turbo33 Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) I recently applied for my fac. 1x.17hmr, 1x moderator...1x.22air rifle, 1x moderator...1x .22r/f 1x moderator. The licence lists all three rifles applied for, and 1x .17 moderator and 1x .22 moderator. One moderator missing! I shall give the firearms dept a buzz anyway, but it would appear that either they have made a mistake and left off one of the .22 moderators, or they assume I shall swap it between the air and r/f, or it doesn't require listing for the air rifle I asked the feo at the interview why mods have to be applied for and his answer was that they disrupt the flame from powder burning so require special consideration. So obviously that wouldn't apply to air. Confused Your thoughts..or anyone with just fac air, does your cert list the mod? Edited May 31, 2012 by turbo33 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northamptonclay Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Would the fac air not have a integral mod ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8 90 Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Ring em & get it put on - you cannot use a Moderator on it unless it is on your FAC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livefast123 Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Check the conditions to see if both .22 use the same moderator, some forces do this as you could get a SAK which would fit both the .22's without any issues. BTW i've yet to see a .22RF belching flame......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 I asked the feo at the interview why mods have to be applied for and his answer was that they disrupt the flame from powder burning so require special consideration. What the If thats as close to word for word as the FEO said, i would question there position as FEO. sounds a bit of a #lonker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham M Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Now here's a question. If you have a 12ftlbs air rifle, you don't need a moderator on ticket........... So if the air rifle is FAC rated could you not simply buy an unproofed air rifle moderator off ticket and use that....... Or do you (by law) have to fit an FAC rated moderator onto an FAC rated air rifle in case it explodes under all that power (yes I know ) G.M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 I recently applied for my fac. 1x.17hmr, 1x moderator...1x.22air rifle, 1x moderator...1x .22r/f 1x moderator. The licence lists all three rifles applied for, and 1x .17 moderator and 1x .22 moderator. One moderator missing! I shall give the firearms dept a buzz anyway, but it would appear that either they have made a mistake and left off one of the .22 moderators, or they assume I shall swap it between the air and r/f, or it doesn't require listing for the air rifle I asked the feo at the interview why mods have to be applied for and his answer was that they disrupt the flame from powder burning so require special consideration. So obviously that wouldn't apply to air. Confused Your thoughts..or anyone with just fac air, does your cert list the mod? He's wrong then. It's because the definition of 'Firearm' in the Firearms Act includes accessories intended to reduce the noise or flash produced by discharging a firearm. In short, a detachable moderator is, legally speaking, a firearm in its own right so you need a slot for it. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Ring em & get it put on - you cannot use a Moderator on it unless it is on your FAC If he has one mod there is nothing to prevent him from swapping it between guns. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolly Posted June 1, 2012 Report Share Posted June 1, 2012 i do have a ticket for 17 hmr and 22 rf mods but i just swap them over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stubby Posted June 1, 2012 Report Share Posted June 1, 2012 I was at eastern sporting last week, as for the last 5 months or so, Ive been using one SAK moderator between two rifles, even though I had the slot I had'ent bought it yet, now they asked if it was for firearm or air rifle, then went on to explain to a new customer, that had I said air rifle, they could just hand another sak mod across the counter to me, but as I'd said rimfire, they needed to check my cert, at no time when he asked air rifle or firearm did he ask 12ft lb etc, I therefore reckon a fac air dont need it on the ticket, and thats why they have only offered two, I could be wrong, phone your fao up and ask Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo33 Posted June 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2012 He's wrong then. It's because the definition of 'Firearm' in the Firearms Act includes accessories intended to reduce the noise or flash produced by discharging a firearm. In short, a detachable moderator is, legally speaking, a firearm in its own right so you need a slot for it. J. Thats EXACTLY feo said So I guess the flash doesn't apply to an air rifle, but the sound reduction would hence the need for it to have a "slot" Anyway, phone call made, all sorted so thanks for all the input :good: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted June 2, 2012 Report Share Posted June 2, 2012 fac air needs a moderator listed on your ticket. The fact you can buy a suitable mod without a ticket for it is meaningless. The FEO sounds like the all to familular know-nothing official from money wasting central Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 Now here's a question. If you have a 12ftlbs air rifle, you don't need a moderator on ticket........... So if the air rifle is FAC rated could you not simply buy an unproofed air rifle moderator off ticket and use that....... Or do you (by law) have to fit an FAC rated moderator onto an FAC rated air rifle in case it explodes under all that power (yes I know ) G.M. You can fit whatever mod you want, I have bought several 12ft lb Air Rifle mods and fitted them to FAC tools. What you need is a slot for the mod on a FAC tool, what you fit is down to you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 I was at eastern sporting last week, as for the last 5 months or so, Ive been using one SAK moderator between two rifles, even though I had the slot I had'ent bought it yet, now they asked if it was for firearm or air rifle, then went on to explain to a new customer, that had I said air rifle, they could just hand another sak mod across the counter to me, but as I'd said rimfire, they needed to check my cert, at no time when he asked air rifle or firearm did he ask 12ft lb etc, I therefore reckon a fac air dont need it on the ticket, and thats why they have only offered two, I could be wrong, phone your fao up and ask As a component part of an Airgun it also needs to be recorded on their register of airgun sales along with the purchasers name and address. J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 I was at eastern sporting last week, as for the last 5 months or so, Ive been using one SAK moderator between two rifles, even though I had the slot I had'ent bought it yet, now they asked if it was for firearm or air rifle, then went on to explain to a new customer, that had I said air rifle, they could just hand another sak mod across the counter to me, but as I'd said rimfire, they needed to check my cert, at no time when he asked air rifle or firearm did he ask 12ft lb etc, I therefore reckon a fac air dont need it on the ticket, and thats why they have only offered two, I could be wrong, phone your fao up and ask If it's FAC Air it needs a slot for a Mod Stubby! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham M Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 (edited) You can fit whatever mod you want, I have bought several 12ft lb Air Rifle mods and fitted them to FAC tools. What you need is a slot for the mod on a FAC tool, what you fit is down to you! Yes I know........ I was trying to open people's eyes to the law. I have an old PH mod on my .22rf which I bought some years ago at the Midland Game Fair. I had a choice at the time to buy either an “Un-proofed” PH mod' for @ £15, or a “Proofed” PH mod for @ £30. Needless to say I bought the un-proofed mod and fitted it without any worries, because that was all I had ever used in the past without any problems at all. And let's face it, probably not one of those Game Fair moderators had actually been proof tested because the Proof House simply tests ONE out of the huge batch of moderators sent by the manufacturer, and then proofs the whole batch. So the chances of actually getting the one that was actually proofed is extremely remote. In fact I read an article a few years ago about a batch of T8 moderators that were sent for proof. Every one of them was returned with the plastic protective wrapping still attached and with the proof marks laser etched through the wrapping..NOT ONE OF THEM HAD BEEN ACTUALLY TESTED. And then there was the case of the .223 moderator that the Proof House claimed had been subjected to a high pressure proof testing ..FOR A .308 WIN. Had a .308 been fired through a .223 moderator it would have blown the front off the can due to the hole being too small.......they were never able to fully explain that one!!!!! The whole “Proof” thing was a scam from day one when the Proof Houses in Birmingham an London got together to find a way of scaring a gun hating Labour government into allowing them to fleece the gun owners of this country into paying for proof work that was not needed. Has ANYONE on this forum EVER heard of a rifle barrel exploding after a threading job?.......... No?? Neither have I, and neither has either of the Proof Houses. G.M. Edited June 4, 2012 by Graham M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted June 4, 2012 Report Share Posted June 4, 2012 Yes I know........ I was trying to open people's eyes to the law. I have an old PH mod on my .22rf which I bought some years ago at the Midland Game Fair. I had a choice at the time to buy either an “Un-proofed” PH mod' for @ £15, or a “Proofed” PH mod for @ £30. Needless to say I bought the un-proofed mod and fitted it without any worries, because that was all I had ever used in the past without any problems at all. And let's face it, probably not one of those Game Fair moderators had actually been proof tested because the Proof House simply tests ONE out of the huge batch of moderators sent by the manufacturer, and then proofs the whole batch. So the chances of actually getting the one that was actually proofed is extremely remote. In fact I read an article a few years ago about a batch of T8 moderators that were sent for proof, every one of them was returned with the plastic protective wrapping still attached and with the proof marks laser etched through the wrapping..NOT ONE OF THEM HAD BEEN ACTUALLY TESTED. And then there was the case of the .223 moderator that the Proof House claimed had been subjected to a high pressure proof testing ..FOR A .308 WIN. Had a .308 been fired through a .223 moderator it would have blown the front off the can due to the hole being too small.......they were never able to fully explain that one!!!!! The whole “Proof” thing was a scam from day one when the Proof Houses in Birmingham an London got together to find a way of scaring a gun hating Labour government into allowing them to fleece the gun owners of this country into paying for proof work that was not needed. Has ANYONE on this forum EVER heard of a rifle barrel exploding after a threading job?.......... No?? Neither have I, and neither has either of the Proof Houses. G.M. Very well said. The proof houses are private companies who lost a lot of work when the pistol ban was enacted and so needed to find another source of income. No one will ever be prosecuted for having an unproved moderator or threaded muzzle because the proof house cannot afford to lose the case. If they did then all the proofing of mods and threads that they already do will instantly disappear. Also, I do wonder how sticky things might get for them when the inevitable questions are asked about how this private company can lawfully operate as the body which sets the rules and enforces them. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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