First rifle, ammo questions

[Barney86]

Hello

 

Last weekend I picked up my first rifle, a CZ 527 American in 223 I'm very happy with it so far.

 

I'm slowly putting different brands and weights of bullet through it to find out which is best. At the moment it's trial and error, is that the right way, or is there a method to it?

 

So far I've tried Federal SP (55gr), Federal Premium (40gr), Norma (50gr), Hornady Varmint (53gr), American Eagle FMJ (55gr). The Federal Premium & Norma have been the best so far (1" groups at 100yds).

 

Does this mean my gun is only suitable for 40-50gr bullets, or haven't I tried enough to be able to reach that conclusion? How many different types should I aim to use before deciding? Most shops in the area only seem to stock 3 or 4.

 

Ideally I want sub 1" with a 55gr bullet, but that's only because someone told me it was a good starting point

 

 

Also, if I buy the bits to reload ammo myself, do they go on my FAC like complete rounds? I'd like to do it, but am only allowed to purchase 50 at the moment, whereas bullet heads and primers come in boxes of 100 from what I can tell. I can store 150, so that bit wont be a problem.

 

Thanks!

[Albert 888]

Is it a 1:12" twist. My mate and myself have the cz 527 his is american 1:12" twist and mine is the Varmint 1:9" twist both riffles shoot well,obviously mine is better. Are you target shooting or vermin or both. Mine is mainly target and the best loads for mine are 53g amax homloads. Then 55g vmax factory for fox £17 a box. Ppu55g sp group reasonably well and cost £10 a box. Both riffles shot 40g homloads & 53g homeloads well from 100-300m with side winds. But the best factory round I found was hornandy tap 60g £15 a box for mine 1:9"twist. Expanding heads go on your fac and none expanding dont but once loaded they count as ammo so dont go over your 150. If you want to get bullet on bullet home loading is the way forward. I spent a few months target shooting with ppu then switched to home loads and noticed a real difference.

[fieldwanderer]

I'm pretty new to this too but have been doing a little reading up so I'll try;

 

Bullet weight kinda depends on the twist rate of your rifling (more correctly its bullet length but as a longer bullet is generally heavier its a reasonable guideline), personally I think 55 is a little heavy for a standard .223 but that depends on what twist is standard for your CZ. Have a look on lilja's website - they have a chart of bullet weights vs twist rate that'll give you a good idea (google it, "lilja recommended twist chart" or similar should work).

 

If you don't know the twist rate and can't find out, shout; there's a simple method to roughly measure it with a cleaning rod.

 

One thing to consider (and I'm sorry to put any doubts in your mind) is whether you are shooting well enough to be able to tell which is shooting the best group- if you're rock steady and happy that its ammunition and not the nut behind the bolt that's the problem great!

 

Erm, I'm a firm believer that a barrel will settle in over the first couple of hundred shots so you may find things change anyway to begin with - perhaps you should go enjoy shooting with it for a couple of months before seriously searching for the best ammunition, just a thought.

 

Other than that, I'd be equally interested in answers from those who know much more than I do, check the barrell's not touching the stock and that everything's tight that's meant to be, wait a little while after each shot, with bolt open, to give the barrel a chance to cool. Keep the bore, crown, bolt face and mod clean.

[Underdog]

Your twist is plenty for 55grn but try not to get hung up on it.

Go with what the rifle likes.

 

U.

[al4x]

One answer is they are the better bullets but also important is it being your first rifle and you do get better at shooting groups so don't discount brands too easily. Most .223's will shoot 55 grain bullets but if you are foxing there is nothing wrong with the 40-50 grain offerings, the best advice really is get the one that works best and get out and use it.

[rem708]

When you get a new car one does not expect to just jump in and get it hurtling around corners at stupendous speeds. One has to learn the characteristics of the ride first.

 

I estimate you have only had this rifle a few days so it’s all new to you. This is backed up by your lack of knowledge on reloading (don’t be offended by this comment – just true)

 

So let’s walk before we run. Take one ammunition with a mid weight bullet and stick to this. Once you can consistently produce a group of a particular size then that is the point to switch to another round and do the same. Always go back to your original to occasionally to see if something has changed (a control).

 

There is nothing wrong with all the suggestions of various bullet weights people have suggested but throwing in loads of variables at once is going to give you very bad results.

 

OK, in theory, there is nothing in law to force you to put any reloaded rounds on your ticket because you are not purchasing any loaded ammunition. Components are NOT ammunition until assembled. I have not put anything on my ticket for years bar .22lr and then I often bring that back from the USA so it still does not go on there. My FEO has suggested I do in which case my ticket will spend more time away than with me.

 

I would strongly suggest you have your authority to keep increased substantially if you are experimenting with loads

Edited July 10, 2013 by rem708

[Kes]

Just a few points - I use 40 grain in my rem 700 varmint -1 in 11 and they work very well with excellent downrange ballistics.

So what are you doing - vermin or target? If the former and you arent reloading - try a couple of types of ammo and weight - compare them and drop the worst. Say privvi 40 and 50 grain and federal similar. Look at the bullets ballistics to check e.g. that it will kill foxes with a virtually flat trajectory out to 200 yds - mines zeroed at 150 and drops an inch in 200. Excellent for fox which can obviously appear from 50-200 yds. 40 grain is more than adequate for fox. So you will slowly come across the best buy round that you can use consistently. Then start on the homeloading - I find boattails (hornady v-max 40gr with a ballistic coefficient of .2 are the best for my rifle and you then choose a medium to fast burning powder (to give you the downrange stats you need and experiment with loaded powder weights from the recommended to the hot - being careful at the top end to recognise overpressure signs. Thats how I do it and mine is v happy with Privvi at 40 or 50 grain so I can fall back on those when I need factory loads.

Good luck.

[henry d]

I would also ask whether it is brand new? If it is the groups will tighten up as you shoot the barrel in and some ammo that grouped less well may become better. My triple shot sako ammo fairly well to start with then I found it shot norma better after 100 or so rounds through it and now it shoots reloads even better.

Edited July 10, 2013 by henry d

[Dekers]

I would also ask whether it is brand new? If it is the groups will tighten up as you shoot the barrel in and some ammo that grouped less well may become better. My triple shot sako ammo fairly well to start with then I found it shot norma better after 100 or so rounds through it and now it shoots reloads even better.

 

[Barney86]

Fantastic, thanks for all of the advice! I've saved the page so I can read it again in a hundred shots time.

 

 

To answer a couple of questions; It's 1-12 twist. The rifle is brand new & I've put a whole 76 rounds through it. It is for foxes primarily, but so far I've only shot at targets (and it's been a lot more enjoyable than I expected!).

 

I wasn't aware that it needed time to settle in, but it's good to know I can still blame the gun!

 

 

 

The other problem I have is that I've seen loads of foxes recently, but now I have the rifle I haven't seen one!

[Underdog]

Yep they know!

Now you got to put the work in lol

 

U. :-)

[Dekers]

Fantastic, thanks for all of the advice! I've saved the page so I can read it again in a hundred shots time.

 

 

To answer a couple of questions; It's 1-12 twist. The rifle is brand new & I've put a whole 76 rounds through it. It is for foxes primarily, but so far I've only shot at targets (and it's been a lot more enjoyable than I expected!).

 

I wasn't aware that it needed time to settle in, but it's good to know I can still blame the gun!

 

 

 

The other problem I have is that I've seen loads of foxes recently, but now I have the rifle I haven't seen one! You will not be the first with that problem!

 

I really don't want to take this off somewhere else...but how are you getting on with the cleaning process on this Brand new rifle/barrel that has seen various types of ammo?

[Barney86]

 

I really don't want to take this off somewhere else...but how are you getting on with the cleaning process on this Brand new rifle/barrel that has seen various types of ammo?

 

I give the barrel a squirt of Bisley Bore Cleaner, then run the tampon thing through it a few times after every few groups. No idea if that's good enough!