Doing away with S2

[Scully]

5 minutes ago, GingerCat said:

If I have to go s1 then I'm going to get a lot more. The only reason I don't is the trouble of filling out paper work that I can't be bothered with. 

Would star with fac air and maybe a .22 for rabbits on the paddocks I shoot, maybe a 38/357 for gallery that I would very soon take up and who knows what else I can find good reason for. A farm I shoot has deer so thats a .243 and probably fox so something else. I won't be alone  

Yep. I’ll be doing similar.  That’s the way to do it. As long as you have ‘good reason’ then S1 could turn into licensing a worst nightmare. 
Just overburden an already overburdened system; perhaps then something may be done about a system and a licensing authority not fit for purpose. 

[JohnfromUK]

Just now, Scully said:

Yep. I’ll be doing similar.  That’s the way to do it. As long as you have ‘good reason’ then S1 could turn into licensing a worst nightmare. 
Just overburden an already overburdened system; perhaps then something may be done about a system and a licensing authority not fit for purpose. 

You say you have 'good reason' - the FEO says he can't see a good reason.  He turns you down for that item.

You have a right to appeal, but I believe appeals are very slow and very expensive.  Maybe you might even lose and have plod's costs ordered against you?

It suits Chief Constables political game playing to be deliberately 'overburdened' because it is a good excuse for shortcomings and a good gambit for manoeuvring politically for yet more resources.  Senior police these days are not experienced 'risen through the ranks' policemen - but fast track graduate level 'businessmen/civil servants' who are adept and playing the Whitehall games to get greater funding for more staff and less 'work'.

[Rewulf]

29 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

You say you have 'good reason' - the FEO says he can't see a good reason.

I can see clay clubs , with a minimum attendance clause , becoming a 'thing'
No more casual Sec 2 ownership , no more 72 hr rule, cart sales logged, and no more swapping and changing  without variation.
Maybe more restrictions, but I reckon these are definite.

[Scully]

36 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said:

You say you have 'good reason' - the FEO says he can't see a good reason.  He turns you down for that item.

You have a right to appeal, but I believe appeals are very slow and very expensive.  Maybe you might even lose and have plod's costs ordered against you?

It suits Chief Constables political game playing to be deliberately 'overburdened' because it is a good excuse for shortcomings and a good gambit for manoeuvring politically for yet more resources.  Senior police these days are not experienced 'risen through the ranks' policemen - but fast track graduate level 'businessmen/civil servants' who are adept and playing the Whitehall games to get greater funding for more staff and less 'work'.

It’s not up to the FEO. For shotguns and firearms both ‘sporting use’ and ‘pest control’ are ‘good reason’. 
The entire system is a mess and illogical ( just one example is no need to show your ticket, quantify or store pellets for a S1 air rifle ) and the more we can do to make an already seemingly impossible task for some licensing authorities, even more so, the better. 

[GingerCat]

The system is a mess. I can't see it changing soon, they can't handle the uptake on traffic and have no money to train, retain and equip staff. Should it change however I'd have to go the whole hog, something I've put off, not for lack of good reason but because I can make do (mosrly) as I am. However they work within legislation which, to be fair is written down for you, so its a relatively simple process of ensuring you get what you need. Legislation would have to change, given the upcoming election I can't see the im the next 3 years or so, recent events will give a flavour of what they are going to use.

[HantsRob]

21 hours ago, Scully said:

‘Doing away’ means as I explained; making all what are currently S2 firearms, subject to everything that applies to S1 firearms currently. 

Is there anything more than what's in the video you referenced?

I am not trying to challenge you, I just spent some time trying to find any proposals or information and have struggled to.

[Scully]

1 hour ago, HantsRob said:

Is there anything more than what's in the video you referenced?

I am not trying to challenge you, I just spent some time trying to find any proposals or information and have struggled to.

Not as far as I know. Until the minutes or recommendations of any consultation is made public, it’s all just guesswork I suppose. 🤷‍♂️ 
I’m just basing my presumptions on everything that currently applies to S1 firearms. 

[HantsRob]

1 hour ago, Scully said:

Not as far as I know. Until the minutes or recommendations of any consultation is made public, it’s all just guesswork I suppose. 🤷‍♂️ 
I’m just basing my presumptions on everything that currently applies to S1 firearms. 

Sometimes better the devil you know for sure.....

[Rewulf]

3 hours ago, HantsRob said:

I am not trying to challenge you, I just spent some time trying to find any proposals or information and have struggled to.

I can only speak for my dealings with Notts Firearms, but 2 recent applications for SGC have entailed applicants being asked to provide evidence they attended clay grounds, and Sec 1 clubs.
Although none of this is mentioned in the HO guidelines, as we know, licencing does what it wants more or less.
This is the shape of things to come.

[JohnfromUK]

1 minute ago, Rewulf said:

Although none of this is mentioned in the HO guidelines, as we know, licensing does what it wants more or less.

Which is in itself a worry.

My concern is that many of us, myself included have perhaps a couple of shotguns justified in terms of 'good reason' as (say for example) a sporting clays gun and a game gun - to which you might add a skeet gun, a trap gun, maybe a wildfowling gun .......

But again many of us, again myself included have old 'collectable' guns - such as hammer guns, muzzle loaders, black powder guns, English game guns. 

Who makes the judgement on 'good reason' for these?  In the limit, it might be decided (by 'someone in licensing') that one modern steel proofed 12 bore with changeable chokes can cover all eventualities 'adequately' such that there is no 'good reason' for anything else.  I accept that is a rather extreme view, but they could also argue that having say 5+ identical gauge guns is an unnecessarily large number.

[Rewulf]

Just now, JohnfromUK said:

Who makes the judgement on 'good reason' for these?  In the limit, it might be decided (by 'someone in licensing') that one modern steel proofed 12 bore with changeable chokes can cover all eventualities 'adequately' such that there is no 'good reason' for anything else.  I accept that is a rather extreme view, but they could also argue that having say 5+ identical gauge guns is an unnecessarily large number.

Exactly.
If the police can demonstrate that they have removed these guns from the legally held pool of firearms , they will endear themselves massively to the general populace.