WinchesterDave Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Just a quick one. I have got a cabinet which requires you to break your guns down before putting them in. It has a capacity of two guns but is it within rules to be able To put a third in there if it fits? Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yes - but your FEO would need to clear it - usually he sets the capacity as the manufacturers are a little conservative, I have 1 that is a 3 gun cleared for 5 or 6 and a 5 gun cleared for 8 I think! Regards, Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinchesterDave Posted February 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Thanks for the quick reply gixer, appreciated. ATB Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Just a quick one. I have got a cabinet which requires you to break your guns down before putting them in. It has a capacity of two guns but is it within rules to be able To put a third in there if it fits? Dave. Yes, you can put as many as you want in. The number of guns stated by the manufacturer is nothing to do with any legal limit or anything like that - it is merely a guide or how many it is physically fitted out for. For instance, you can usually get at least five guns in a three gun shotgun cabinet. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yes - but your FEO would need to clear it - usually he sets the capacity as the manufacturers are a little conservative, I have 1 that is a 3 gun cleared for 5 or 6 and a 5 gun cleared for 8 I think! Regards, Gixer This isn't true. The police do not 'set' or 'clear' the capacity. You must store the guns to which your certificate relates in accordance with the safe storage condition on it. How you do that is entirely up to you and if you fail to adhere to the condition then you will get done and rightly so. If you have a three gun cabinet and can get twenty guns in by stripping them to their component parts then that is up to you and you commit no offence in doing so. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinchesterDave Posted February 3, 2013 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Thank you for the responses guys it's cleared things up Dave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yes - but your FEO would need to clear it - usually he sets the capacity as the manufacturers are a little conservative, I have 1 that is a 3 gun cleared for 5 or 6 and a 5 gun cleared for 8 I think! Regards, Gixer This isn't true. The police do not 'set' or 'clear' the capacity. You must store the guns to which your certificate relates in accordance with the safe storage condition on it. How you do that is entirely up to you and if you fail to adhere to the condition then you will get done and rightly so. If you have a three gun cabinet and can get twenty guns in by stripping them to their component parts then that is up to you and you commit no offence in doing so. J. gixer1, If that is what your FEO is telling you he is flexing muscles he doesn't have, as J says above, HE does not control your storage or how many guns you are allowed in any cabinet. Seems to me some Regions and Individual FEO are making it up as they go along! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 gents - we all know there are various forces with interpretations - it's no different to some feo's claiming you need a house alarm - out local one is a topper of a guy and I am sure it states somewhere that you cannot purchase more guns than your cabinet can accommodate. To say its not true is bull as there are many things in firearms law that are open to interpretation such as the fox/vermin debate.... Regards, Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 gents - we all know there are various forces with interpretations - it's no different to some feo's claiming you need a house alarm - out local one is a topper of a guy and I am sure it states somewhere that you cannot purchase more guns than your cabinet can accommodate. To say its not true is bull as there are many things in firearms law that are open to interpretation such as the fox/vermin debate.... Regards, Gixer Sorry but it is true. The police do not need to 'clear' or 'certify' your cabinets or anything similar to that. Nowhere does any piece of law say that you cannot purchase more guns that your cabinets can hold. You are bound by the safe storage condition on your cert and nothing else. As long as you comply with it then there is no problem. Sure, if you go out any purchase more guns than you can physically store securely then you are in contravention of the condition on your certificate. However, if you go out and buy another cabinet or even chuck your cabinets out and build a secure gun room then you do not break the law. The police may ask you to let them know if you change your security arrangments but that is not the same thing. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) Sorry but it is true. The police do not need to 'clear' or 'certify' your cabinets or anything similar to that. Nowhere does any piece of law say that you cannot purchase more guns that your cabinets can hold. You are bound by the safe storage condition on your cert and nothing else. As long as you comply with it then there is no problem. Sure, if you go out any purchase more guns than you can physically store securely then you are in contravention of the condition on your certificate. However, if you go out and buy another cabinet or even chuck your cabinets out and build a secure gun room then you do not break the law. The police may ask you to let them know if you change your security arrangments but that is not the same thing. J. I agree with every word you say. But................... gradually made up rules become established in that most dreaded of words - guidelines Edited February 3, 2013 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunneravi Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Law states as many as the certificate holder can safely store. So fill it to the brim! If the cabinet door shuts and locks all is well. Whether it can physically hold 1 or 10 if its locked up and secure fill your boots! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david_r Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 On my last variation put through, adding a couple of rifles, my FEO called me to let me know that there was no problem with the variation, but the number of firearms currently held matched the capacity of my safe. I was told I had to get a larger safe, or add another one before they would release my variation back to me, which I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunneravi Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Different for fac. Sgc is as previously said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) On my last variation put through, adding a couple of rifles, my FEO called me to let me know that there was no problem with the variation, but the number of firearms currently held matched the capacity of my safe. I was told I had to get a larger safe, or add another one before they would release my variation back to me, which I did. Correct - but I'm sure the persons above will tell the FEO to sod off when he calls to tell them this ... regardless of what is written down most feo's I have ever come across inspect cabinets and say a number. I'm all for people who stick to the letter of the law but I'd be willing to bet everyone of the posters on here are more than compliant with whatever their FEO says regardless of what is written down. My FEO is a sensible human and isn't as much concerned with the rules as he is ensuring my guns are safely locked away and I have taken reasonable precautions to prevent people getting to them. Certain people can rattle off all the laws and stipulations they want but it won't change a thing, firearms regulations were written to be slightly fuzzy and open to interpretation with good reason. Regards, Gixer Different for fac. Sgc is as previously said Who mentioned the type of firearm? "Guns" could be either FAC or SGC... Regards, Gixer Edited February 3, 2013 by gixer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Sorry but it is true. The police do not need to 'clear' or 'certify' your cabinets or anything similar to that. Nowhere does any piece of law say that you cannot purchase more guns that your cabinets can hold. You are bound by the safe storage condition on your cert and nothing else. As long as you comply with it then there is no problem. Sure, if you go out any purchase more guns than you can physically store securely then you are in contravention of the condition on your certificate. However, if you go out and buy another cabinet or even chuck your cabinets out and build a secure gun room then you do not break the law. The police may ask you to let them know if you change your security arrangments but that is not the same thing. J. Try telling the FEO he cannot see your cabinet next time he visits and see what he says... Then let me know how the court case goes when you are trying to get your guns back because you tried to push the boundaries of legal Interpretation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hedd-wyn Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) This thread's got me a bit worried. My cabinet is a three gun cabinet (and was advertised as a three gun cabinet) but I can clearly remember the FLO writing down that it had a two gun capacity during my interview. I currently have two shotguns and there's another one on the way this week. I didn't think that capacity was an issue as long as the guns were securely stored. Does this mean that I will be expecting a phone call or visit from my FLO because I have gone 'over capacity??? Edited February 3, 2013 by hedd-wyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_b_wales Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 I had a 5 gun cabinet, but stored 7 guns in there. When my FEO came to inspect everything (renewal of certificates) he had no problem with the amount I had in it. In fact, he commented that I should be careful not to scratch them while removing/putting them back into the cabinet. As long as I could close/lock the cabinet, he had no issues. I had a 5 gun cabinet, but stored 7 guns in there. When my FEO came to inspect everything (renewal of certificates) he had no problem with the amount I had in it. In fact, he commented that I should be careful not to scratch them while removing/putting them back into the cabinet. As long as I could close/lock the cabinet, he had no issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Correct - but I'm sure the persons above will tell the FEO to sod off when he calls to tell them this CORRECT ... regardless of what is written down most feo's I have ever come across inspect cabinets and say a number. I'm all for people who stick to the letter of the law but I'd be willing to bet everyone of the posters on here are more than compliant with whatever their FEO says regardless of what is written down. see below My FEO is a sensible human and isn't as much concerned with the rules as he is ensuring my guns are safely locked away and I have taken reasonable precautions to prevent people getting to them. Certain people can rattle off all the laws and stipulations they want but it won't change a thing, firearms regulations were written to be slightly fuzzy and open to interpretation with good reason. Come on, which regulations, how fuzzy and what is the good reason? Regards, Gixer Who mentioned the type of firearm? "Guns" could be either FAC or SGC... Regards, Gixer Gixer, there is NOTHING written down in law about cabinet capacity, indeed you do not even need a cabinet. If your region have added some condition that is simply your region flexing muscles and adding something themselves.. I have educated my previous FEO on the law several times and he is now history. I have also had serious legal dealings with Wiltshires last Chief Constable and their Firearms Dept, they lost!. I do not take Bull from anyone, if they are wrong then they are wrong and I certainly do not crawl to my Firearms dept! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 This thread's got me a bit worried. My cabinet is a three gun cabinet (and was advertised as a three gun cabinet) but I can clearly remember the FLO writing down that it was a two gun cabinet during my interview. I have currently have two shotguns and there's another one on the way this week. I didn't think that capacity was not an issue as long as the guns were securely stored. Does this mean that I will be expecting a phone call or visit from my FLO because I have gone 'over capacity??? You have two choices - 1) call him and tell him and he'll probably say "no problem" 2) when he calls tell him a guy off a forum told you to tell him it's none if his business as long as they are secure... In the interests of science please try number 2) and let us all k ow how it goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermincinerator Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) This thread's got me a bit worried. My cabinet is a three gun cabinet (and was advertised as a three gun cabinet) but I can clearly remember the FLO writing down that it had a two gun capacity during my interview. I currently have two shotguns and there's another one on the way this week. I didn't think that capacity was an issue as long as the guns were securely stored. Does this mean that I will be expecting a phone call or visit from my FLO because I have gone 'over capacity??? You have nothing to worry about hedd wyn. Ian. Edited February 3, 2013 by Vermincinerator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Try telling the FEO he cannot see your cabinet next time he visits and see what he says... Then let me know how the court case goes when you are trying to get your guns back because you tried to push the boundaries of legal Interpretation. Who said anything about refusing the FEO access to your cabinets, you said they would have to be cleared for capacity by the FEO! :hmm: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermincinerator Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 You have two choices - 1) call him and tell him and he'll probably say "no problem" 2) when he calls tell him a guy off a forum told you to tell him it's none if his business as long as they are secure... In the interests of science please try number 2) and let us all k ow how it goes. hedd-wyn has another choice, to say nothing simply because he does not have too. Ian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Gixer, there is NOTHING written down in law about cabinet capacity, indeed you do not even need a cabinet. If your region have added some condition that is simply your region flexing muscles and adding something themselves.. I have educated my previous FEO on the law several times and he is now history. I have also had serious legal dealings with Wiltshires last Chief Constable and their Firearms Dept, they lost!. I do not take Bull from anyone, if they are wrong then they are wrong and I certainly do not crawl to my Firearms dept! The good reason would be to allow the FEO some give or take on matters.... The vague descriptions are most certainly open to interpretations....if you can't see that I suggest you read them again! Glad you educated the southern police force. Congrats. You can say you don't take bull all you like but that wouldn't stop anyone taking your guns, if you believe that you are simply being naive - the usual course of action is that if any doubt is in place then guns are removed and you have to prove you are safe to get them back. And needing a cabinet is not what this is about - its showing you can accommodate or safely secure a firearm - that was my point, if the FEO sees you have a cabinet that would hold 5 guns and you buy 15 he WILL ask questions. My local FEO is not "flexing" anything - he applies common sense - something I fear is in short supply in some comments. Guns in the UK are a privilege - not a right... Regards, Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Who said anything about refusing the FEO access to your cabinets, you said they would have to be cleared for capacity by the FEO! :hmm: If there's no legal obligation then why would he need to see it - going by your posts you can just tell him you have made the correct provisions for storage couldn't you.... No legal need for him to see them. It's a wonder we have all the threads on mounting cabinets - at least you can now answer them telling them to state "I don't need a cabinet" Regards, Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted February 3, 2013 Report Share Posted February 3, 2013 Yes - but your FEO would need to clear it - usually he sets the capacity as the manufacturers are a little conservative, I have 1 that is a 3 gun cleared for 5 or 6 and a 5 gun cleared for 8 I think! Regards, Gixer WRONG, no legal requirement, show me the section in the fuzzy Firearms Act that says he has to clear your cabinets capacity! The good reason would be to allow the FEO some give or take on matters.... The vague descriptions are most certainly open to interpretations....if you can't see that I suggest you read them again! Glad you educated the southern police force. Congrats. You can say you don't take bull all you like but that wouldn't stop anyone taking your guns, if you believe that you are simply being naive - the usual course of action is that if any doubt is in place then guns are removed and you have to prove you are safe to get them back. And needing a cabinet is not what this is about - its showing you can accommodate or safely secure a firearm - that was my point, if the FEO sees you have a cabinet that would hold 5 guns and you buy 15 he WILL ask questions. My local FEO is not "flexing" anything - he applies common sense - something I fear is in short supply in some comments. Guns in the UK are a privilege - not a right... Regards, Gixer Fuzzy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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