Rabbits on city allotment

[Evilv]

Hi.

 

I'm secretary of an allotment society in a large northern city. Our allotments are situated far away from houses and surrounded by a public park in a valley and skirted by a small river. The area around is well wooded. We have a rabbit problem developing down there with about eight young rabbits roaming about and destroying our crops. As a firearms certificate holder and regular shooter on farmland with .2 rimfire and standard .22 air rifle, I have the ability to deal with these rabbits, but I am MOST reluctant to take an airgun down to the site and do the job that way. I'd love too, and could sort them out in one evening or early morning foray, but I'd hate to have some passerby get wind of what I'm up to and call in a swat team and police helicopter. There are solid six and a half foot high fences, but I might be seen from higher up the valley sides.

 

As secretary I could claim rightly to be the representative of the occupiers of the land (the allotment committee), and as such, we ought to be in exactly the same position as the tennant farmers who authorise me to destroy their pests on farmland, but I would not like to have to argue the toss on this with the local plod. The whole allotment committee are on at me to get the ******* shot, but I'm unclear on the legal aspect.

 

Does anyone here shoot on an allotment site?

 

What to others think of this position?

 

These rabbits are going to wipe out our crops for sure unless they are destroyed. We've been baiting humane traps for weeks and only caught three.

[naddan28]

Simple really:

 

If they are that much of a problem, pass a motion at your next meeting to get offical approval, shouldn't be a problem. Then use whatever is safe and legal (i.e. .22rf cleared for land?)

 

Dan

[friednewt]

why don't you contact you're local plod?

 

They will be able to advise you.

 

This is a great forum, but i would take any legal advise with a pinch of salt.

 

no offence Pigeon Watch

[naddan28]

why don't you contact you're local plod?

 

They will be able to advise you.

 

This is a great forum, but i would take any legal advise with a pinch of salt.

 

no offence Pigeon Watch

Oh dear, you wait until mungler reads that!

[pin]

Never mind mungler, what about the other 4000 barrack room lawyers!

[mossy835]

Simple really:

 

If they are that much of a problem, pass a motion at your next meeting to get offical approval, shouldn't be a problem. Then use whatever is safe and legal (i.e. .22rf cleared for land?)

 

Dan

 

if it belongs to the council will they let a .22 rifle there.

[Evilv]

Thanks lads.

 

The committee would pass a motion tomorrow morning if I asked them to. There is unanimity on getting rid of them. We just need to go through the process of voting for a motion. They are sick of having cleared the land, brought on seedlings and having the lot nipped off in a night. I've planted my plot twice already.

 

I would NEVER use a rimmy there - not in a million years. I could never guarantee or even expect that a richocheting shot or a shot through a rabbit would stop at the fence. I wouldn't even use a 12 ft pound rifle. It could go through the fencboards as an outside possibility. These are young naiive rabbits and are easy to get near. I'd stake their burrow out (under an old shed) and pop them from twleve or fifteen yards with a B4 rifle. I have a Webley Axsor pcp and a CZ .22 rimmy, but they are overkill and too powerful for the area. There is a B4 in the cupboard which my sons have shot many a young rabbit with at suitable range.

 

As for the council authorising shooting - never in a million years would they do that. BUT - it is OCCUPIERS of land that have the responsibility to destroy rabbits and the entitlement to do it by shooting. We as an allotment association are in EXACTLY the same position as Farmer Brown the tennant of Lord Poshbastardly-Smythe. You don't get permission from the 'Laird' you get t from the tennant. Police take that view too. Most of my farms are tennants, and their written permissions are from them as the 'occupiers' of land. Plod is happy with that.

 

I will talk to the FLO and see what they think. As it is, the ******* are breeding faster than we can get them in these cage traps. I don't want to try snares in case a cat comes by - it could happen easily that I'd get the wrong species in a snare - also, I don't like inhumane stuff like that. A pill in the head is a different matter though.

[pin]

From what I know of the land, and I do know where it is , I would think well placed air rifle shots would be ideal.

 

If as you say they can be gotten near, a decent pistol inside 10 yds makes a useful tool as long as the skill is there.

 

Failing that, find someone local with ferts

[Evilv]

From what I know of the land, and I do know where it is , I would think well placed air rifle shots would be ideal.

 

If as you say they can be gotten near, a decent pistol inside 10 yds makes a useful tool as long as the skill is there.

 

Failing that, find someone local with ferts

 

Thanks Pin - yes you are right about where it is. My choice would be to go down about 5AM before the dog walkers get out and about (they'd maybe get alarmed at the sound of an airgun and think some knacker was sniping at them) and set up about fifteen yards from the shed and take them out when they come up. The B4 will never penetrate the fence, but has been well used against hordes of young rabbits by my lads when they came with me and the rimmy to the farms. At that range the B4 will do the job and group about an inch or less. Plenty good enough against these varmints and no danger of anything going outside the fence unless a STUPID shot was taken which I would never do.

[magicaxeman]

I woulndt have said the PCP is overkill .. if its sub 12ft/lb then its fine, in fact better than the B4 as it will be much more accurate..

If your worried about over penetration try the RWS super hollow points and head shots only as they have worked well for me with close ( up to 15 yrd) rats without issue.

 

I do think its sensible to talk to your local FAO explaining what your planning and why. also its probably best to phone the station on the day to get an incident number prior to shooting, saves a lot of hassle if someone does call plod as they know, where and why so can then advise the person calling that its all above board.

Dont forget to get a signed permission from the committee though and carry that with you at the time along with some ID/BASC/BASA etc documentation and insurance proof..

[naddan28]

hollowpoint H&N's will just bounce off the fence. As for the B4, my mates B2 was punching holes every once in a while through his fence, before I had words about a "proper" backstop.

[Evilv]

I woulndt have said the PCP is overkill .. if its sub 12ft/lb then its fine, in fact better than the B4 as it will be much more accurate..

If your worried about over penetration try the RWS super hollow points and head shots only as they have worked well for me with close ( up to 15 yrd) rats without issue.

 

I do think its sensible to talk to your local FAO explaining what your planning and why. also its probably best to phone the station on the day to get an incident number prior to shooting, saves a lot of hassle if someone does call plod as they know, where and why so can then advise the person calling that its all above board.

Dont forget to get a signed permission from the committee though and carry that with you at the time along with some ID/BASC/BASA etc documentation and insurance proof..

 

Yes, I'll talk to the FLO on Monday and get the resolution in writing.

 

Cheers. The B4 is well accurate enough at under twenty yards. I shot rabbits myself with that.

 

The B4 is better than a lot of people think, even if it is as crude as hell. These chaps didn't argue - that's for sure....

 

 

[Evilv]

hollowpoint H&N's will just bounce off the fence. As for the B4, my mates B2 was punching holes every once in a while through his fence, before I had words about a "proper" backstop.

 

Yes I agree with you about the holes in the fence thing. That's why I'd only use my least powerful gun. A 12 ft pound rifle will easily shoot through old boards -or even if it only might, I'm no way taking it down there with public land all around the outside of our boundary. I know the b4 is well less than my old TX200 was in power and the PCP is about the same as the TX was. I reckon the B4 might be about 8ftpounds. As you can see in the above photo that will do the job when close enough and in the roght spot.

 

Magicaxeman was also right about letting the cops know on the morning where and when I would be doing the job so it is recorded in case a crack of dawn dog walker hears the Psssshhht and panics about idiot snipers.

 

Thanks for all the guidance chaps - and cheers.

[naddan28]

Just saying, that a B2 will happily punch through fences, using domes and they run between 7-8ftlbs!

[njc110381]

Does the Axsor have a silencer fitted? If so, I'd be using that because you're less likely to be heard shooting than with a springer. Could you not put up some sort of makeshift backstop? A scaffold plank on its side would do for shots taken at small bunnies as long as you take them when their heads are down eating

[lurcherboy]

Cut all the growth down around the warren, leave for 2-3 days, get a serious ferreting team in that have whippets.

 

Repeat as necessary but remember there will be other scuts ready to move in, a bit like ******

 

 

 

 

LB

[magicaxeman]

hollowpoint H&N's will just bounce off the fence. As for the B4, my mates B2 was punching holes every once in a while through his fence, before I had words about a "proper" backstop.

 

What on earth are you on about will just bounce of the fence..the fence isnt an issue its rabbits that want shooting and the H&N's will do the job at the range he is talking about but without going right through the rabbits head (ie over-penetrating)

If your mates B4 was going right through a solid fence then he might want to run it over a chrono for safetys sake..

 

I might be a newb on here but Im not an idiot without experience at shooting with airguns..

[naddan28]

hollowpoint H&N's will just bounce off the fence. As for the B4, my mates B2 was punching holes every once in a while through his fence, before I had words about a "proper" backstop.

 

What on earth are you on about will just bounce of the fence..the fence isnt an issue its rabbits that want shooting and the H&N's will do the job at the range he is talking about but without going right through the rabbits head (ie over-penetrating)

If your mates B4 was going right through a solid fence then he might want to run it over a chrono for safetys sake..

 

I might be a newb on here but Im not an idiot without experience at shooting with airguns..

Well you may have exp with airguns but not reading! Firstly, it was a B2 not a B4 that put the odd pellet through the fence!

 

Also, your right he is on a rabbit hunt, not a 6ft fence post hunt but he obviously doesn't want the pellets leaving the boundaries of the allotment by piercing the fence. The H&N Hollows will fold up and just bounce off the fence (should he miss the rabbit) or stay in the rabbit's skull and therefore, no boundaries are broken are he won't have the police going bonkers!

 

Does the Axsor have a silencer fitted? If so, I'd be using that because you're less likely to be heard shooting than with a springer. Could you not put up some sort of makeshift backstop? A scaffold plank on its side would do for shots taken at small bunnies as long as you take them when their heads are down eating B)

thats a good idea actually, any poss of a makeshift backstop. Also with the PCP, assuming silenced and the rabbits are young, You may be able to take out multiple rabbits before they cotton on and leg it!

[Evilv]

Thanks chaps - certainly food for thought here.

 

Regards

 

Evilv

[Vulcha]

I'd use the pcp myself. Quiet, more accurate, and no worries about the folk hearing you. Or you could just fill in the warren with cement....

[tuck1]

There's always Phostoxin, if it's still allowed and safe to use.

 

No doubt someone will advise.

[SNAKEBITE]

For what it's worth here is my input.

 

Get a motion from the allotment committee to start with. Then notify the council, they might have pest control team willing to it themselves. If not do your homework on backstops and firing angles, make plans if possible and then notify your FLO as to your plans. If you offer to email him the plans (with photos of backstops and firing angles possibly) he might be more appreciative.

This might be over the top or not even needed but if you have it you can show you are responsible and it has been thought out properly. Oh and if you have insurance that will help as well!

For more proffesional advice you could always notify BASC and see what they say.

 

As for the weapon of choice I would use a 12lb PCP with moderator. Make unimportant but definatley moderated.

 

Good luck and keep us informed.