Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) Bought a S/H Cz452 American in .17 with a scirocco mod on and put a S/H Hawke scope on. Went to zero @ 100yrd, could'nt get it on the paper, bore sighted tried again, nothing. Found it was shooting massivly high, Ran out of down elevation, So I swapped mounts around then things got odd I COULD'NT HIT AN A2 piece of paper Tried with mod on, mod off then tried a different scope still unable to find where it's shooting but must be a mile out. tried with Remington, CCI and Honady all just vanishing, Tried @50 yrds still nothing? I ran out of time on the range. What the hell is going on? As far as i can see i have ruled out the ammo, scope and the mod all it can be is the mounts or the rifle. I have a spare 'scope and mounts so i will give the bore a good clean and try it again failing that it will have to go back to the shop. Anyone known this before? Edited May 19, 2011 by Daveo26 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 get closer will be mounts if anything, if possible try swapping the front and rear one round Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie-fox Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 i agree with al4x it will be the mounts..i would also just check the crowning of the barrel for any damage.. rich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feaks Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Or try packing the back ring with a bit of tape and shoot at the paper from about 20 yds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 I swapped the mounts round! still the same. I couldnt pack the scope enough with out crushing it. BUT.... I will check the crown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) Only shim it as a last resort sounds more like something isn't fitted correctly if you've run out of elevation. what height mounts are they? Edited May 19, 2011 by al4x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Iv heard conflicting stories but can these .17s be "shot out" like a full bore? Its only an '08 gun and looks lightly used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Mediums, Its a 40mm objective but I could'nt work the bolt with low mounts on. Also they are new Hawke ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 very unlikely might be worth a good clean but the fundamentals are its highly unlikely to be that far out as an A2 piece of paper at 50 yards, I'd go back to bore sighting it and play with all the variables Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 very unlikely might be worth a good clean but the fundamentals are its highly unlikely to be that far out as an A2 piece of paper at 50 yards, I'd go back to bore sighting it and play with all the variables That is my intention, although I fear it maybe something terminal for it to be that bad. Cheers for that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Joe Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Check the bolts that hold the action onto the stock, you still haven't said if the crown is damaged or not ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Just checked, Crown looks perfect and the bolts are tight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redgum Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Check the barrel is floating if its meant to be by wrapping a piece of card around the barrel and slide it down to the action. Some 452's go all the way, some have a locating screw half way down. Make sure your not resting the barrel on something when shooting. Once you have assessed the gun is ok put a big piece of paper on a piece of board with a little cross marked on it in marker pen. Make sure you have a correct backstop, check it a 25yds,get it on your mark, if it's nowhere near then its scope or mounts, find your problem and solve it, then zero at 40yds then 100. If the barrel was shot out which is highly unlikely you would be able to get it somewhere near the target but just won't get much of a tight group. They are pretty solid little guns, I have two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 start at 20yds! whats the scope? what is it mounted on the rifle with? pics please. sounds like your mounts are wrong When I zeroed mine the other day it was approx 3 feet wide of the mark at 100yds. came back in within the range of the scope tower though if it is second hand it probably needs a good clean. post about this on BBS, couldnt group, good defoul and clean and back to under an 1" at 100yds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 start at 20yds! whats the scope? what is it mounted on the rifle with? pics please. sounds like your mounts are wrong When I zeroed mine the other day it was approx 3 feet wide of the mark at 100yds. came back in within the range of the scope tower though if it is second hand it probably needs a good clean. post about this on BBS, couldnt group, good defoul and clean and back to under an 1" at 100yds. The scope is a Hawke 4-12X40 on Hawke medium mounts. then i tried a BSA 3-9x40 still the same. One of the mounts has a grub screw in the base as a recoil arrester pin, so i started with that to the rear. Ill give it a good clean and try again. I have also centered the cross hairs on the scope. will try again tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bewsher500 Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 how many clicks can you get out of each turret? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fireshot Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Had the same mine turned out to be mounts ( Nikko stirling ) cheap and nasty bought some Sporpsmatch and perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 A very slim chance I'm right here but is the arrestor pin stopping the mount from sitting down in the dovetails properly? If I were you I'd have it off. Pull it out with pliers or unscrew it, whatever, but just remove it and try the mounts again. It could be that the pin is holding the mount a bit higher than it should be if it's not sitting in the cutout properly? You'd have to cut the crown at 45 degrees to the barrel to be that far out. Rifling or not you'd be close just with poor groups. I'd be very surprised if it's the gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 how many clicks can you get out of each turret? 5 full turns elevation 7 turns left to right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 A very slim chance I'm right here but is the arrestor pin stopping the mount from sitting down in the dovetails properly? If I were you I'd have it off. Pull it out with pliers or unscrew it, whatever, but just remove it and try the mounts again. It could be that the pin is holding the mount a bit higher than it should be if it's not sitting in the cutout properly? You'd have to cut the crown at 45 degrees to the barrel to be that far out. Rifling or not you'd be close just with poor groups. I'd be very surprised if it's the gun. I will try some other mounts. I hope its just that it would be a cheap fix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooter Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 I found some mounts are better with one of them turned the opposite way around, but you have to find which combination gets you nearer to the centre line of the rifle. You can check out the alignmant without firing a shot. Take the bolt out, and take the mod off. Place a piece of paper with a vertical line on it, at about ten yards. You can do it closer, but the margin for error will be greater. Look through the barrel from the action, and line the rifle up with the line on the paper, using a rest of some kind so you are not holding the rifle. Look through the scope, and you should be able to see how far out you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveo26 Posted May 19, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 I found some mounts are better with one of them turned the opposite way around, but you have to find which combination gets you nearer to the centre line of the rifle. You can check out the alignmant without firing a shot. Take the bolt out, and take the mod off. Place a piece of paper with a vertical line on it, at about ten yards. You can do it closer, but the margin for error will be greater. Look through the barrel from the action, and line the rifle up with the line on the paper, using a rest of some kind so you are not holding the rifle. Look through the scope, and you should be able to see how far out you are. Thanks for the advice, I think that method is going to be tricky as its only a .17 I will see how thing go tomorrow. Thanks again More turns in windage than elevation, strange? Yep that what i thought Right, the gun is now wearing a hastily borrowed BSA contender 4-16X40 sitting in sportsmatch mounts. I shall clean the barrel tomorrow, attempt to get somewhere near with a bore sighter and see what happens. Thanks for the help so far Gents Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardo Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Trust me you can bore sight by eye easily enough on a .17 to get it on a sheet of a4 at 50 yards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smig Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 (edited) I had the same problem - a full strip down & clean (gun not me) sorted the problem BUT it took nearly a full box of hornady's before she became a tack driver again afterwards!! Hope this helps Edited May 20, 2011 by Smig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vole Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 If you do have to shim the scope then remember to shoot lower you will have to put the shim in the front mount ( no disrespect ) . I had five or six people advising me wrongly and wasting loads of rounds in the process . Hope you get sorted . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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