GW80 Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 I'm for breeding a springer bitch this spring, this will be her fourth heat and she is mature enough to breed from, plus she has no faults. But the problem is i'm only 50% owner of her and there is a bit of a disagreement on which stud dog to use. The first stud has been made up to champion this year and is a fine dog, however i want to breed this bitch with this dogs sire. In my eyes it is the older dog which is throwing the good pups . The problem being that the older sire has no awards to his name and the co owner of this bitch thinks the pups might be better with the champion on the pedigree. What would be your thought on this ? I know which sire i want!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ghost Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) When you are looking for a stud dog, I believe you are right go for the dog that made the champions as long as it has the qualities you are looking for. My last Pup was a French Bulldog, Below is the sire I wanted this pup to be from. He was top stud dog in 2009, 2010, 2011, & 2012 I could have gone for any of his offspring but I thought like yourself. http://ingrus.net/fr...ls.php?id=10959 The stud dog above, has again had a pup 'best bitch' placed at Crufts this year (CH NORCAIRN DARK ANGEL JW SHCM) If I had two Cocker's one was a champion and the other had sired many champions I would pick the later every time. The champion has not proved it self as a stud dog, while the other has and if I was getting a litter of pups that would matter. Edited March 10, 2013 by The Ghost Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker boy Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) I don't get this "go to the dog that produced the good dog" way of thinking. If you like dog "a" but follow that rule you go to dog "b" that sired "a". But why do you stop there?, surely "c" sired "b" that sired "a". Yes!?,no!?.But hang on a minute, didn't "d" sire "c" that sired so on and so on. Its never ending. Sire "b" may have been put to a superb bitch line that throws real quality,to produce dog "a", so dog "a" may have more of the bitch line qualities than dog "b" qualities. Go to the dog you have seen doing the job forget going elsewhere. What are the dogs in question by the way? Edited March 10, 2013 by cocker boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW80 Posted March 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 The bitch in question is an open winner and the sire i'm talking about is just a hard hunting dog that has produced 4 open winners in the last 3 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 Flip a coin and beware of 1/2 ownership in future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker boy Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 Who is the ftch dog? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW80 Posted March 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) Who is the ftch dog? / Edited March 11, 2013 by GW80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UGM Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) Romulus? Is he the half brother of Hattonswood Broc? Do you co-own with the breeder? Or someone else? Edited March 10, 2013 by UGM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 I guess if the plan is to sell the pups then the other part owner is right in the factit has champion on its pedigree it will make the pups more sale-able. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee-kinsman Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 (edited) You want to breed the bitch with the sire of FTCH Skronedale Romulus? That would be FTCH Clarburgh Art and that dog is dead. Yes you maybe able to get frozen semen but I'd stick with a traditional line/mating. Theres too much Clarburgh Art blood in working springers in my opinion. Would you not consider a different champion with a distant relative to your bitch? Edited March 10, 2013 by lee-kinsman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker boy Posted March 10, 2013 Report Share Posted March 10, 2013 Have you got the right dog?, like someone has just posted romulus sire is no "just a hard worker", he is probably the best producer of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Actionpigeons Posted March 11, 2013 Report Share Posted March 11, 2013 People do like to see red in the pedigree, rightly or wrongly. If you have orders for the pups it wont really matter if you use the older dog, if you don't the younger dog will put red into the pedigree and make the pups more saleable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vixen. Posted March 12, 2013 Report Share Posted March 12, 2013 Putting your bitch to a FTCh doesn't always make them saleable to the right people though...you just end up selling them to people brainwashed by how much red there is. I don't know who the dog in question is but if it's a significant sire, but not a champion, those who know, will know about it so selling them shouldn't make a blind bit of difference. Question to ask yourself is which dog will compliment your bitch the most? I'm a big fan of the strength of the bitch line view of things, with a solid bitch line on both sides you're heading in the right direction IMO. Having said that, breeding is a lottery altogether....what everyone else said really - don't do half shares again haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocker boy Posted March 12, 2013 Report Share Posted March 12, 2013 I would rather have mine line saturated with clarburgh art blood than some of the **** out there that is passing as top quality now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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