fishbone Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 I shoot on some farms with some huge rabbit warrens that has the farmer pulling his hair out. I've quit liked the idea of getting an FAC rifle simply because i like them! I've looked at some FAC rated air rifles and also some rimfires. I'm about to submit a "co-terminus"application to the police. The farmer is a bit concerned about a rim fire as there is a public footpath (hardly ever used) that intersects the farm. Does a FAC air rifle have any advantages over a rimfire in this case?? And for other uses would i be better off buying a rimfire if i want that kind of performance?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 First, never get a rifle because you quite like the idea ! Now, since you have a rabbit problem you have basically 2 calibres to choose from. .17HMR or a .22. The latter richocet rather too much for comfort in areas where the ground is hard(dry) or stoney - even subsonics. The .17HMR is a very good tool but still need to be very careful. I had an FAC air on my ticket and wish I'd bought that first, instead of a .22lr. Its only a personal opinion but I would decide if you really need an FAC and if you are actively pest controlling and not just 'liking the idea of one', I would apply for a .17HMR and an FAC air and buy the FAC air first - see how it goes and make your mind up. Dont forget a .17HMR will never be as quiet as a moderated .22LR on subsonics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabs Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Fac air will shoot effectively out to about 80 yards. It has less ftlb( in this country commonly up to 40 ftlb) than a rimfire and therefore more suitable to smaller shooting areas. A rimfire, say a .17 hmr is effective out to 200-250 yards( based purely on my own experience) and has a lot more ftlb energy( up to 230 ftlb) and is hence suited to larger areas. Fac air projectiles are much less likely to rich..roci...riococh... bounce off stuff and keep going with much oomph. Ergo, you want a Fac air rifle for your case, though I doubt the land would be cleared for shooting if it has a public footpath going through it. Not unless the Police were happy for you to close the path once a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyska Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 (edited) Fac air will shoot effectively out to about 80 yards. It has less ftlb( in this country commonly up to 40 ftlb) than a rimfire and therefore more suitable to smaller shooting areas. A rimfire, say a .17 hmr is effective out to 200-250 yards( based purely on my own experience) and has a lot more ftlb energy( up to 230 ftlb) and is hence suited to larger areas. Fac air projectiles are much less likely to rich..roci...riococh... bounce off stuff and keep going with much oomph. Ergo, you want a Fac air rifle for your case, though I doubt the land would be cleared for shooting if it has a public footpath going through it. Not unless the Police were happy for you to close the path once a week. I have footpaths all over our farm! It perfectly acceptable to have FAC granted on land with footpaths, as long as you are sensible, in fact I worry more about people not using the footpaths, at least I know where they are when on the footpaths. I don't really use hmr much further than 150 yards, very very often closer, but thats my own comfort zone, I certainly wouldn't be attempting rabbits at 250 yards, but all to their own... As already said, FAC air may be a good start, very quiet, very safe in comparison. Edited March 20, 2012 by kyska Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabs Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 (edited) I have footpaths all over our farm! It perfectly acceptable to have FAC granted on land with footpaths, as long as you are sensible, in fact I worry more about people not using the footpaths, at least I know where they are when on the footpaths. I don't really use hmr much further than 150 yards, very very often closer, but thats my own comfort zone, I certainly wouldn't be attempting rabbits at 250 yards, but all to their own... As already said, FAC air may be a good start, very quiet, very safe in comparison. Ah. I've never had any permission with public access... I stand corrected. Edit- PB with the HMR is 202 yards on two rabbits. I would feel comfortable and confident pushing that to 250. Edited March 20, 2012 by pabs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon6ppc Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 the 177hmr is a serious rabbit shooter.but not to quiet,if its a built up area and could be public about i would go for a fac air rifle.in the right hands you can head shoot rabbits at 50 plus yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyshooter Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 i own rimfires in 22lr and .17 hmr, i also own fac air x2 a .20 rapid at 26fpe and a daystate airranger ,22 at 60fpe both the fac airguns have a specific job, i have many varied types of shoots with footpaths busy roads, and flat open layouts but still not suitable for rinmfires this is where fac air comes into use, my fac licence is an open one which means, i can decide what type of gun is suitable to use based on the layout of land ,safe backstops and general safety. fac air is one of the many tools in my box, regds brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolhandMal Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 There are 2 footpaths running through my permission and I had an FAC for 20 years until I give it up (regretfully),my father had the permission before me so it's been FAC permitted since early 60,s I had .243,.223,.22 rRimie and several shotguns..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Fac air will shoot effectively out to about 80 yards. It has less ftlb( in this country commonly up to 40 ftlb) than a rimfire and therefore more suitable to smaller shooting areas. A rimfire, say a .17 hmr is effective out to 200-250 yards( based purely on my own experience) and has a lot more ftlb energy( up to 230 ftlb) and is hence suited to larger areas. Fac air projectiles are much less likely to rich..roci...riococh... bounce off stuff and keep going with much oomph. Ergo, you want a Fac air rifle for your case, though I doubt the land would be cleared for shooting if it has a public footpath going through it. Not unless the Police were happy for you to close the path once a week. There are loads of ways to interpret everything, and I have a VERY different interpretation to you on much of this. 80 yards with FAC air, what power and why, when Most with a .22lr zero at 50-60 yards apparently! Where did you get 230ft lb for a HMR, the majority of 17g ammo is rated at 245ft lb! A HMR may well be effective out to 200-250 yards, actually it is, my best bunny is 258 with one, but this isn't a ******* contest and I do not see a HMR as a tool for these distances. Stick to 100-150 yards generally! I am sick to death of this ricochet business, a .22FAC air will most likely bounce more than a HMR V-Max, ANY ammo can ricochet, the fact is if you hit your quarry then there is generally little to be concerned about, even with a .22lr, which is still the most popular civil calibre in the world, so it must have something going for it. I have hardly any land that does not have one or More Public footpaths through, or next to it, two of my Golf Courses are also plagued with unwelcome rambles exercising their right to **** up the golfers, it has NEVER stopped any shooting on any of my sites, and for much bigger calibres as well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoolhandMal Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Have a breather Deks..! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyska Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 Ah. I've never had any permission with public access... I stand corrected. Edit- PB with the HMR is 202 yards on two rabbits. I would feel comfortable and confident pushing that to 250. No worries fella, its not a surprise that someone would think that firearms shouldn't be used near footpaths, like I said I have lots of them, just like any shooting, I just have to keep an eye out for peeps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon6ppc Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 i ave a united utilites pas to shoot vermin,fox etc on land for the water board ,on thousands of acres.the footpaths are every were you look.i use rifles at night and air rifles in the day, mainly first thing in the morning before the joggers and mountain bikers get at it.you ave to use your head, i will use fac air rifle all the time compared to a rimfire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pabs Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 There are loads of ways to interpret everything, and I have a VERY different interpretation to you on much of this. 80 yards with FAC air, what power and why, when Most with a .22lr zero at 50-60 yards apparently! Where did you get 230ft lb for a HMR, the majority of 17g ammo is rated at 245ft lb! A HMR may well be effective out to 200-250 yards, actually it is, my best bunny is 258 with one, but this isn't a ******* contest and I do not see a HMR as a tool for these distances. Stick to 100-150 yards generally! I am sick to death of this ricochet business, a .22FAC air will most likely bounce more than a HMR V-Max, ANY ammo can ricochet, the fact is if you hit your quarry then there is generally little to be concerned about, even with a .22lr, which is still the most popular civil calibre in the world, so it must have something going for it. I have hardly any land that does not have one or More Public footpaths through, or next to it, two of my Golf Courses are also plagued with unwelcome rambles exercising their right to **** up the golfers, it has NEVER stopped any shooting on any of my sites, and for much bigger calibres as well! Why Fac air rather than .22lr? Well, as per the OP, he is worried about the shooting area!! Oops, 15ftlb off the rated energy of a red/blue tip. It was a rough quote from memory. No Dekers, there is no contest on long range rabbit shooting. You agree that the HMR is effective out to 200-250 yards, but you don't see it as a tool for these distances?? I did not say the pellets would not ricochet. I said that if they did, they would have far less energy in them afterwards. And thanks, the public right of way/shooting had been cleared up a few posts back... :thumbs: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter.123 Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 Any projectile is likely to ricochet, be it a ball bearing or a Flint or a bullet head!!! Anything will ricochet off hard ground!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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