Rochester and Strood by election

[grrclark]

Meant to add to my last post, there is some suggestion that many kippers are now pursuing a different approach to what they did previously, i.e. Nigel and his comments around an NHS with services charged at point of use.

 

Of course he has maybe just evolved his opinion and that is entirely reasonable, of course he could be now saying what people want to hear, which is also an entirely reasonable way to look at it.

 

It is natural I think that the new kids on the block are likely to be subject to closer inspection, after all the over whelming message from the kippers and their supporters is that the political elite in this country is poisoned and corrupt.

 

Given that some of those 'poisoned elite' are hopping onto the kipper bandwagon does raise a legitimate question around their integrity, maybe it is not fair, but given our scepticism towards politicians and their behaviour it is reasonable.

 

If chaps such as Carswell and Reckless are completely noble in their intention then I am sure they will welcome the additional scrutiny as an opportunity to differentiate themselves from the pack and establish new found credibility as a result.

 

Likewise will Nigel and the other kippers when questioned around past statements.

 

Honest people need not fear difficult questions.

[Gordon R]

Perhaps the MPs, who criticised these two, should resign and stand again in a by-election, just to demonstrate that they still had the support of those who elected them. I won't hold my breath. Principles - most MPs couldn't spell it.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Gordon R

[grrclark]

Perhaps the MPs, who criticised these two, should resign and stand again in a by-election, just to demonstrate that they still had the support of those who elected them. I won't hold my breath. Principles - most MPs couldn't spell it.

 

A fair shout, would love to see it too.

[poontang]

This made me laugh...

 

Yep, hilarious.

 

Maybe you could enlighten us as to how well your home country is doing under this European experiment you're so keen on?

 

Last I heard the child poverty rate was 40%, unemployment was 27% with youth unemployment at 50%, neo nazism, racism and violence on the rise, massive debt of 175% of GDP...I could go on, but you get the picture I'm sure?

 

So, how is Greece doing under the rule of Brussels?

[grrclark]

 

Yep, hilarious.

 

Maybe you could enlighten us as to how well your home country is doing under this European experiment you're so keen on?

 

Last I heard the child poverty rate was 40%, unemployment was 27% with youth unemployment at 50%, neo nazism, racism and violence on the rise, massive debt of 175% of GDP...I could go on, but you get the picture I'm sure?

 

So, how is Greece doing under the rule of Brussels?

 

For heavens sake man, please do elucidate on that and state how those figures/statements would be resolved if we were out the EU.

 

Please make an effort to give a joined up answer and don't just post aspirational statements, actually give some reasoning to your answer.

Edited November 24, 2014 by grrclark

[timmytree]

Maybe the 2 MPs defected because they felt the Conservatives were out of touch with the electorate? Disagreed with the policies? Both seem to have been well regarded by their constituents and that has helped their re election under the UKIP banner.

I like to think they both acted under honourable intentions, they may lose their seats at the GE so they weren't taking a certain job as some think.

More importantly, this is just 2 seats, any more defections will be welcome but I think all of us will be more sceptical of the next ones. Having said that, how many can honestly say they can remember more than a few MPs? I can't think of more than a few of the really well known old timers, the newer ones are just bland nonentities, obscure and unseen, certainly not the characters that have stood out in the past for right or wrong reasons!

Most of us are under no illusions about the future, UKIP will gain seats and there will be a dirty tricks campaign by other parties to try and discredit UKIP MPS either personally or as a party. Hopefully Mr Farage has enough clout and control to weed out the undesirables in UKIP before the General Election.

What UKIP has achieved in a short time is remarkable, they look like replacing the LIB DEMS as a 3rd party and taking votes from the Cons and Labour at the same time. A good situation to be in if the electorate have enough guts and integrity to follow through what they've started. Unfortunately I think we'll see the same old problem at the next election, the sheep will revert to type and vote for the party they've always voted for because they feel safer doing that.

My vote won't change!

[poontang]

 

For heavens sake man, please do elucidate on that and state how those figures/statements would be resolved if we were out the EU.

 

Please make an effort to give a joined up answer and don't just post aspirational statements, actually give some reasoning to your answer.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't realise my post was aimed at you?

 

It's not for me to come up with the solution to the problems facing Greece at the moment, I'm simply stating the facts as they stand.

 

I was asking a Greek national, who seems to see no wrong with the EU, how he feels about the decline of his country. A fairly straightforward question I think you'll agree?

[keg]

 

I'm sorry, I didn't realise my post was aimed at you?

 

It's not for me to come up with the solution to the problems facing Greece at the moment, I'm simply stating the facts as they stand.

 

I was asking a Greek national, who seems to see no wrong with the EU, how he feels about the decline of his country. A fairly straightforward question I think you'll agree?

Bloated public sector, no work ethic in the public sector, early retirement on full pay, Tourism is the only money earner... If you look at history, a bit like Ireland, the public sector spending shot up after joining the EU. The rest is history.

[grrclark]

 

I'm sorry, I didn't realise my post was aimed at you?

 

It's not for me to come up with the solution to the problems facing Greece at the moment, I'm simply stating the facts as they stand.

 

I was asking a Greek national, who seems to see no wrong with the EU, how he feels about the decline of his country. A fairly straightforward question I think you'll agree?

 

Your post was not aimed at me directly fair enough, but it is an open topic and all are free to comment are they not?

 

The clear inference from your post was that the statistics you put forward are completely due to membership of the EU, as someone who is vehemently anti EU and clearly attribute the current situation in Greece as a direct failure of the EU I was interested in how you see that being different if there were no EU involvement.

 

You are an active campaigner for the UK withdrawal from the EU, you are using statistics around Greece to support your argument of the failings of that organisation with respect to the UK's membership.

 

As you are an active anti EU campaigner I am interested to hear the counter argument of how you think any such failing could be resolved through national governance alone. If you use Greece as a stick to beat the EU in support of your argument re the UK, then it is perfectly reasonable to be challenged around that argument is it not?

 

Of course if you don't have an answer and are simply a naysayer of the EU that's fine, it just lacks credibility in my view.

[Psyxologos]

Bloated public sector, no work ethic in the public sector, early retirement on full pay, Tourism is the only money earner... If you look at history, a bit like Ireland, the public sector spending shot up after joining the EU. The rest is history.

 

Pretty much sums it up. Now back to the central point of this discussion. How does accepting anyone who is about to be struck off from a political party to your 'party' constitute change of the political elite?

[Scully]

 

agreed, but my problem is that this revelation seems to be happening just before they get kicked out, or am I wrong ?.....

You may well be right. When all's said and done they ARE politicians after all.

[Penelope]

In a YouGov poll quoted on Radio 4 this morning, 29% of white working class believed that UKIP represented their views as opposed to 26% for Labour.

 

Just watched sky news and an article about the present voting make up of stockton on tees (watch benefits Britain next week if you dont know Stockton) and its seems judging from what the workers in a machine shop were saying , that the trust in all the established parties has gone,and to them UKIP offers change, and it seems that the traditional Labour supporter rather than conservative supporter is the one changing over to UKIP, happy days

 

 

KW