm all right Jack' mentality in this country that has allowed them to screw us all over one way or the other in the first place! With you there mate!!! there's far too many people now adays criticising others...... Edited April 3, 2011 by bigstevouk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Took me a moment to get the dogs thing :blink: And fair enough if you want to insult people by claiming that smokers are stupid (I think my BSc and MSc dispute that but never mind!), but if tobacco had not gone up and fuel had gone up by at least 15p, how much longer would this thread be with people complaining by now? Fuel is also often not a necessity, just a convenience. Does it matter who the government are shafting, it is the 'I'm all right Jack' mentality in this country that has allowed them to screw us all over one way or the other in the first place! Again, this is not a complaint about tobacco per se, I would be disgusted if anything had gone up by this much. BFG's dogs look good. Sorry I didn't mean to insult you but I didn't say smokers are stupid just that animals have more intelligence, because you don't see many of them standing by a bonfire breathing in smoke!! As you must have researched the fact that smoking is good for you, whilst at university, I am going straight to the local shop, of course I will walk the 2 miles as my car is a convenience, and then I will buy 1000 cigarettes for £300, come home, smoke them and make myself healthy. If you had read that in one of your books at Uni you would have wet yourself with laughter Oh I really enjoy a debate. Like most things in life the answer is so simple, if you don't like the tax, leave England go to Belgium and smoke yourself healthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
955i Posted April 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 BFG's dogs look good. Sorry I didn't mean to insult you but I didn't say smokers are stupid just that animals have more intelligence, because you don't see many of them standing by a bonfire breathing in smoke!! As you must have researched the fact that smoking is good for you, whilst at university, I am going straight to the local shop, of course I will walk the 2 miles as my car is a convenience, and then I will buy 1000 cigarettes for £300, come home, smoke them and make myself healthy. If you had read that in one of your books at Uni you would have wet yourself with laughter Oh I really enjoy a debate. Like most things in life the answer is so simple, if you don't like the tax, leave England go to Belgium and smoke yourself healthy Nah, I'm really not disputing whether smoking is bad for me, I know it is, but if I gave up everything that was potentially bad for my health I would never go anywhere or do anything. As said, the point of the post is not the tobacco element, it is the amount it has gone up compared to everything else. Even if I was a non-smoker I would still see this as unfair taxation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaguar Warrior Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) I try to avoid controversial posts but here goes....... People are making valid points and useful opinions but we are hardly being objective and fair are we? I'm with the OP here, not because i'm a smoker, but because I think he has fair points. He is making these points as a 'Jack who isn't alright' and as such has thought about the issues. Most other responders are 'I'm alright Jacks' or IAJs. I think the comments are a bit rich coming from the IAJs, as you are part of a minority too. Shooters. You don't like being treated unfairly as a minority then do you? You probably objected to the handgun ban and wouldn't like it if the government taxed lead cartridges, openly admitting it is being unfair to force users to change their opinions and behavior, would you? It is nanny state again. I'm an adult and don't need a nanny! Some democracy we live in - the right to mark a cross on apaper once every 4 years, and where majority opinion rules. Most pepole don't play golf, so is this a reason to ban it and hand the land to dog walkers? The OP is being reasonable and balanced in my view, just one of many. He isn't objecting to a rise, just the extortionate amount. Thanks to the smoking ban, smokers aren't affecting non-smokers any more so 'your alright Jack'! Try to behave accordingly. You don't need a nanny state - you just need to put yourself in the other persons shoes and play fair. So there! - (stamps foot like a petulant child LOL) JW Edited April 3, 2011 by Jaguar Warrior Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docholiday Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 I'm afraid I would solidly dispute that statement. There are more non-smokers than smokers and plenty of long-term heavy drinkers which would utilise the NHS equally, if not more than smokers. It is not a foregone conclusion that everyone who smokes uses the NHS heavily. I have smoked for years and can count on one hand the amount of times I have even been to see the doctor, whereas my wife who has asthma and skin conditions uses the NHS at least twice a month. unfortunately not true, smokers and the diseases caused by their habit are a large drain on the NHS, Personally think it should be banned or taxed out of exictence. I am all in favour of the increased cost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deny essex Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Ive smoked for a lifetime and just about every goverment has stated that the high tax on tobacco was to cover the cost imposed on the NHS for smoking related diseases,Ive never needed it yet for smoking related maybe one day. But in that same veign we have had hints in the past on overweight people possibly being charged for nhs treatment. Where should it stop, the NHS treats more than enough alcohol related diseases and friday night binge injuries, trail bike injuries, clibing injuries the list goes on for all of us that that have an element of danger involved in our pastimes and pleasure activities but as far as I have known tobacco is the only thing singled out for high tax related to nhs costs. Its an easy tax ride to put it on the things that many class as part of their pleasure activities be it alcohol or tobacco its taxed at sorce, chargeing friday night binge drinkers for their injuries and treatment or the ill equiped climber ! far too complicated. My five pence worth, time for a fag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Missed Again Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 I try to avoid controversial posts but here goes....... People are making valid points and useful opinions but we are hardly being objective and fair are we? I'm with the OP here, not because i'm a smoker, but because I think he has fair points. He is making these points as a 'Jack who isn't alright' and as such has thought about the issues. Most other responders are 'I'm alright Jacks' or IAJs. I think the comments are a bit rich coming from the IAJs, as you are part of a minority too. Shooters. You don't like being treated unfairly as a minority then do you? You probably objected to the handgun ban and wouldn't like it if the government taxed lead cartridges, openly admitting it is being unfair to force users to change their opinions and behavior, would you? It is nanny state again. I'm an adult and don't need a nanny! Some democracy we live in - the right to mark a cross on apaper once every 4 years, and where majority opinion rules. Most pepole don't play golf, so is this a reason to ban it and hand the land to dog walkers? The OP is being reasonable and balanced in my view, just one of many. He isn't objecting to a rise, just the extortionate amount. Thanks to the smoking ban, smokers aren't affecting non-smokers any more so 'your alright Jack'! Try to behave accordingly. You don't need a nanny state - you just need to put yourself in the other persons shoes and play fair. So there! - (stamps foot like a petulant child LOL) JW I agree with some of your views, and I will not insult you on the things I disagree with, honest! One thing I can't get my head round is the fact that a lot of English people living here don't like it, but 2/3 of the world want to live here. Strange that isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHOOTEMUP Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) I Have known seven people who have died of lung cancer and non of them smoked at any time in their lives, or lived in a house where ppeople smoked. One thing they all seemed to come into contact with was either asbestos or worked in garages breathing diesel fumes! So I do not believe the government statistics at re smoking causing all of it, in fact I think that all alcohol advertising should be banned and the public view of these products in shops should also be banned! How can it be right to allow this seriously dangerous drug to be pushed at people every time they go into shops? You ask any A&E Nurse, Paramedic or Doctor which people take up most of their time and they will all tell you it is those ****** that are ratted and not the smokers with symptoms allegedly caused by their habit! How many times does smoking cause the breakdown of law and order? How many times does smoking cause the complete destruction of a family? How many hours of police time is taken up dealing with drink drivers and the aprehansion of them? I could go on and I am sure that others could add to the list also but I am basing my facts on real life in the real world not off so called government stats that can and are changed to show what "THEY " want I Have a lot of contact with healthcare professionals and they all say the same. OK Tin Hat on and taking cover Edited April 3, 2011 by SHOOTEMUP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaguar Warrior Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 (edited) Unfortunately not true, smokers and the diseases caused by their habit are a large drain on the NHS, Personally think it should be banned or taxed out of exictence. I am all in favour of the increased cost Sadly, when your rights are being attacked and YOU are victimised because you are a minority, and the government doesn't care about the loss of your vote, I'll still stick up for you, mate. Just as long as it isn't supporting another group to be victimised and your issue doesn't hurt anyone else. So kite flying, wearing womens clothes and fly tying count, but animal and racial abuse won't. Refusing medical insurance for doctors who drink, smoke, climb, would count even though I might think doctors 'ought to know better', or disagree in principle. Doesn't this make you feel a bit guilty though? JW Edited April 3, 2011 by Jaguar Warrior Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaguar Warrior Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 I agree with some of your views, and I will not insult you on the things I disagree with, honest! One thing I can't get my head round is the fact that a lot of English people living here don't like it, but 2/3 of the world want to live here. Strange that isn't it? Nothing strange about it at all, it is human nature to think the 'grass is greener on the other side'. Or put another way, form an opinion without being balanced, fair and having gone to trouble to seek out the true facts. Like most of this thread's comments so far in my view. ATB JW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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