craftycarper Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Well that didn't go as i planned.........firstly just to get you up to speed, i was refused in 2006 because i could not provide a name of someone who would vouch for my competance in the field but when i got the refusal through it stated health & safety . So 5 yrs down the line my shotgun renewal is coming up and i thought i would stick it in again. This time i have a friend named that i have been out with since late 06 to the present day, no problem i thought...couldn't be more wrong. Anyhow he arrives starts going through the paperwork, lots of boxes to tick etc...then says "i see that you have applied for both rimfire and fac air rifle, explain why you want both" well i give him the reasons both good and precise and if he knew the land he would understand but he says straight away that his sergeant would more than likely refuse the grant of two firearms on my cert, so straight away i am down to the one rifle the rimfire. Then the next issue comes up....how many times i have been out with my friend that i have nominated.....answer regular from 06 to present day...reply... he wants documentation times,dates etc ...bottom line...air rifle removed from application, and a stipulation on my cert for 12-18 months stating that i can only shoot with my nominated mentor...a bit harsh i think...apart from that quite a nice bloke really Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 If you are a member of a shooting organisation get onto them NOW. There is nothing in the firearms act that says you have to show competence to be granted FAC. I know that some constabularies don’t like people having two rifles of the same calibre - daft. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Drop BASC a line (if your a member), Its not unusual for forces around me to ask for a diary of shooting outings (i even heard 1 story where they wanted to know what was shot by who, when, with what) but in reality its not practical. BASC might well have a good working relationship with your force and once they (firearms dept) are asked politely to get a grip they may come back with a more reasonable offer. .22rf and .22 FAC airgun have completely different uses. FAC airgun is much quieter than a rimfire, alot less likely to ricochet, etc.... So your request for both sounds valid to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craftycarper Posted September 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 (edited) tell me about it, i was advised on here before to take it further on my refusal in 06, but the bottom line is it would have been a long and costly exercise. i cant work it out...just wanna easy life and i certainly don't want to rub them up the wrong way and risk a total refusal....but i think its a joke really. Not a member of BASC just the CA but i might enquire about it Edited September 8, 2010 by craftycarper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 your requests arent unreasonable. contact CA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 It shouldnt cost you anything. Its worth a phone call at the very least. Chin up, FEO's can be very odd. I got drawn up for Illegally purchasing and intending to sell a firearm to a non SGC holder all aged 16, the same FEO then gave me an Open ticket and .223 2 weeks later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 I would join BASC and go through it all with them as you need good advice. If you can get to the Midland game fair on 18th or 19th go and see someone on the BASC stand. See Wabbitbosher (BASC recruitment) from here and sign up I found my FAC application questions both tough and fair. Not the "cup of tea and a biscuit" that some have had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craftycarper Posted September 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 will give them a bell later...been a member for years and never had the need to ring them so its long overdue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxon88 Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 That is very strange. Just wondering, has anyone you know in your area had similar problems when applying for firearms? As long as you can justify a need for both you should get them. They cant ask you to be supervised when shooting, thats outrageous. Would definitely seek advice from CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craftycarper Posted September 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 I would join BASC and go through it all with them as you need good advice. If you can get to the Midland game fair on 18th or 19th go and see someone on the BASC stand. See Wabbitbosher (BASC recruitment) from here and sign up I found my FAC application questions both tough and fair. Not the "cup of tea and a biscuit" that some have had. was here for a while, mainly running through his paperwork...only questions were the ones mentioned and safety....backstops etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 if judging by your profile you are 44 they are having a laugh, watch exactly what you say as far as using other peoples firearms if you have an FEO being a ladies front bottom as by the sounds of it they are looking for trouble. In your situation if you have a clean background and just reason there should be no problem, by the looks of it they are going to grant the rimfire so you will get your FAC but the mentor condition is rubish so thats where you need BASC help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blindeye Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 defo contact someone to talk about your problem i would highly reccommend basc and ask to talk to alan booth ( firearms officer) pm me and i will post his no on to you . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harv Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 You certainly don't need to record outings and remember if you do produce a list and on any occasion you are elsewhere (caught on traffic camera for example) you will incriminating yourself! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Your profile states Essex but are you under Essex or Met FET? PS - Join BASC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonesbach Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 when i was first granted my FAC i also had a condition that i had to shoot with a mentor for 6mths! even had to have a letter drawn up to support my application. Didn't contact BASC, just took it as 'the norm' as i had only owned airguns before. Now i am having trouble with my firearms dept checking land for my .223...waited 6weeks already and still nothing! I have an open cert for my rimmy and the hold up on these land permissions is doing my head in...! apparently if i shoot "quite a bit" of ammo then an open can be granted?! surely thats 'buying' an open condition!?!? Anybody think BASC will help with this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 when i was first granted my FAC i also had a condition that i had to shoot with a mentor for 6mths! even had to have a letter drawn up to support my application. Didn't contact BASC, just took it as 'the norm' as i had only owned airguns before. Now i am having trouble with my firearms dept checking land for my .223...waited 6weeks already and still nothing! I have an open cert for my rimmy and the hold up on these land permissions is doing my head in...! apparently if i shoot "quite a bit" of ammo then an open can be granted?! surely thats 'buying' an open condition!?!? Anybody think BASC will help with this? Yes, a rimfire is no more dangerous than a .223. If they deem you able to judge land to shoot a .22lr on then there is no reason that you shouldnt be able to do the same for a round less prone to ricochet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SA Shooter Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Well that didn't go as i planned.........firstly just to get you up to speed, i was refused in 2006 because i could not provide a name of someone who would vouch for my competance in the field but when i got the refusal through it stated health & safety . So 5 yrs down the line my shotgun renewal is coming up and i thought i would stick it in again. This time i have a friend named that i have been out with since late 06 to the present day, no problem i thought...couldn't be more wrong. Anyhow he arrives starts going through the paperwork, lots of boxes to tick etc...then says "i see that you have applied for both rimfire and fac air rifle, explain why you want both" well i give him the reasons both good and precise and if he knew the land he would understand but he says straight away that his sergeant would more than likely refuse the grant of two firearms on my cert, so straight away i am down to the one rifle the rimfire. Then the next issue comes up....how many times i have been out with my friend that i have nominated.....answer regular from 06 to present day...reply... he wants documentation times,dates etc ...bottom line...air rifle removed from application, and a stipulation on my cert for 12-18 months stating that i can only shoot with my nominated mentor...a bit harsh i think...apart from that quite a nice bloke really Good luck mate, keep us posted on the outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulpicide Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Phone the CA if thats who you are member of you will get all the advice you need . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonesbach Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 Yes, a rimfire is no more dangerous than a .223. If they deem you able to judge land to shoot a .22lr on then there is no reason that you shouldnt be able to do the same for a round less prone to ricochet. hmmm...think ill give BASC a bell then..! do you think that they have enough 'pull' with local FEO to push their hand into opening up a condition just through a simple query of a member? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soreshoulder Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 i had trouble with my firearms dept forcing all kinds of regulations on me because of my age, i rang up BASC they said we will ring you back in 20 mins. I got a call 10 mins later saying that the regulations they put om my certificate were ridiculous and got them changed, anymore problems and i should ring them. I was chuffed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted September 8, 2010 Report Share Posted September 8, 2010 I really do feel sorry for you! Nobody should have to put up with that much grief over a basic FAC application! Being refused your FAC last time is silly, but to expect dates of your outings with your mate since then is just madness. Sometimes I curse my FEO but the more I read on here the more I think he's actually a great bloke! Some of the forces are pushing rules well outside of the specs you need to meet to hold a firearm. If I was you I'd throw my toys well and truely out of the pram. Unless there's something you're not telling us there is just no need for the trouble they are giving you. Everyone has to start somewhere and it doesn't sound like you're asking for anything out of the ordinary. A mentor isn't a bad thing, but for 18 months?! They're having a laugh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunganick Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 hmmm...think ill give BASC a bell then..! do you think that they have enough 'pull' with local FEO to push their hand into opening up a condition just through a simple query of a member? They don't have any 'pull'. However i get the impression that sometimes they can remind that particular force where the line is. I recently applied for 223 to have deer added, 6.5 and .308 on my open ticket on Vermin, Fox and Deer. They first said plain no to everything except 1 calibre for target use. They said i would need to sit DSC1 or provide a letter from someone that was willing to 'judge me competent', after which they would give me 1 deer legal round for target and deer only. I dropped BASC a line, they spoke with the Head of Kent Firearms (who they know well), i then got a phonecall from them explaining they would be happy to provide me with what i asked for if i could provide a letter from someone confirming me to have stalked with them. I did this, they then managed to forget to add half of what i was granted to my FAC, so my cert went back once more and came back exactly as i had asked for 6 months previous to all of this starting. BASC defiantly helped, their good working relationship particularly with my local Firearms Dept. meant they were able to quickly address the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 Any update Crafty? David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 It seems there are things we are not being told or you have the daftest FEO going. How the heck does refusing FAC air and granting .22 rf serve the public good? As for the mentor i assume you said something you shouldn't at interview, to support this condition. The ammo useage thing is a total bag of you know what in granting an open i seriously wish they would get to grips with the fact that ammo used in large quantities means range work not field work were the safety issues are more and various Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted September 9, 2010 Report Share Posted September 9, 2010 It seems there are things we are not being told or you have the daftest FEO going. How the heck does refusing FAC air and granting .22 rf serve the public good? As for the mentor i assume you said something you shouldn't at interview, to support this condition. The ammo useage thing is a total bag of you know what in granting an open i seriously wish they would get to grips with the fact that ammo used in large quantities means range work not field work were the safety issues are more and various Why would that be then? It may, but a bit sweeping there Kent, I know several, including myself that use far more of every type of ammo in the field than at the range! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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