Dekers Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 have you had a look at the new .17 Hornet?? very good round! copy and paste is an awesome tool! cheers bill! haha That's as maybe but the question I am interested in as well is, WHAT FOR? Just where does a .17 Hornet excel that the HMR, WMR, .22Hornet, assorted .17 and .20 CF's etc don't work, what quarry is ideal for a .17 Hornet that the others don't do as well or better, and in some cases cheaper? .5 API ammo is very good round, but it isn't much use on the farm! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amazed Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Jls stalker cf mod proofed up to 223 mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 the .17 hornet can be used for anything! Rabbits, foxes and even small deer! it has nearly exactly the same trajectory and range of a .223 rem, which is over 100 yards more than the .22 Hornet! but as its much smaller and lighter it doesnt damaged the pelt on the outside! but at the same time cases a massive internal tempory and permanent shock void! you tell me what you would go for! and Wymberly im sorry but how what you put read, it just seemed like you had copy and pasted it! haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 (edited) the .17 hornet can be used for anything! Rabbits, foxes and even small deer! it has nearly exactly the same trajectory and range of a .223 rem, which is over 100 yards more than the .22 Hornet! but as its much smaller and lighter it doesnt damaged the pelt on the outside! but at the same time cases a massive internal tempory and permanent shock void! you tell me what you would go for! and Wymberly im sorry but how what you put read, it just seemed like you had copy and pasted it! haha So could a .5 API. Plenty of better overall rabbit guns, and many would argue plenty of better fox calibres, and as for small deer, just which part of a .17 Hornet is a minimum of 50g, 1000ft lb and .220? I'm not trying to get funny, I simply don't get what is so special/useful about a .17 Hornet when compared to this selection..... HMR, WMR, .22Hornet, assorted .17 and .20 CF's etc Edited January 26, 2013 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scobydog Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 1943? Was that early enough to still be .223? Might be, will have to check it out, it is a great little rifle for fox and rabbit though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 the .17 hornet can be used for anything! Rabbits, foxes and even small deer! it has nearly exactly the same trajectory and range of a .223 rem, which is over 100 yards more than the .22 Hornet! but as its much smaller and lighter it doesnt damaged the pelt on the outside! but at the same time cases a massive internal tempory and permanent shock void! you tell me what you would go for! and Wymberly im sorry but how what you put read, it just seemed like you had copy and pasted it! haha Your apology is noted. However,I think you must be a little confused. The trajectory of the 17 Hornet may well be nearly the same as the 223 Rem, but its range certainly isn't. And as for having a 100 yard edge on its big brother, that is patently ridiculous. Without acknowledging its source, from what you put one could think that you've been reading something not of UK origin and particularly so with regard to the mention of deer, however small. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 the .17 hornet can be used for anything! Rabbits, foxes and even small deer! it has nearly exactly the same trajectory and range of a .223 rem, which is over 100 yards more than the .22 Hornet! but as its much smaller and lighter it doesnt damaged the pelt on the outside! but at the same time cases a massive internal tempory and permanent shock void! you tell me what you would go for! and Wymberly im sorry but how what you put read, it just seemed like you had copy and pasted it! haha It cannot be used legally on any UK deer (not even Scottish roe, CWD or Munties) - end of! it used to be a popular round for Roe but the deer act changed all that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scobydog Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Might be, will have to check it out, it is a great little rifle for fox and rabbit though. Just done a quick bit of research and it is possible, also mentions that some are able to use .224, these were the later commercially made rifles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 1943? Was that early enough to still be .223? The savage was the first magazine fed bolt action off the shelf rifle chambered in hornet, previously Hornet was a re-barrelled falling block custom or a single / double break action. The American Military adopted the 5.56 Nato in 1964- the .222 was far earlier and came out in 1950 (the .223 is an adapted .222 magnum- again a later calibre, the .222 magnum was pitched at being the choice initially) - so no such thing as .223 rem in 1943! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Hes on about hornet. Moden ones are .224 Old ones shoot .223 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 I shouldn't refer to this graph 35 grn v-max is rubbish! fast at the muzzle total pants down range. 45 grn offerings are hand loaded to 2900 and factory is generally 300 fps down on this - still beats 3050 fps 35 v-max though even at sedate factory load velocities. Graphs like this arte produced to sell the one shown in the best light - let the customer beware! Hes on about hornet. Moden ones are .224 Old ones shoot .223 Some are still .223 today but its rare, yes it will be .223 at that age Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 this is a hornady graph, and all bullets used as test subjects are all hornady... they wudnt try and make their bullets look rubbish in comparison to their other calibres now would they... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 this is a hornady graph, and all bullets used as test subjects are all hornady... they wudnt try and make their bullets look rubbish in comparison to their other calibres now would they... Of course they will when they are trying to promote the .17 Hornet! http://www.rifleshootermag.com/2011/11/09/the-new-hornady-17-hornet/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cal 7888 Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 i dont think they would some how... the saying "shooting yourself in the foot" comes to mind! lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockercas Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 The 17 hornet will die a quick death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 i dont think they would some how... the saying "shooting yourself in the foot" comes to mind! lol Well the 35 is pants and you could get better higher BC hornady hornet bullets previously- the American is often too interested in muzzle speed and the seller will pander to that The 17 hornet will die a quick death. The new Winchester .17 rim fire will see to that I think IF prices of ammo become as suggested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 cal 7888 There is a lot of difference between looking at any chart or reading an article and using a calibre and assorted ammo for it in the field. I still don't get the 17 Hornet, I'm not having a go at it, I just don't get it, when there are so many other calibres around it, (how many of the other .17 CF have made it into the mainstream?) and I'm waiting for someone to present a compelling argument for it, and specify quarry, simple as, I'm not slagging it off or anyone for buying or using one. Frankly I'm not convinced about the usefulness of the newly announced .17 Win Mag either, but that is early days and a LOT remains open/unknown about that, so I will keep an open mind. As so often the thread has wondered, lets not get too far away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scobydog Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 Brno fox 22 hornet £300 on gun star. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 cal 7888 There is a lot of difference between looking at any chart or reading an article and using a calibre and assorted ammo for it in the field. I still don't get the 17 Hornet, I'm not having a go at it, I just don't get it, when there are so many other calibres around it, (how many of the other .17 CF have made it into the mainstream?) and I'm waiting for someone to present a compelling argument for it, and specify quarry, simple as, I'm not slagging it off or anyone for buying or using one. Frankly I'm not convinced about the usefulness of the newly announced .17 Win Mag either, but that is early days and a LOT remains open/unknown about that, so I will keep an open mind. As so often the thread has wondered, lets not get too far away. The Winchester depends totally on ammo cost, its not about the .17 cal just its energy, trajectory and COST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted January 26, 2013 Report Share Posted January 26, 2013 i have a friend that has killed over 1000 foxes with his 22 hornet since 1962, 45 gr bullets downloaded to about 2700. i would tend to agree with the above that based onmy 2 years with a 17AH the17 hornet is not a fox caliber with 20gr bullets, am loading a few 25s to try, the US lads say that the 25 is far more suited for fox. 17 Hornet is a really great crow round though. A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 27, 2013 (edited) http://www.czrifles.co.uk/czrifles-for-sale/ this seems a good price, would prefere the American personally though, how come the american is so much more expensive Edited January 27, 2013 by bicykillgaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted January 27, 2013 Report Share Posted January 27, 2013 the saying "shooting yourself in the foot" comes to mind! lol The saying "digging a hole" is probably more appropriate in your case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted January 28, 2013 Report Share Posted January 28, 2013 the .17 hornet can be used for anything! Rabbits, foxes and even small deer! it has nearly exactly the same trajectory and range of a .223 rem, which is over 100 yards more than the .22 Hornet! but as its much smaller and lighter it doesnt damaged the pelt on the outside! but at the same time cases a massive internal tempory and permanent shock void! you tell me what you would go for! I think you're very much mistaken. Don't get me wrong I like the idea of the .17 - I'm having one built and it's looking good. BUT... There's no way on earth it will shoot like a .223. Maybe the trajectory at close range is the same but the energy is well lacking. And that "massive" shock void is about the size of a grapefruit in ballistic gel - not even enough for the fragments to reach the heart of an adult roe and that's assuming you manage to shoot between the ribs without hitting one! The .22 Hornet used to be the calibre of choice for roe stalkers before the introduction of the deer act, and I can tell you first hand that it does work. But the .17? Maybe with a head shot in desperate times but even then I'd have to be certain it was going to suffer a lot if I left it before I'd make that call. Back to the OP's question, I'd budget £400. That should get you a tidy rifle, preferably a CZ. The best factory ammo I found for mine was S&B at £8/20, it grouped very well but was a bit slow. Not a bad thing for bunnies, it didn't damage them too badly at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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