working seems to

[vole]

The thing is Chard a man like you who has grafted and paid his due will probably find getting his rightly deserved help like pulling teeth.The ones who never wanted to work and sat back saying "Gimme " have it all fall in their lap and laugh over their lunchtime pint at the likes of us.

The thing is the scroungers have kids by the dozen so there is a disproportionately high number of kids with useless feckless role models so on it goes.

[Chard]

The thing is Chard a man like you who has grafted and paid his due will probably find getting his rightly deserved help like pulling teeth.The ones who never wanted to work and sat back saying "Gimme " have it all fall in their lap and laugh over their lunchtime pint at the likes of us.

The thing is the scroungers have kids by the dozen so there is a disproportionately high number of kids with useless feckless role models so on it goes.

 

I've got a funny idea you might be right there. mate. But we're already claiming Working Tax Credit whatever it's called, because we've slashed our salaries from the company so much that we actually qualify

 

First benefit I've ever claimed apart from Child Allowance

[malkiserow]

The thing is Chard a man like you who has grafted and paid his due will probably find getting his rightly deserved help like pulling teeth.The ones who never wanted to work and sat back saying "Gimme " have it all fall in their lap and laugh over their lunchtime pint at the likes of us.

The thing is the scroungers have kids by the dozen so there is a disproportionately high number of kids with useless feckless role models so on it goes.

 

I've got a funny idea you might be right there. mate. But we're already claiming Working Tax Credit whatever it's called, because we've slashed our salaries from the company so much that we actually qualify

 

First benefit I've ever claimed apart from Child Allowance

 

Maybe this is where it all starts to go wrong.... even as children we can claim allowance.... I never did!!!

Edited July 15, 2008 by malkiserow

[malkiserow]

from another thread..........

Britain has a mandate to build 250,000 new houses

 

Local authorities are out there now sorting out the planning permission on green belt land as I write this.... who will buy them? the Polish and other East Europeans?

 

Myself and Mrs MS just got back from a long weekend away in Brighton. Everywhere, hotels, shops, security on the pier, security in the bars, waiters, waitresses - East Europeans. They are all busy working their butts off to make a living, then I walk out of the hotel...... and English voice from the pavement says "give us some change mate for a cup of tea" Then Chink - the Chink is the sound of the can of lager as he puts it down on the pavement. Now, are the East Europeans buying property here or sending money back home? Many are living in cramped conditions to save as much money as possible. I know they pay taxes etc but I also know the beggars who may get the social security handouts, are young and fit don't pay taxes.

 

Is this contributing?

[vole]

I have signed on for shortish spells in the 80,s but looking really hard for any work at all which was scarce.Even did the old "Job Creation" bit as a labourer for the Council.Have paid it back and then some.Remember getting £19 p/w age 18yrs. Grim.

[Fleabag]

Whilst on a recruitment period last month the local job centre sent me four chaps in a week. none of them wanted to work but i had to sign a form to say i had interviewed them, that way they keep there unemployment benefit. One person who had recently left work and was signing on worked out his salary £432 gross and said no thanks, time you add up my rent paid for my band d rates paid for and my family credit I will be worse of working.

[bob300w]

Whilst on a recruitment period last month the local job centre sent me four chaps in a week. none of them wanted to work but i had to sign a form to say i had interviewed them, that way they keep there unemployment benefit. One person who had recently left work and was signing on worked out his salary £432 gross and said no thanks, time you add up my rent paid for my band d rates paid for and my family credit I will be worse of working.

Rent paid, what's that worth £600? plus rates paid, £130? Yep, you are better off not working, finacially. Your lack of self respect, you have to live with.

[starlight32]

Quite frankly the pleasure of working in the UK has lost its allure to me and has for a long time.......

 

Sit down and take your income and less subtract everything we have to pay for and see whats left-Naff all at the end of the day.

 

In reality 'disposable income' as it is known for the average UK citizen is probably less than that of a third world country.....

 

We may to a certain degree enjoy higher wages but it is all relative at the end of the day. My brother lives in Italy, and his entire bills for the upkeep of his home is less than I pay in council tax for the year.

 

Would'nt class Italy third world though would we?

 

I know what I'm doing....... sell my house, gonna buy 10 acres of land in the middle of nowhere.... Then put a static caravan on it. Put in a Biodigester for the waste, Wind turbine for power and a bore hole hole for water.

 

Change out of 25 grand.... No council tax,water, sewage and live the ***** dream.

 

Before you ask the question that this is not possible, my uncle has performed the whole operation from start to finish and is relishing every minute of it.

[Biffo1262]

Let's clear this up once and for all. This thread or any of it's posts do not offend me and I'm sorry if my reply gave out that tone. I do though have two sets of neighbours who seem to begrudge the fact that I cannot work and expect me to sit on my backside all day. However they are NOT my consultants nor are they members of the medical appraisal panel and as such are not qualified to venture an opinion. Therefore I quite happily say to them that they too can have my benefits, provided they qualify. To qualify just to get the benefits would be a little extreme. In my case it meant losing my chosen career at the age of 46 whilst still climbing the promotion ladder, something I miss greatly as I always wanted to serve in the job with my yougenst son. Sadly, though he is now serving, it wasn't to be. I had one child still left at school and the future appeared quite promising. All that can change within the blink of an eye. Admittedly having served 25 years and having a 'qualifying' injury for an enhanced pension made my circumstances better than some but suddenly all your commitments are still there but half of your pay has gone! The un/fortunate thing is that my condition also became degenerative and after a spell employed at The Benefits Agency, the District Manager took me to one side and told me that she did not consider I was fit to work in my condition. I wasn't in a position to improve my pension from such a short spell of service with them but they showed me my options. I hadn't claimed Industrial Injury Benefit as I wasn't aware that my injury was so severe at the time it occured plus I thought I had left it too late. Subsequently they granted me the claim AND backdated it to the time of the injury as a lump sum. Having also worked after retirement from the Fire Service I was eligible for SSP though anyone with an Occupational Pension now is not likely to qualify even though you have paid into the system all your working life. Therefore you are being penalised for paying into a pension scheme to secure yor own future. You might as well go out and p!ss it all against the wall than pay into a pension scheme as this is how they treat you. My disability is now so severe I qualify for upper level DLA, something I wouldn't wish my worst enemy on as it means your lifestyle is very severely restricted and you have depend on a carer to help with some of the private functions of life. Of course my lovely neighbours don't see the pain I'm in; they aren't doing the job of my carer. All they see is me pottering about in the garden on a good day (they forget the times they don't see me for days on end as I can hardly move. They probably assume I'm away on holiday spending my ill acquired money). I have managed to shoot three times over the Winter, all indoors and as yet, haven't been to the outdoor range at all since the start of last Winter. There are two things I can do. One is to sit at home and mope about, bemoaning my lot or, two, I can get out as best I can with assistance of good friends and relatives and try to enjoy the mobility I have left. Alright, due to some very effective painkillers there are times when you get tempted to do things you shouldn't like some small amount of garden maintenance. I suffer for it afterwards mind you. BUT when you go into the garden and the next thing you see is a neighbours arm coming out of his window holding a camera and photographing me on private property I see red. Needless to say this has gone on for some time and it's not got them anywhere nor will it, as the BA have already told me that they consider the people involved as biased and malicious though they won't tell me who they actually are. Let's take a wild guess eh! I reached the point where I got the Police involved and these people are now upset as both sets of neighbours are now on final notice under the Harassment Act. One more incident and they are subject to arrest and prosecution.

 

I've served my dues, paid my contributions and have the injuries and major opoerations to show for it all. My income, I have say, is now more than capable of maintaining a reasonable lifestyle - trouble is I don't have the physical wherewithall to enjoy it plus this or any future government can move the goalposts and take it all away at a whim. So as you can see, ANYONE in my position or similar is not making idle comments when they say they would gladly swap it all for full health and fitness and the ability to make their own living, even though they may well be financially worse off. In my experience those that brag about how much they can save on benefits are either lying or defrauding the system in the way I described in my previous post. Believe me benefits are not that generous but they do help those of us who were un/fortunate enough to qualify under previous conditions and for that I am very grateful, though as I have said, the position is tenuous and can be altered as they see fit at any time. The government can have my benefits back at any time they want. All they have to do is give me a half decent working spine. See; it's that easy!

Edited July 16, 2008 by Biffo1262

[bignoel]

this post was not about genuine people with sickness problems.i myself suffer from ciatica and was pronounced unfit for work by medical board and placed on disability but couldnt rest so with help from doc and very strong painkillers have returned to work for how long i dont know ,this post was about those that are schemeing and robbing the benifit 's at our exspence and enjoy boasting of how much they can save amonth for there holidays and never held down a job not intended to offend anyone who is genuine .

[roadkill]

Lets be honest how many of these siickness problems are real and not being faked so many people off with bad backs , stress , depression and now the new one exhaustion England is full of drop outs and lazy bast**rds We need a real shake up in this broken place where people would need to work to stay afloat

[bignoel]

i agree the young people today get it so easy handouts that is . the certain people i started this section on have never had or held down a job in there life's and seem to be doing realy well kiddy number 5 on way have all mod con's exspensive. 4 bedroom council house people carrier car holidays rent paid council tax paid water rates paid . the boyfriend when not in jail is in pub nearly everyday ? what the **** are we doing busting our b------ks working for everyday so we can enjoy our law abideing sport which they hit us on price's riseing .maybe the dole will fund us with ammo if we all sign on. just letting of a bit of steam

[Biffo1262]

Lets be honest how many of these siickness problems are real and not being faked so many people off with bad backs , stress , depression and now the new one exhaustion England is full of drop outs and lazy bast**rds We need a real shake up in this broken place where people would need to work to stay afloat

 

You're not related to my neighbours are you as now I do find this post extremely offensive.

 

For one thing MRI scans are of such a resolution now that it IS impossible to fake a back injury. The recent stories about a guy caught refereeing a football match whilst on DLA don't show the whole story. This guy did have an injury for which he qualified for benefits. Now with some injuries they can be more or less cleared up with surgery but when the condition is degenerative the situation can only deteriorate. Where this guy broke the law was in not informing the BA that his condition had been rectified or improved. When you are granted DLA you are legally bound to declare any change in your condition. It is highly unlikely that anyone will get DLA under the current strict vetting for that benefit. If you are NOT under a Consultant and a full medical history isn't available - forget it. Even with them the appraisal is pretty strict. I'm not talking SSP here I'm talking about Disability Living Allowance. Those that think they can falsely get DLA and then live a trouble free life without any worries about money or getting caught are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. For one thing it is normally granted for a provisional period of three years except in cases of more serious disability when there is no hope whatsoever of improvement, surgical or otherwise as in my case. Then DLA is open ended. What is unfair is that my wife used to receive a weekly allowance as my carer but as soon as she reached retirement age and got her pension as is her legal right they took away the allowance and told her her pension was all she was getting. That was hers by right anyway the cheeky ****. Strangely enough if I ask someone else to be my carer they will pay them that allowance. It's legalised fraud by the government and there are numerous claims going into the European Courts to get that ridiculous state of affairs rectified.

 

Remember this, just because the person you see getting out of a new car parked in a disabled parking space doesn't LOOK disabled enough to YOU that doesn't mean they don't suffer agonies or are able to fulfill all their personal functions without help. Plus their medical records will have been scrutinised and assessed by people far more qualified than yourselves to make that decision about benefits.

Edited July 17, 2008 by Biffo1262

[dazza]

I worked in DLA for three years. The claim form is scrutinized by people like myself with no medical experience. You get points for what you write, how far you can walk etc. The points are added up and depending how many you get your in (most people know what to write anyway). I could have counted the number of people turned down in the years I was there on one hand. Those that where turned down always won on appeal. As for the strict vetting procedure, I've worked for the SSA for the last ten years in various benefit branches and I've yet to see one for any benefit. If anybody thinks that DLA is administered efficiently then call in to your local DLA branch and ask the ones that work there. It's a joke and a disgrace.

 

A report went round my office a few months ago regarding DLA. It was reckoned that nearly 70% of those on it weren't entitled to it!

 

How did people survive years ago when there was none of all this? My grandfather used to say he couldn't afford to be sick. It'll soon be you can't afford not to be sick!

[Maiden22]

.

Edited March 9, 2009 by Maiden22

[reedbradshaw]

ahhhh, royal britaina

[76Lincoln]

This topic is very close to my own heart, several years ago my mother who had worked as a stitcher from the age of 16, paid her stamp and taxes was unable to work due to poor health. The invalidilty allowance she was granted was 1 of the lowest payments received. Then a letter arrived one morning stating that a home assement was to be carried out to see how ill she was and what level of benefit she should receive, after doing the assement her benefits were stopped and only her state pension was then due, 3 weeks later she died of a massive heart attack aged 61. So when i see the wasters running about in free cars, free rent,free everything, and standing in the boozer or bookies it really does get me upset. I actually grassed a neighbour up 2 years ago for benefit fraud ( he was driving taxi's while on the DLA) it went against my grain to do so but he was rubbing everyone's nose in it and boasting about what he was making cash in hand. And you know what, it was a waste of time he's now also gardening 3 days a week and still claiming benefits and has just bought himself a new Honda Fireblade, just another example of "Crooked Britain" i suppose !!

[Biffo1262]

I worked in DLA for three years. The claim form is scrutinized by people like myself with no medical experience. You get points for what you write, how far you can walk etc. The points are added up and depending how many you get your in (most people know what to write anyway). I could have counted the number of people turned down in the years I was there on one hand.

 

Dazza

 

That is utter hogwash, sorry I meant to say ******* and you know it or maybe you don't. From what you've written I suspect you have never worked for the DLA or not in any relevant capacity. Everybody I know on DLA was given a medical appraisal by qualified doctors (twice in my case), you make absolutely no mention of that. Points are used for SSP pay and are filled in at a medical by the DOCTOR certainly not BA or DLA staff who only tot them up. Slightly different from what you infer this is a job that does not require medical qualifications, just simple maths. I personally don't know of anyone who was granted DLA on initial application. Our adjudication officer used to keep a running score and quite frankly his figures bear absolutely no resemblance to yours. His are 4 to 1 against on appeal, which doesn't quite gel with your 'experience'. You are aware 'maybe' that appeal is a heck of a sight harder than initial application in that instead of a 'panel' doctor you and your medical records are assessed by, in my case, two consultant Neuro Surgeons and an assessment board. Anyone care to call them incompetent?

 

This whole thread has been filled with inuendos, untruths and misleading tales and I am at a loss to undertsand why unless for some rididculous reason jealousy is involved. I just hope some of those sarcastic posters on here don't find themselves in a situation similar to mine for as I have said, repeatedly, you can have the benefits back, just make me well again and fit enough for some form of work.

 

Now I going to asks the mods to lock this forum as quite frankly there are too many 'haters' venturing uninformed opinions rather than fact.

Edited July 17, 2008 by Biffo1262

[dazza]

Your taking this personally, has anybody said your not entitled to DLA? Has anybody questioned your right to it? The application form you fill in for DLA, the one that asks how far you can walk etc. where do you think it goes ? To a doctor to make a decision? Do you think it's doctor that decides if you get DLA? A decision maker decides if you get DLA not a doctor. When you apply for DLA you are not automatically sent to stand a board. The decision maker requests one if they need more imformation or suspect bulls**t.

 

From the DLA info pack....

 

Decision-makers may ask for a medical examination if they need more information before they can make a decision, or they're unsure about any details.

 

The decision-maker can approve your claim without a medical examination if they're happy with the information that they have obtained.

 

When you first apply for Disability Living Allowance, you are sent a claim form to complete. Your completed claim form is assessed by the decision-maker, who must decide:

 

* whether to approve your claim

* whether you're entitled to one or both of the benefit's two components (the mobility component and the care component), and

* how much benefit you're entitled to receive

 

Decision-makers may ask for a medical examination if they need more information before they can make a decision, or they're unsure about any details.

 

The decision-maker can approve your claim without a medical examination if they're happy with the information that they have obtained.

 

So who makes the decision? A doctor? Nah, an everyday joe public Civil Servant adding up scores.

[Biffo1262]

A bit of advice for those who would want to inform on those actually defrauding the system. There is a free hotline you can ring so please do so. However bear this fact in mind. DO you KNOW for a fact that they are defrauding the system or do you just resent their position and the fact the you and me, before my injuries have to pay for it. An anonymous complaint without any evidence is given little credence by the BA Fraud Office as they have too many other case that offer more certain results to investigate and petulant or malicious reports just clog up the system. Should you be sure of your fact make the call by all means, offer any evidence you have LEGALLY obtained (you are commiting an offence to film or photograph anyone on private property without their permission (Privacy Laws). Anywhere in the public arena is legal. Having done all this the person involved will be investigated at some stage relevent to the severity of the case. TRIAGE. Now lets' assume the case has been investigated and the fraud claim has proved totally unfounded. You do not have the right to be privy to the Fraud Offices ruling and as such if that investigated person has been cleared of any wrong doing you ahve no legal or moral right to hound them. If you do you will be subject to the same situation my lovely neighbours are in - subject to arrest should they put one step out of line in harassing me or my family again. I wouldn't mind but one of them spends more time out of work than in, sells stolen goods, has a single-mum daughter on benefits and 20 year old son who has never work other than few casual day as a an Electrical Contractors labourer for which he got paid cash in hand and never signed off. The other neighbours wife' slipped' at work and 'severely' injured her back. A nurse, she claimed from the Health Authority where she worked. On one day she was so, so ill she and her husband made a rather embarrasing scene at their local GP where my daughter in law worked at the time. It was only the after that I said to my daugher in law 'I thought ***** had a back injury'. She gave a me funny look and said 'why what do you know'. I told her I has seen her line dancing in cowboy boots the nlocal club. She told me in confidence just what had happened but she also told me something else. The Doctor told her to her face that as far as he was concerned her 'condition' had been fully investigated and there was absolutely no sign of injury and swelling on her MRI scans and that he was not prepared to medicate any further. Furthermore if she continued to claim that her injury was physical and serious he would terminate her from his panel and she would have to find a new doctor. If she felt she was being dealt with unfairly she should complain to the Family Practitioners Council but to bear in mind her consultant had told him that she was pursuing a false claim and as such he was discharging her from his care. That was the same night she was line dancing. She was back at work on the following Monday. Miraculous recovery or what? It mkes my blood boil that having lost my career, my security, my health and very nearly my sanity that thieves, yes thieves, like these two would seek to belittle my condition whlist perpetrating fraud themselves. It also makes my blood boil when when people generalise about people claiming benefit, with no real experience or knowledge other than the tittletattle at work or down the pub. I would welcome any informed and genuine comments and also urge you to report those you KNOW are defrauding the system and do so giving your name, details and any evidence you have. Your name will NEVER be divulged.

Edited July 17, 2008 by Biffo1262

[Biffo1262]

Dazza, You also omit to say that when you sign the form you give the authorities access to ALL your medical records. Now everyone I do know who has gone for DLA HAS HAD a medical as it seems par for the course and in my opinion essential to prevent fraud. If your office did neither then who is to blame for the situation? I was also told, after a friend of my mother's was refused, that a an initial refusal was normal procedure but even they had a medical. The same applied to me, when the time came EVEN though the District Manager of that office told me that she didn't think I was fit for work so many months before and kept social events with the staff. The Officer involved told me that it intitially weede out the casual & spurious claims. He then told me to tell my mother's friend to reapply and get the help from a Benefits Advisor when doing so (this is most important as the form is a nonesense to fill out ie Dazza's comment 'if they know what to write'). The questions are so worded - can you put your arms over your head? Instead of how far can you lift yours arms and do you suffer any pain doing so? The correct answer is NO you cannot put your arms over your head because officially, if you suffer any serious pain the answer is No. Any of you who have had to fill these forms out will know the problem. The benefits advisor in both my and my mother's friends case made filling the form in seem as if we were being asked totally different questions. In both our cases the DLA was granted after medical and appeal - open ended. Her's another Dazza might be aware of or not. Any claimant who has been refused and then appeals using a Solicitor WILL almost certainly get the benefit. I leave you to work out why? Dazza might enlighten you but I think it best not to put this on open forum.

[dazza]

I've had my say and that'll do me. Nothing I've said was meant to offend or question your benefit entitlement in any way Biffo

[Biffo1262]

I've had my say and that'll do me. Nothing I've said was meant to offend or question your benefit entitlement in any way Biffo

Fair do's. I wouldn't have expected anything less and I certainly didn't want to give the answer the last question. When this thread first started I thought it might provide a bit of enlightenment on the right and wrong way of doing things and perhaps the consequences of genuinely disabled people being viewed as spongers. I was prepared to argue the case. I once thought a good friend of mine was sponging, not that I did anything about it. He died in his sleep at age 41 leaving two teenage children and a wife. I vowed NEVER again to judge anyone even mentally without the physical proof. It was a sad and bitter experience.

Edited July 17, 2008 by Biffo1262

[roadkill]

Lets be honest how many of these siickness problems are real and not being faked so many people off with bad backs , stress , depression and now the new one exhaustion England is full of drop outs and lazy bast**rds We need a real shake up in this broken place where people would need to work to stay afloat

 

You're not related to my neighbours are you as now I do find this post extremely offensive.

 

For one thing MRI scans are of such a resolution now that it IS impossible to fake a back injury. The recent stories about a guy caught refereeing a football match whilst on DLA don't show the whole story. This guy did have an injury for which he qualified for benefits. Now with some injuries they can be more or less cleared up with surgery but when the condition is degenerative the situation can only deteriorate. Where this guy broke the law was in not informing the BA that his condition had been rectified or improved. When you are granted DLA you are legally bound to declare any change in your condition. It is highly unlikely that anyone will get DLA under the current strict vetting for that benefit. If you are NOT under a Consultant and a full medical history isn't available - forget it. Even with them the appraisal is pretty strict. I'm not talking SSP here I'm talking about Disability Living Allowance. Those that think they can falsely get DLA and then live a trouble free life without any worries about money or getting caught are living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. For one thing it is normally granted for a provisional period of three years except in cases of more serious disability when there is no hope whatsoever of improvement, surgical or otherwise as in my case. Then DLA is open ended. What is unfair is that my wife used to receive a weekly allowance as my carer but as soon as she reached retirement age and got her pension as is her legal right they took away the allowance and told her her pension was all she was getting. That was hers by right anyway the cheeky ****. Strangely enough if I ask someone else to be my carer they will pay them that allowance. It's legalised fraud by the government and there are numerous claims going into the European Courts to get that ridiculous state of affairs rectified.

 

Remember this, just because the person you see getting out of a new car parked in a disabled parking space doesn't LOOK disabled enough to YOU that doesn't mean they don't suffer agonies or are able to fulfill all their personal functions without help. Plus their medical records will have been scrutinised and assessed by people far more qualified than yourselves to make that decision about benefits.

 

im so sorry that you found my post offensive. i was just saying what i see and think , i dont tar every person with the same brush as like you say some are honest and need the benefits , but in my depatment at work we had one chap with a severe bad back that he had to go onto light duties but at weekends would be racing motorcross ( mmm badback my **** )he has since been shown the door And one with bad knees and agina and he has had months and months off work ,he has also been seen out running lol

 

Roll on when conservatives take over and privatise the system then lets see how much money they hand out and for once the workers might be better off

[Maiden22]

.

Edited March 9, 2009 by Maiden22