njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Second hand lee loader £15, second hand cheap scale £20, trimmer £10 (if you're that desperate then buy used for a couple of quid). Oh go on then, if you don't own a hammer it may go over £50! We both already own verniers for other stuff and the rounds are checked, but no changes needed to be made. At the end of the day if you seat your bullet with the chamber and then set the die to that plus a half turn to give a small and safe jump then you can't go wrong. There isn't such a thing as maximum OAL and the chamber is going to be more than minumum isn't it. If you're going for hot loads then perhaps the OAL is critical but still, every rifle I've loaded for has needed to be miles over minimum OAL to be ten thou from the lands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Ive never worked out how much a round costs me,to be honest I dont really care,having the confidence that each and every round I make is perfect and consistant is all I look for and that I can hit small targets at long ranges that is,but thats down to the rifle as as well If paper and target shooting is your bag then fair do's each to their own and whatever floats your boat etc. However, just for jollies, in any forthcoming willy waving long range shoot off (in all the excitement I can't recall who it's between and whether it's on or it's off) I would suggest an added round or two to the contest of: 1. timed shooting from a vehicle (out of the window, off the roof etc) 2. timed 100 yards free hand and prone at a target but with the shooters sprinting 100 yards to their shooting position (and getting some puff up and in their lungs) We could call that a field accuracy test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Second hand lee loader £15, second hand cheap scale £20, trimmer £10 (if you're that desperate then buy used for a couple of quid). Oh go on then, if you don't own a hammer it may go over £50! We both already own verniers for other stuff and the rounds are checked, but no changes needed to be made. At the end of the day if you seat your bullet with the chamber and then set the die to that plus a half turn to give a small and safe jump then you can't go wrong. There isn't such a thing as maximum OAL and the chamber is going to be more than minumum isn't it. If you're going for hot loads then perhaps the OAL is critical but still, every rifle I've loaded for has needed to be miles over minimum OAL to be ten thou from the lands. fair doos I just reckon taking a hammer to live primers and rounds is best left to those cost concious people who like life with a little edge of danger to it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 If paper and target shooting is your bag then fair do's each to their own and whatever floats your boat etc. However, just for jollies, in any forthcoming willy waving long range shoot off (in all the excitement I can't recall who it's between and whether it's on or it's off) I would suggest an added round or two to the contest of: 1. timed shooting from a vehicle (out of the window, off the roof etc) 2. timed 100 yards free hand and prone at a target but with the shooters sprinting 100 yards to their shooting position (and getting some puff up and in their lungs) We could call that a field accuracy test. 1 shoot from and off a vehicle every single time I go foxing 2 whats the point as no one i have ever known has sprinted to get to a shooting position,I think anyone who take a shot under the condition of not being able to breath correctly shouldnt be taking the shot but whats ever turns you on,if thats your bag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) sprinting 100 yards to their shooting position (and getting some puff up and in their lungs) We could call that a field accuracy test. We could call that a heart attack if it was me! :blink: :lol: Edited May 12, 2011 by gixer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 1 shoot from and off a vehicle every single time I go foxing 2 whats the point as no one i have ever known has sprinted to get to a shooting position,I think anyone who take a shot under the condition of not being able to breath correctly shouldnt be taking the shot but whats ever turns you on,if thats your bag Thought you had stalked a lot of reds??? Try walking up a great bloody hill and then telling me your in tip top condition and are not breathing through your rectum! Although the breathing shouldn't be a problem for you after talking through it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Second hand lee loader £15, second hand cheap scale £20, trimmer £10 (if you're that desperate then buy used for a couple of quid). Oh go on then, if you don't own a hammer it may go over £50! We both already own verniers for other stuff and the rounds are checked, but no changes needed to be made. At the end of the day if you seat your bullet with the chamber and then set the die to that plus a half turn to give a small and safe jump then you can't go wrong. There isn't such a thing as maximum OAL and the chamber is going to be more than minumum isn't it. If you're going for hot loads then perhaps the OAL is critical but still, every rifle I've loaded for has needed to be miles over minimum OAL to be ten thou from the lands. Oh dear so your a very very basic reloader,do you realise bullet do vary in measurement to the ogive,to load consistant rounds you need consistant accuarte measurements I would like to know how you mesure your 10 thou from the lands seeing you dont use the tool required to calculate this very important measurement but if your happy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Thought you had stalked a lot of reds??? Try walking up a great bloody hill and then telling me your in tip top condition and are not breathing through your rectum! Although the breathing shouldn't be a problem for you after talking through it... Ive stalked/hunted every speices of UK deer and then some,I have never taken a shot if Iam not happy with any conditions,be it out of breath or an unsuitable shooting position But I thought you would have known stalking/hunting reds is done on the way down the hill not up it,you climb the hill to get elevation to get into a suitable postition to take the shot, I like to get to the top have my piece and then start hunting/stalking yes Iam quite fit being the age Iam,I train in martial arts twice a week and then train in the gym 4 times per week Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Oh dear so your a very very basic reloader,do you realise bullet do vary in measurement to the ogive,to load consistant rounds you need consistant accuarte measurements I would like to know how you mesure your 10 thou from the lands seeing you dont use the tool required to calculate this very important measurement but if your happy How's a one hole group at 100 yards "Oh dear"? It works for me. I don't claim to be a stunning long range shooter, nor have any desire to try. We don't measure ten thou from the lands, I was just pointing out that we back the bullets off from touching to keep things sensible. That ten thou isn't that important anyway, only the consistancy of whatever that measurement is. No matter how much you mess about you can only be as accurate as where the seating die touches the bullet. That doesn't push on the end either does it?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 one hole is indeed rather good, is it one little hole or a bit raggedy round the edges I still think there is something along the Darwin theory lines about the Lee loader but hey thousands of yanks can't be wrong Just hitting anything with explosives in with a large hammer is best left to others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Ive stalked/hunted every speices of UK deer and then some,I have never taken a shot if Iam not happy with any conditions,be it out of breath or an unsuitable shooting position But I thought you would have known stalking/hunting reds is done on the way down the hill not up it,you climb the hill to get elevation to get into a suitable postition to take the shot, I like to get to the top have my piece and then start hunting/stalking yes Iam quite fit being the age Iam,I train in martial arts twice a week and then train in the gym 4 times per week Righto Tonto.....So that deletes any fatigue from walking up then does it? Why do you not just drop the tail gate on the truck and then "send it" no need for walking then..over and out sniper team one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docholiday Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) Ive stalked/hunted every speices of UK deer and then some,I have never taken a shot if Iam not happy with any conditions,be it out of breath or an unsuitable shooting position But I thought you would have known stalking/hunting reds is done on the way down the hill not up it,you climb the hill to get elevation to get into a suitable postition to take the shot, I like to get to the top have my piece and then start hunting/stalking yes Iam quite fit being the age Iam,I train in martial arts twice a week and then train in the gym 4 times per week Ackley, I am getting the picture you could pick a fight with yourself in a dark room, I am sure we are all impressed with your willy waving gym exploits but I am finding your posts pointless and just an excuse for you to say how wonderfull you are, I have know reached the point that the first sign of your opinions on a post is time for me to stop reading,, all the best with the willy waving doc Edited May 12, 2011 by docholiday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 How's a one hole group at 100 yards "Oh dear"? It works for me. I don't claim to be a stunning long range shooter, nor have any desire to try. We don't measure ten thou from the lands, I was just pointing out that we back the bullets off from touching to keep things sensible. That ten thou isn't that important anyway, only the consistancy of whatever that measurement is. No matter how much you mess about you can only be as accurate as where the seating die touches the bullet. That doesn't push on the end either does it?! mate if youy can 1 hole with every shot I take my hat off to you,your reloading skills and your rifle must be the best. 10 thou makes a hell of a difference with precision reloading, again I mst add bullets do change from batch to batch and even in the same batch I have seen differences in length and weight,you obvioulsy dont use a bullet comparator to measure correctly so you wounldnt know any better but if your getting 1 hole groups all the time mate dont change a thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Ackley, I am getting the picture you could pick a fight with yourself in a dark room, I am sure we are all impressed with your willy waving gym exploits but I am finding your posts pointless and just an excuse for you to say how wonderfull you are, I have know reached the point that the first sign of your opinions on a post is time for me to stop reading,, all the best with the willy waving doc hold on a min here am I not allowed to answer a persons question in a adult and polite manner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ackley Posted May 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) Righto Tonto.....So that deletes any fatigue from walking up then does it? Why do you not just drop the tail gate on the truck and then "send it" no need for walking then..over and out sniper team one... Oh dont worry I still get fatigue,but recover quicker.a mate I stalk/hunt with is like a machine he marches up hills for fun,he did a season as a stalker on Balmoral last year,he had a 2 hrs hike just to get to the hill its nice to have a walk about and take in the sceanery every know and again,but yes when needs must Ive "sent a few" off the tailgate,bonnet,roof,window or anywhere else I can get a good solid rest over and out "barn door 1" Edited May 12, 2011 by Ackley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docholiday Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Ackley, polite and adult. now there are three words i wouldnt have put together. you are indeed allowed your opinion. as are others, sorry to hijack thread, no more from me on the subject Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 one hole is indeed rather good, is it one little hole or a bit raggedy round the edges I still think there is something along the Darwin theory lines about the Lee loader but hey thousands of yanks can't be wrong Just hitting anything with explosives in with a large hammer is best left to others A hole about the size a .308 would make, but with a .222. I'm not completely perfect you know! Have you had a primer pop on you before? I did at the weekend using the loader. It really isn't that bad, makes you jump but quieter than a cap gun. To be honest using an autoprime with 20 of them in there worries me a lot more as if one goes they all can! The only time the primer is in contact with anything is when you're seating it. The rest of the time the case is held over a hole so the primer isn't touching anything apart from the case. It can't go off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 If paper and target shooting is your bag then fair do's each to their own and whatever floats your boat etc. However, just for jollies, in any forthcoming willy waving long range shoot off (in all the excitement I can't recall who it's between and whether it's on or it's off) I would suggest an added round or two to the contest of: 1. timed shooting from a vehicle (out of the window, off the roof etc) 2. timed 100 yards free hand and prone at a target but with the shooters sprinting 100 yards to their shooting position (and getting some puff up and in their lungs) We could call that a field accuracy test. Your No.2 was my favourite except in the military it's half a mile or so. Why? Annual fitness test be blowed, it's the only shoot where we, the range wardens, didn't need to reface the targets, just re-rake the bullet catchers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I must be rubbish at this shooting stuff as if I'm excited, out of puff or shooting off a wagon, whilst I can hit a rabbit at 100 yards I couldn't swear to being able to shoot both of it's eyes out at 100 yards. That coupled with my desire not to waste my time reloading in pursuit of accuracy that my shooting skills and circumstances just don't warrant, dammit, must make me the odd one out here and not one of the true forum snipers. Over and out. <insert yawning smiley here> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I shot that guys rifle in a comp the other week. I shot two shots in the 9 ring (same hole but off bull) then adjusted for my mistake (yes my mistake not the rifle's) and shot the next three shots through the bull (again one hole). His kit did cost him about £50 second hand and I've helped him develop his load. Question it if you want but the target was witnessed by two members here who can also witness how the rounds were loaded. You can have the best kit in the world but if you don't know how to use it you're screwed. At the same time a decent reloader doesn't need the best kit in the world to get a good group. A bit of knowledge goes a very long way! If you don't believe it come over and shoot with us. You can load the rounds under supervision and then you can fire them through his rifle. If you're as good a shot as I am (which isn't hard) then you will print the same groups as I can. I'm not getting stroppy, that's a genuine invite if you're bored one weekend so you can see for yourself that it's possible. Made me laugh.... was in Chamonix skiing 2 years ago and there was a huge dump of snow... the following day all the old grizly locals came out to enjoy the powder with their 20 year old skis held together with duck tape and rear entry Salomon SX90 boots.... my they looked a sight..... then they proceeded to shred the mountain up and make all the gear whores and young kids, including me, (gear whore.... most definately not a young kid!) look like complete beginners..... Yes, you can use cheap, old equipment and with knowledge and skill produce amazing home loads that will compete with the best of them.... Absolutely no denying that... You have forgotten one thing though.... some of us LIKE buying state of the art, very expensive kit... I have a powderscale and measure that cost almost £400... did I need it, not at all, could get the same result with a balance bar and manual trickler... did I want it... hell yes, and I love playing with it... I could have settled for a 50 quid Lee press but I WANTED a 300 quid Forster one instead... Equipment isn't always bought out of necessity... if it was, mechanics would go to Machine Mart and buy their tools rather than from Snap-On... Yes, better quality, perhaps but in reality it all comes down to gear snobbery... My name is Paul..... I am a gear snob and total kit whore! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Righto Tonto.....So that deletes any fatigue from walking up then does it? Why do you not just drop the tail gate on the truck and then "send it" no need for walking then..over and out sniper team one... Ermmm... it's team 2 actually and you leave my spotter alone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 mate if youy can 1 hole with every shot I take my hat off to you,your reloading skills and your rifle must be the best. 10 thou makes a hell of a difference with precision reloading, again I mst add bullets do change from batch to batch and even in the same batch I have seen differences in length and weight,you obvioulsy dont use a bullet comparator to measure correctly so you wounldnt know any better but if your getting 1 hole groups all the time mate dont change a thing I don't get them every time. I'm human and I pull shots sometimes and if the wind is up my groups open up with it. I've never bothered with a comparator. I know what it does and why but I'm really not that bothered. If I can get a half inch group with my guns I'm happy. That's an inch or a touch over at 200 which is better than I need. The stalk is where I get my kicks. Shooting a Deer at ten yards means a hell of a lot more to me than shooting one at 200. I've done both, but more the former than latter. Measuring to the tip gives a variation I know but I rarely even check them. My dies stay set up and I just lob the loads together. No fuss at all. I check the first and last for length and that's that if they're close! :o Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Made me laugh.... was in Chamonix skiing 2 years ago and there was a huge dump of snow... the following day all the old grizly locals came out to enjoy the powder with their 20 year old skis held together with duck tape and rear entry Salomon SX90 boots.... my they looked a sight..... then they proceeded to shred the mountain up and make all the gear whores and young kids, including me, (gear whore.... most definately not a young kid!) look like complete beginners..... Yes, you can use cheap, old equipment and with knowledge and skill produce amazing home loads that will compete with the best of them.... Absolutely no denying that... You have forgotten one thing though.... some of us LIKE buying state of the art, very expensive kit... I have a powderscale and measure that cost almost £400... did I need it, not at all, could get the same result with a balance bar and manual trickler... did I want it... hell yes, and I love playing with it... I could have settled for a 50 quid Lee press but I WANTED a 300 quid Forster one instead... Equipment isn't always bought out of necessity... if it was, mechanics would go to Machine Mart and buy their tools rather than from Snap-On... Yes, better quality, perhaps but in reality it all comes down to gear snobbery... My name is Paul..... I am a gear snob and total kit whore! I couldn't agree more. I like buying posh kit too but the arguement didn't start with "Do I want an expensive setup", rather "Do I need an expensive setup". Anyway, you've seen my credit score. Buying posh kit is how I got it and selling posh kit is how I'm fixing it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I couldn't agree more. I like buying posh kit too but the arguement didn't start with "Do I want an expensive setup", rather "Do I need an expensive setup". Anyway, you've seen my credit score. Buying posh kit is how I got it and selling posh kit is how I'm fixing it! Amen to that brother.... not far behind you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I must be rubbish at this shooting stuff as if I'm excited, out of puff or shooting off a wagon, whilst I can hit a rabbit at 100 yards I couldn't swear to being able to shoot both of it's eyes out at 100 yards. In field conditions I expect 1" from a bipod and 4" standing at 100 yards. You're human Mung - these one hole groups were shot off of bags on a range so I had little input to the rifle at all. It's just pointing out the rifle and loaded ammo's ability, it has no bearing on mine when I'm out doing it where it matters and you're probably as good as the rest of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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