Breastman Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 Hello all, Hoping some rifle club secretaries/chairman read this. How much hassle is involved in setting up an 'open day' - so none FAC holders can come and 'have a go' under the supervision of a member? The owner of the my indoor rifle club says its a load of hassle/can't be bothered but i suspect he doesn't actually know whats entailed as there hasn't been an open day there for as long as anyone i've asked can remember. I've got a list as long as my arm of friends/family who'd like to give it a try but aren't keen enough to shell out the money/jump through the hoops to get their own FAC without trying it first. I don't have access to land where i could just take people for this sort of thing before thats suggested. So anyone who has organised one, or could ask at their club if they've had one recently and could offer some advice it would be appreciated ATB Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RC45 Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 The problem is getting enough qualified people to supervise and help out. We run open days, but we usually on let them loose with air rifles. Without volunteers to assist and supervise, we could not organise the events. The best way to try it out, is to join halfway through the year. This would let you spend six months trying different guns, if you don't like it don't rejoin. All clubs have different rules, so it's best to check with them direct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vapours Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 Hi I'm helping with an open day on Saturday. Basic process Police need to be informed and provided with the name address and age of all participants which I believe they need to approve. Usually its up to existing members to @sponsor@ a visitor. On the day we give a basic safety lecture. Guns are provided by club members who also supervise each shooting lane (visitors may be asked to pay for the ammo). We try to get a verity of guns and swop visitors around to give them the best possible experience. We only do one on one supervision with 6 lane open under the overall supervision of an RO Vap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 We open our doors to non members once a month.Home office guidelines say rifle ranges can allow non members to shoot 12 days a year,but all guests (even if they're family or friends) have to fill out a section 21 declaration which is to confirm that they are not prohibited from handling firearms. Obviously you have to keep an eye on the people when they're on the firing point because you dont want them to give them the opportunity to pinch any ammunition,but also allow them a bit of freedom like loading the rifles themselves so they feel a bit more involved.Provided they've signed the section 21 and are over 17 they can shoot any members firearms-apart from LBP's.Tuition is on a one to one basis and the RCO has overall control of the range as normal. Im suprised your club dont have open days as its a great way of increasing membership and you can get a feel for what people are like before their application goes up before the committee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 Its easier for most clubs to just allow prospective new members to join as a probationer, fill out the forms etc and send their details off to the police. There is nothing that says money has to be paid. Then they can come along for a few weeks and see how they like it (and the club gets a good chance to eyeball them ) Then after a few weeks if its going OK a suggestion is made that they might like like to pay now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breastman Posted June 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 Thanks for the responses fellas. Didn't think there was much to it, getting qualified cover is no problem myself and 5 others i shoot with are RCO's. I might approach him again and confirm that'll i'll do all the work and provide the RCO's. Otherwise i think i'll try your idea Vince and just have my girlfriend and brother along as probo members. Not sure the owner would be happy if i was introducing a new probo every other day though without any money changing hands Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted June 16, 2011 Report Share Posted June 16, 2011 Not sure the owner would be happy if i was introducing a new probo every other day though without any money changing hands At our club,probationers pay the normal annual subscription when they're accepted for membership.Its also a good way of seperating the wheat from the chaff-ie those people who really want to join and those who are not as enthusiastic as they were on the open day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 17, 2011 Report Share Posted June 17, 2011 If the club is Home Office registered it makes life pretty easy from a legal viewpoint. Check you club/range insurance and then sit down and deal with costs, logistics and promotion of the event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phaedra1106 Posted June 17, 2011 Report Share Posted June 17, 2011 Hi Mark I'm also in Durham, which club is it?, my son and I recently joined the Tyne Valley Rifle Club and I believe they are hoping to have an open day at Ponteland in the next few weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 23, 2012 Report Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) We open our doors to non members once a month.Home office guidelines say rifle ranges can allow non members to shoot 12 days a year,but all guests (even if they're family or friends) have to fill out a section 21 declaration which is to confirm that they are not prohibited from handling firearms. Obviously you have to keep an eye on the people when they're on the firing point because you dont want them to give them the opportunity to pinch any ammunition,but also allow them a bit of freedom like loading the rifles themselves so they feel a bit more involved.Provided they've signed the section 21 and are over 17 they can shoot any members firearms-apart from LBP's.Tuition is on a one to one basis and the RCO has overall control of the range as normal. Im suprised your club dont have open days as its a great way of increasing membership and you can get a feel for what people are like before their application goes up before the committee. What he says. The only difference is that there is no lower age limit although 14 is the youngest age allowed on MoD ranges. You are a member for the day and the club is HO approved so you don't need to be any particular age. Someone else mentioned that all visitors names must be provided to the police before hand. This isn't correct, you just need to notify them of the date of the guest day at least 48 hours in advance. Any full member can supervise the guest (and the guest only needs one-to-one supervision whilst actually handling firearms and ammunition) they don't need to be NRA instructors or anything. It's really no hassle at all. An email to the police to notify them (you can do your full annual allocation of 12 all at once) and a guest book containing the sec.21 declaration is all that's required. J. Edited February 23, 2012 by JonathanL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloke Posted February 23, 2012 Report Share Posted February 23, 2012 Our club holds open days, but also allows people to come on an official"visitor " status - this is a maximum of twice, at £5 per visit + ammo. If they wish to continue, they can apply for probationary membership and pay the full years fee (£70) in advance and can continue to visit free until the police check is complete. If they fail the police check or decide to take it no further, then they are refunded their yearly fee, minus the costs for the extra visits, at the same rate of £5 per session. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 Our club holds open days, but also allows people to come on an official"visitor " status - this is a maximum of twice, at £5 per visit + ammo. If they wish to continue, they can apply for probationary membership and pay the full years fee (£70) in advance and can continue to visit free until the police check is complete. If they fail the police check or decide to take it no further, then they are refunded their yearly fee, minus the costs for the extra visits, at the same rate of £5 per session. You can't do that. Offering a 'money back' option would almost certainly constitute a 'temporary or day membership scheme' which clubs are not supposed to operate. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phaedra1106 Posted February 25, 2012 Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 O/T but, Hi Jonathan and welcome to Pigeon Watch Jared and I will see you tomorrow at Ponteland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 You can't do that. Offering a 'money back' option would almost certainly constitute a 'temporary or day membership scheme' which clubs are not supposed to operate. J. No you are not allowed to operate day membership but you can offer prob membership and whats in a name? If you read the tiny tiny small print in the regulations, which nobody ever does, a new member can't shoot on their first visit to the club anyway. Thats because they can't shoot until after their details have been sent (interpreted as posted) to the police. Not a lot of clubs stick to that one. Does it really make any difference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 (edited) No you are not allowed to operate day membership but you can offer prob membership and whats in a name? A lot. Probationary membership is designed so that the club can assess the person over a period to make sure they are suitable and safe. If the club has reservations about the person they can extend their probationary period or end their membership. If the person were made an immediate full member they would have a contractual right to remain a member even if they were seriously dodgy. The reason that clubs were prevented from operating day/temporary memberships (well, they technically speaking they aren't but if a club was caught it might get its approval yanked) was to prevent strangers walking in off the street who may be dodgy or even prohibited from possessing firearms. Some of the more commercial clubs did have a policy of allowing 'walk-ins' on a daily basis and I believe it caused some problems somewhere. If a club offers a refund option then it is just another name for a day mambership scheme. If your annual fee is £100 but you say that you can terminate your membership within a certain time an get a 50% refund then that is a temporary membership scheme as you are giving the person an option to cut his membership short and can easily be used as a day membership scheme dressed up as something else. If you read the tiny tiny small print in the regulations, which nobody ever does, a new member can't shoot on their first visit to the club anyway. Thats because they can't shoot until after their details have been sent (interpreted as posted) to the police. Not a lot of clubs stick to that one. Does it really make any difference? I've heard that mentioned but haven't actually seen it in writing anywhere. It's not in the HO guidance, as far as I'm aware. J. Edit: To add, there probably isn't a great problem in doing what you are doing. I have no doubts that your club is doing it perfectly responsibly and I doubt that anyone would even bother to query it. The problem may arise if the wheel comes off in some fashion. If you are doing something you shouldn't then it absolutely will be used against you if it possibly can be. Edited February 27, 2012 by JonathanL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted February 27, 2012 Report Share Posted February 27, 2012 A lot. Probationary membership is designed so that the club can assess the person over a period to make sure they are suitable and safe. If the club has reservations about the person they can extend their probationary period or end their membership. If the person were made an immediate full member they would have a contractual right to remain a member even if they were seriously dodgy. The reason that clubs were prevented from operating day/temporary memberships (well, they technically speaking they aren't but if a club was caught it might get its approval yanked) was to prevent strangers walking in off the street who may be dodgy or even prohibited from possessing firearms. Some of the more commercial clubs did have a policy of allowing 'walk-ins' on a daily basis and I believe it caused some problems somewhere. If a club offers a refund option then it is just another name for a day mambership scheme. If your annual fee is £100 but you say that you can terminate your membership within a certain time an get a 50% refund then that is a temporary membership scheme as you are giving the person an option to cut his membership short and can easily be used as a day membership scheme dressed up as something else. I've heard that mentioned but haven't actually seen it in writing anywhere. It's not in the HO guidance, as far as I'm aware.J. Edit: To add, there probably isn't a great problem in doing what you are doing. I have no doubts that your club is doing it perfectly responsibly and I doubt that anyone would even bother to query it. The problem may arise if the wheel comes off in some fashion. If you are doing something you shouldn't then it absolutely will be used against you if it possibly can be. It was in the original paperwork sent out to secretaries when the rules were changed but if its dropped out somewhere along the way thats all to the good. It was a silly rule anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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