Paul in North Lincs. Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Vaild point Fm, but surely pre-baiting and 'drawing the pigeons to areas that they wouldn't normally feed' has merrits, insofar as it would alleviate presasure from heavy feeding on vunurable crops? Paul in North Lincs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Personally although I dont agree with Baiting I dont think it would make a significant amount of difference to pigeon numbers shot infact I would say it would be minimal. You would have to prebait a field for several weeks before shooting it to enable the birds to get aclimatised to the feeding area as they would not just pitch in when they see a pile of grain. Who would have time to do that apart from some of the Commercial guides..It takes several days if not weeks for a flock of birds to decide to leave the woods and hit the rape and it is governed by climate change and depletion of foodstuffs rather than an urge to seek out a pile of free offerings. I think you could cover every setaside the length and breadth of the country with an inch of Grain and it wouldnt make a jot of difference to the number of pigeons shot. It might benefit rodents and the next animals up in the food chain and in the long term probably increase Pigeon Numbers. We are going to see a massive increase in the acreage of rape being grown over the next 50 years as Biodeisel will be the fuel of the future. There will be so much about that Pigeon numbers will not rise proportionaly with it and it will become more and more difficult to decoy in large numbers. Thats not to say they wont be there, they will but will probably be more widespread. Personally I shoot pigeons because I enjoy it and because it keeps the farmers happy around the area I live. Also all of the Pigeons I shoot are consumed. If you allowed Prebaiting of fields, only the commercial pigeon guides would benefit and this could have disasterous implications for all of us as this would be seen by " outsiders" as pigeon shooting for financial gain rather than pest control. I would add that I am in no way against organised pigeon shoots by proper guides ( I have used them the past in unfamiliar areas) as long as they play by the rules and operate within the constraints of the general licence, which I am sure they do. FM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 If we accept the basic premise (and we have to) that the wood pigeon is an agricultural pest, then any humane method of its destruction is acceptable within the law. So prebaiting land to artificially attract pigeons has to be acceptable. The fact that as individuals we can't ,or don't want to do it , is a different matter. I'm not sure that we will see an increase in oil seed rape being grown. Most of the Farmers I know, talk about reducing their acreage of the crop, due to falling earnings per acre. Whether this is subsidy , or crop price, reduction, I'm not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old rooster Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 If we accept the basic premise (and we have to) that the wood pigeon is an agricultural pest, then any humane method of its destruction is acceptable within the law. So prebaiting land to artificially attract pigeons has to be acceptable. The fact that as individuals we can't ,or don't want to do it , is a different matter. I'm not sure that we will see an increase in oil seed rape being grown. Most of the Farmers I know, talk about reducing their acreage of the crop, due to falling earnings per acre. Whether this is subsidy , or crop price, reduction, I'm not sure. Interesting point, there does seem to be a mixed attitude to the growing of OSR, one of my farms has a massive barn still full from last season which they can't get rid of at a decent price. Continued farming related subsidies will see continued changes in the look of the countryside. On another note I wonder if it is possible to "rent" a set aside field from a farmer and just bung down a mixture of seed, OSR, Maize, Peas, Beans, Wheat etc to grow a non commercial crop ?. The seed needn't be drilled too well so the advantage of having shooting when its sewn and at different times during germination could be had. The fact that no particular plant would grow densely would make it easier for pigeons to graze. Maybe I'm just barking wouldn't cost much though and could well help to draw the pigeons away from the commercial crops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 I'm not sure that we will see an increase in oil seed rape being grown.Most of the Farmers I know, talk about reducing their acreage of the crop, due to falling earnings per acre. Whether this is subsidy , or crop price, reduction, I'm not sure. I think we may Cranfield as 2 Multi Million pound Biodeisel refineries are already in the throws of the frirst stages of construction in The North East and I know through following the national Construction markets that more are in the pipeline ( excuse the pun). FM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrie0 Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Further clarification for Fm' s point on biodiesel (osr) Taken from farmers weekly 24/2/2005 ELEVEN RENEWABLE energy trade associations have just published a joint plan to lobby government for a rapid expansion in the use of renewable energy in the UK. The eight-point plan aims to provide a quarter of UK energy needs from renewable sources by 2025 and calls for increased use of renewables across all industries. Policy has so far focussed mainly on renewable electricity generation, but bio-energy can play a significant role in reducing carbon emissions, said British Biogen chief executive, Peter Billins. "Renewable transport fuels such as bio-diesel and bio-ethanol are available today and biomass heating is now increasingly seen as a possible alternative at all scales," he said. "The radical approach set out in the manifesto can realise this potential and bring jobs to the countryside and to UK manufacturing." The eight points in the Renewable Energy Industry Action Plan are summarised below: * Creation of a Cabinet level post to deliver the UK's renewable programme * Extend renewable electricity targets so at least 25% of power comes from renewables by 2025 * Promotion of renewable energy in other sectors, so 25% of all energy comes from renewables by 2025 * Additional revenue for renewable power generation technology * Tax breaks to promote investment in renewables - includes calls for a cut in biofuel duty * More support for small-scale projects * Aim to improve planning prospects for renewable development * A plan to accommodate increasing renewable capacity in the existing electricity grid Another qoute - "If the proposed legislation is successful, a requirement of 2% would involve 0.7m tonnes of biodiesel/bioethanol. And that would need up to 400,000ha or nearly 1m acres – an opportunity UK agriculture cannot afford to ignore." Can only mean more shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 There are quite a few restrictions associated with "set a side", I know one Syndicate that was nor permitted to plant a game cover crop, along one edge. Perhaps you are not allowed to shoot over it. I'm sure I read somewhere, that oil seed rape was not the best ingredient for biodiesel. No crops were mentioned in that extract from Farmers Weekly. Just to keep things "On Topic", lots of big rape fields won't help anyone break the pigeon shooting record. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrie0 Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 Osr is the main ingredient for biodiesel and Wheat for bioethanol http://www.greenergy.com/field_to_forecourt/faqs.html#1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted February 25, 2005 Report Share Posted February 25, 2005 barrieO, thanks for that, an interesting read. My Toyota Surf will run on vegetable oil (as well as diesel), with out any conversion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitebridges Posted February 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 Ohi boy, Old Rooster, I thought you had your coat on? Do you boys want to carry on here? I think you should, it's Ok wi' me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teal Posted February 28, 2005 Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 I think this is the company which FM is refering to: http://www.biofuelscorp.com/project.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 My Toyota Surf (diesel) will run on vegetable oil and/or diesel, without any adjustments or alterations. Can the Landrover ? B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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