Drongo Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Ok... So I got one of these new NV scopes... 1st time using digital NV and after last nights outing I'm not too impressed... But before I give up on it entirely, I thought I'd share my experiences and hope for some direction/suggestions/comments... Discovered it's very focus fussy, like if you want to ID and shoot at 50yrd, you focus it to that distance, then if you want to shoot at 55yrd, you got focus it again, then again for 60yrds and so on... I couldn't find any optimum distance that gave me a consistent good picture unlike a traditional optical scope where you can get a good depth of field. Using the built in laser is grand out to about 30/40yrds, but after that I was using a 501B with one of DaveG's low power IR pills and the DX lens (this however reflected badly of my SAK mod and ended up 'whiting out' everything to the point of bringing useless. Removing the moderator cured this problem slightly... I found range ID was difficult and easy shots that were missed several times because I couldn't get a fix on the range. Target ID also difficult, not getting the rabbit shaped outlines and eye shine that all the reviews talk about and the YouTube videos show, instead getting a sparkly eye shine at best but no idea of what from (almost shot the farmers cat last night) Comments on a post card to the usual address please... Drongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Geordie Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Drongo! Have you tried matt black paint on your mod so it don't reflect as much? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pork chop Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 some one suggested fitting a coaster to the focus ring and using the clock face system to help judge range could work,or fit a doubler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bullet boy Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Something's not right bud cos a lot of people swear by them for the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) You are bang-on with your findings Drongo, it seems some are as fussy as heck. i shoot with guy using another one and it's brilliantly clear - he's using the same IR too but with a doubler on it that converts it to about 8 mag - which is too tight a FOV for my liking. We shouldnt have to spend nearly another £200 to get a good focus. I'm considering sending mine back to the importer for them to to get the thing truly focusable. This helps a bit, I machined mine but you can make one with a flip up filter cover: Edited November 23, 2013 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
204 rem Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Get yourself a doubler & t20 ir the doubler Should sort the focus out . i headshot a rabbit last night at 50 yards I could see every detail of the rabbits head.........rem Edited November 23, 2013 by 204 rem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) The doubler can be an advantage if you are willing to narrow your field of view and decrease acquision, but the t-20 will not sort that issue - I shoot with a mate who has both my 501b IR and a T-20 IR: He uses the 501b out of choice. I can imagine you would put those items to good use at centrefire ranges though 204 rem. That rabbits head would be mucho big in the screen with a doubler at 50 yards. The image is far better through his too. It's about high time the manufacturer and importer addressed this focusing issue. Edited November 23, 2013 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
204 rem Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Well said dave mate It's about time they sorted this issue out and not left it for the customer to sort out...... Rem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Well said dave mate It's about time they sorted this issue out and not left it for the customer to sort out...... Rem As soon as i wrote that I decided to follow the matter up and sent TJ's a message and the link to this video and a couple of others to show my point. Edited November 23, 2013 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drongo Posted November 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Good to know it's not me then... Heading out again tonight, cloudy so no moon and see it that makes a difference. Also got rabbit sized card cut outs with reflective eyes which I'm going to set out at measured distances to see if that makes judging range any difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Maughan Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 (edited) Ok... So I got one of these new NV scopes... 1st time using digital NV and after last nights outing I'm not too impressed... But before I give up on it entirely, I thought I'd share my experiences and hope for some direction/suggestions/comments... Discovered it's very focus fussy, like if you want to ID and shoot at 50yrd, you focus it to that distance, then if you want to shoot at 55yrd, you got focus it again, then again for 60yrds and so on... I couldn't find any optimum distance that gave me a consistent good picture unlike a traditional optical scope where you can get a good depth of field. Using the built in laser is grand out to about 30/40yrds, but after that I was using a 501B with one of DaveG's low power IR pills and the DX lens (this however reflected badly of my SAK mod and ended up 'whiting out' everything to the point of bringing useless. Removing the moderator cured this problem slightly... I found range ID was difficult and easy shots that were missed several times because I couldn't get a fix on the range. Target ID also difficult, not getting the rabbit shaped outlines and eye shine that all the reviews talk about and the YouTube videos show, instead getting a sparkly eye shine at best but no idea of what from (almost shot the farmers cat last night) Comments on a post card to the usual address please... Drongo Welcome to the world of Yukon Photon, your findings sound very normal. After reading loads of reviews and listening to others experiences as well as my own I can only conclude that some people are more prepared to but up with its failings than others. The product needs further sorting, either by the maker or the tinkerers before I would go back to it again. Edited November 23, 2013 by Alan Maughan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny Posted November 23, 2013 Report Share Posted November 23, 2013 Seems I must of got a good one if they are any difference. I put the doubler and extra ir on before I'd even turned it on so can't comment what it was like as standard, I can see further than I can shoot with my hmr and won't hesitate to put it on my 22.250. It's the first nv I've looked through so don't really know what else is out there but I couldn't fine anything to match the photon money even with the extras Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drongo Posted November 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2013 No difference last night either... Changed my mod for a smaller one that I wrapped in black paper which removed the IR reflection problem! but I just couldn't get it to agree with focusing... :o( Disappointed now, as I had so much pinned on this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 24, 2013 Report Share Posted November 24, 2013 No difference last night either... Changed my mod for a smaller one that I wrapped in black paper which removed the IR reflection problem! but I just couldn't get it to agree with focusing... :o( Disappointed now, as I had so much pinned on this... Can I suggest you give Thomas Jacks a call about this - and maybe email them a link to this thread? The more people kick off about it the more likely they are to do something about it. For all we know they may have already strated correcting things but might be trying to keep a lid on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drongo Posted November 24, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2013 (edited) Importers...? Done... Edited November 24, 2013 by Drongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 24, 2013 Report Share Posted November 24, 2013 Yup. http://www.thomasjacks.co.uk/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weebster Posted November 24, 2013 Report Share Posted November 24, 2013 I would have thought an email to the manufacturers would be more useful than the importers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 Or both perhaps, but we would have to go through the importer for any repairs/replacement. They'd want the buyer to return to the dealer for any refunding to occur so it only costs them the wholesale price to the dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drongo Posted November 25, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 So.... Tried it again tonight out the patio doors at the neighbours wall 60m away and look see what I got... Excuse crappy hand held iPhone pics... This photo with built in IR This one with modified 501b IR So, now I like it again (sorta) Makes me think... IR reflection of ground or water vapour whilst out prone after bunnies...? These pics with same Moderator as before (SAK) which I believed to be causing problem last two nights now doesn't seem to be interfering...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 (edited) Get yerself a flip up lens cover that dont have a filter in it then cut a sub 1" ish hole in it to start with. The Photon sees very well in bare moonilght because the lens is apparently one with a very low F-stop value - which comes with a very tight depth of vision side effect (focus fussy), Reducing the objective size increases the F stop so it becomes more focus tolerant. If there are any photgraphic guru's watching this they could probably explain that better than me - perhaps with the science bit as well. For their benefit I will point out that the space between the objective lens and the sensor is plain aluminium which is of course very reflective. A smaller hole makes it more focus tolerant and restricts off axis light bounce - bigger lets in more light and more off-axis light bounce. As I see it, starlight comes into the objective lens area, bounces off the alumium inside onto the image sensor. Illuminator light bounces off the rear of the mod into the upper part of the area inside the objective then bounces down to the sensor. But then again I'm just some old Cornish bloke who could be getting it wrong and with no optical experience to rely on. The ideal trial and error then is seemingly to start with a smaller hole in front the scope then make it a lil bigger if you think it needs it. It's best made in a way that it can be removed/flipped up as needed because it sees so well as a quarry profile spotter in good moonlight with that big lens so you can stalk it without any IR giveaway signature at all, then use just enough IR to improve the image of it when ready for the shot. Edited November 25, 2013 by Dave-G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mick miller Posted November 25, 2013 Report Share Posted November 25, 2013 (edited) Or just shoot off a set of sticks. I have given up on the bipod and laying prone in a wet, bogging field yonks ago. Forty quid anda trip to b&q will see you right with a set of flexible quad sticks. No more glow from misty damp grass and no more laying down only to find that there is a slight mound between you and your target. Edited November 25, 2013 by mick miller Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drongo Posted December 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2013 So... After not getting along with this scope very well I requested from the seller for a return & refund which they agreed to, after inspection of the scope. I sent it back to them, complete with full packing in as new condition, which they could have resold at full retail price over a week ago... They replied today, offering me £200....!!! Which I've obviously declined...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
activeviii Posted December 9, 2013 Report Share Posted December 9, 2013 Or just shoot off a set of sticks. I have given up on the bipod and laying prone in a wet, bogging field yonks ago. Forty quid anda trip to b&q will see you right with a set of flexible quad sticks. No more glow from misty damp grass and no more laying down only to find that there is a slight mound between you and your target. And dont forget the funny smell when you stand up, only to find you have been laid in fox #### or dog ####. Shoot sticks all the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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