Hamster Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I have difficulty with intelligent design, more likely it's following the path of least resistance. Evolution can explain pretty much the entire universe, although I have had my sitting in the hide in wonderment moment too, if you isolate everything that cause you to gasp in delight it is possible to see how it could have evolved. Don't try and take it all in one go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeredup Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 any who before this turns into a bun fight what came first the eggy or the chicken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 if there is a god he/must be one cruel twisted son of a gun!!! why do we have babies dying of cancer are we to believe they or their parents have offended some supreme being?? nope its all twaddle!!! Ponder this: If you could hear your neighbor on a daily basis, tell their child they were bad and made the child get on it's knees and apologise for being a bad child from birth. The child, no matter how hard it tried, could never be 'good', but had to beg the parents for their forgiveness, but no matter how much it cried for forgiveness the parents wouldn't utter a peep or acknowledge the child. You'd be onto the police and NSPCC in no time, eh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I have difficulty with intelligent design, more likely it's following the path of least resistance. Evolution can explain pretty much the entire universe, although I have had my sitting in the hide in wonderment moment too, if you isolate everything that cause you to gasp in delight it is possible to see how it could have evolved. Don't try and take it all in one go. Intelligent design and evolution can be comfortable bedfellows in my view Ponder this: If you could hear your neighbor on a daily basis, tell their child they were bad and made the child get on it's knees and apologise for being a bad child from birth. The child, no matter how hard it tried, could never be 'good', but had to beg the parents for their forgiveness, but no matter how much it cried for forgiveness the parents wouldn't utter a peep or acknowledge the child. You'd be onto the police and NSPCC in no time, eh! nicely put Billy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeredup Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 Ponder this: If you could hear your neighbor on a daily basis, tell their child they were bad and made the child get on it's knees and apologise for being a bad child from birth. The child, no matter how hard it tried, could never be 'good', but had to beg the parents for their forgiveness, but no matter how much it cried for forgiveness the parents wouldn't utter a peep or acknowledge the child. You'd be onto the police and NSPCC in no time, eh! i quite agree i would be havin a word witht hem i agree but it still wont convince me there is some one up there watching us all and influencing our lives (well other than the american spy drones) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I sometimes wonder if the whole meaning of some words/titles gets misinterpreted.. Most Atheists I know or have met, like me, are absolutely certain that 'god' doesn't exist... 'God' being the omnipotent superbeing whose son, Jesust Christ, died on the cross 2 millennia ago and then ascended to heaven as told by 'the bible'... a 2 millennia old book written by... well.. no one can be certain really.. at a time when the earth was flat and at the centre of the universe, disease, plague and pestulance were brought on by acts of 'gods' and thunder and lightening were the 'gods' showing their anger... hardly a backdrop for belief by an enlightened 21st century high technology civilisation! Nor do they believe in some magical 'afterlife,' entry to which is dependent on how many 'points' you can earn during your mortal coil on this earth! Anyhoo... just because atheists don't believe in 'God' as defined above.. does not mean they are not open to the possibility of 'intelligent design.' Not all of them, granted.. some are adamant that it was all some big cosmic accident.. Intelligent design however is not the same as God and in most instances raises far more questions than it answers! Pretty much my thoughts too ! but as far as I am concerned there is so much still to learn we wont live long enough to learn it all but I do not believe life is about nothing & from the bible a bit of science agreement " In the beginning there was nothing only Darkness & Void & God said let there be light ! " The big bang theory perhaps ? "" At the end of the world there will be fire in the heavens ! "" A supernova perhaps which science says will engulf the Earth ?? so it looks like science might just have a little agreement on the beginning & the end , if not much else but its a start I suppose ? . Don't forget we all die & more than that I can't say but the God haters ect of course have the answer don't you ?? wish I knew what it was . Have a nice day & peace to all good men perhaps . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neillfrbs Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 i can not belive in this day and age that anyone in the western world can belive there is a god. religion was started many years ago,to keep the masses in line and make the churches rich now we have science that tells us where we all came from evolution. i belive in no high and mighty,wont go in a church of any sort,even for a wedding or funeral,dont want any part in it. if every one thought the same as that,world would be a better place for sure but thats just my view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeredup Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 i can not belive in this day and age that anyone in the western world can belive there is a god. religion was started many years ago,to keep the masses in line and make the churches rich now we have science that tells us where we all came from evolution. i belive in no high and mighty,wont go in a church of any sort,even for a wedding or funeral,dont want any part in it. if every one thought the same as that,world would be a better place for sure but thats just my view. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 ALL & ANY religion is the source of all EVIL in the World. religion is often a crutch for the emotionally weak/vulnerable If a god is so great and good, how can he/she/it justify all the misery, termoil and ills that are inflicted on the world, for example on innocent babies born with physical or mental handicaps Or, a fella I know who has always lived a god fearing christian life, attended church several times weekly, run bible studies classes, sunday school, youth outreach programmes etc etc, then get struck down by a stroke and reduced to a vegetative state ? And his family STILL going to church and giving thanks for his life and the fact he's alive not dead It's utter MADNESS That is because it is not all about a slot machine god, a definition of a god that does not allow any kind of suffering is no god at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) i can not belive in this day and age that anyone in the western world can belive there is a god. religion was started many years ago,to keep the masses in line and make the churches rich now we have science that tells us where we all came from evolution. i belive in no high and mighty,wont go in a church of any sort,even for a wedding or funeral,dont want any part in it. if every one thought the same as that,world would be a better place for sure but thats just my view. That's because you are unable debate or speculate a theory or a possibility ? come on give us the answer mankind & science has been looking for ? . what you don't have it . Blast & dam ! you ain't got ether ! & you thought you were smart ! . Edited May 23, 2013 by Pole Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy. Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) That is because it is not all about a slot machine god, a definition of a god that does not allow any kind of suffering is no god at all. I know I'm up against someone knowledgeable when I question you on religion, so I'll not go out quoting bible verses, as I'm not in the know. However, don't you feel that your above statement is just another way for people to make an excuse for God not doing anything? It reads the same as "It's God's will" or "Insallah". When something does happen, it's "Well my prayers were answered" but if it doesn't, "it's God's will".... Seemingly just an excuse for it not going the way you asked, whilst still assuring yourself there's someone still there to pray to? Edited May 23, 2013 by Billy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 If you believe it will disappear then you have not learned the lesson of history & have not read my post about a vacuum being filled & history all ways seems to repeat its self ! & to quote Winston Churchill " Study history because we have to know where we have been to know where we are going ! " . It is disappearing though. Look at pretty much every developed country which has western European style structure and philosophy; religion in all of them is becoming far less significant to their inhabitants than it was only in relatively recent history. Fifty years ago the majority of people in this country were believers and church goers, now very few are. The same is largely true of most of the rest of Europe. Just because a lack of religion might leave a vaccuum doesn't mean it will be filled with more religion. Most of it has probably been filled with sport, watching telly, pubs, X-boxes, etc. All things which are far better, in my view, than wasting most of your life believing fairy stories. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I sometimes wonder if the whole meaning of some words/titles gets misinterpreted.. Most Atheists I know or have met, like me, are absolutely certain that 'god' doesn't exist... 'God' being the omnipotent superbeing whose son, Jesust Christ, died on the cross 2 millennia ago and then ascended to heaven as told by 'the bible'... a 2 millennia old book written by... well.. no one can be certain really.. at a time when the earth was flat and at the centre of the universe, disease, plague and pestulance were brought on by acts of 'gods' and thunder and lightening were the 'gods' showing their anger... hardly a backdrop for belief by an enlightened 21st century high technology civilisation! Nor do they believe in some magical 'afterlife,' entry to which is dependent on how many 'points' you can earn during your mortal coil on this earth! Anyhoo... just because atheists don't believe in 'God' as defined above.. does not mean they are not open to the possibility of 'intelligent design.' Not all of them, granted.. some are adamant that it was all some big cosmic accident.. Intelligent design however is not the same as God and in most instances raises far more questions than it answers! Answers !!! mate I only wish I could find the answer . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) It is disappearing though. Look at pretty much every developed country which has western European style structure and philosophy; religion in all of them is becoming far less significant to their inhabitants than it was only in relatively recent history. Fifty years ago the majority of people in this country were believers and church goers, now very few are. The same is largely true of most of the rest of Europe. Just because a lack of religion might leave a vaccuum doesn't mean it will be filled with more religion. Most of it has probably been filled with sport, watching telly, pubs, X-boxes, etc. All things which are far better, in my view, than wasting most of your life believing fairy stories. J. And the fastest growing religion in Europe ?? I grew up as a lad close to High Wycombe in Bucks & today as the pubs close (even one of those is a Mosque ) & the Churches are sold the more the Mosque's go up . You should think again ?? I saw on the TV not long ago a clip from a TV debate in a Muslim country where they where debating the rise of Islam & do you what was said by one talkers " WE TOOK CONSTANTINOPLE & WE WILL TAKE ROME AS WELL ! " I think you should think again !!! . Edited May 23, 2013 by Pole Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 (edited) Ponder this: If you could hear your neighbor on a daily basis, tell their child they were bad and made the child get on it's knees and apologise for being a bad child from birth. The child, no matter how hard it tried, could never be 'good', but had to beg the parents for their forgiveness, but no matter how much it cried for forgiveness the parents wouldn't utter a peep or acknowledge the child. You'd be onto the police and NSPCC in no time, eh! If that is supposed to be Christianity,the analogy is poor and shows no knowledge of Christianity. Basically if the child believed in the parent then forgiveness is assured, secondly the parent doesn`t say the child is bad on a daily basis. **Edit** Apologies, that sounded harsher than it should and I presume it was copied from somewhere else? Edited May 23, 2013 by henry d Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krugerandsmith Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 There's a running theme in many threads discussing how the country is being 'over-run by muslims'. The results of a survey were published recently (I can't find a link) which showed that 10% of those under 20 in the UK identified as muslims, yet the population of Christians ageing and reducing. Those who are calling for something to be done to defend "Our Christian country", when was the last time you went to church? What do you _really_ know about the message of Christianity? Serious question. Nial. There's a running theme in many threads discussing how the country is being 'over-run by muslims'. The results of a survey were published recently (I can't find a link) which showed that 10% of those under 20 in the UK identified as muslims, yet the population of Christians ageing and reducing. Those who are calling for something to be done to defend "Our Christian country", when was the last time you went to church? What do you _really_ know about the message of Christianity? Serious question. Nial. I still enjoy going to church however....... Lets face facts ... Christianity is in decline .... Islam is in its ascendancy ....Homosexual Priests.....Vicars .....Bishops ...God help us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeredup Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 Henry we have had this conversation before and its perfectly up to you if you want to believe in a god but for me well my decisions been made Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 Has this not been done on PW before ?? I wont give it long before the Bun Cannons & Splurge guns come out on this ! recon it will a battle field by 10 30 ! & pinned not long after ! . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I know I'm up against someone knowledgeable when I question you on religion, so I'll not go out quoting bible verses, as I'm not in the know. However, don't you feel that your above statement is just another way for people to make an excuse for God not doing anything? It reads the same as "It's God's will" or "Insallah". When something does happen, it's "Well my prayers were answered" but if it doesn't, "it's God's will".... Seemingly just an excuse for it not going the way you asked, whilst still assuring yourself there's someone still there to pray to? sorry but it was a quick reply, I did not mean it to sound that way, it is all about free will that God does not stop all suffering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 What do you _really_ know about the message of Christianity? Even I am not going to answer that Nial, too hard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I'm for a beer & a bacon sarnie !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I can accept the notion of God; I have no means to disprove existence of such a being existence but by the same token I know not one shred of credible evidence to prove the existence of a personal God. None of this affects my conduct in life. I do however absolutely abhor the notion of a masculine God of any form... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 ... I do however absolutely abhor the notion of a masculine God of any form... So does God, I believe the Hebrew form of Yahweh, in Genesis, was both feminine and plural. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyshooter Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I can accept the notion of God; I have no means to disprove existence of such a being existence but by the same token I know not one shred of credible evidence to prove the existence of a personal God. None of this affects my conduct in life. I do however absolutely abhor the notion of a masculine God of any form... I was told, when God made man, she was only kidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beeredup Posted May 23, 2013 Report Share Posted May 23, 2013 I'm for a beer & a bacon sarnie !! All hail the ale!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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