.17HMR

[deputy dog]

Hi all.

 

 

I'm sure this as been asked before, so forgive me if i ask it again.

I have a .17HMR as a good many of you have on this forum.

 

My question is to you.

 

Has any one noticed any splits on the necks of their .17hmr ammo. Mostly around the neck area of the shell.

I use Hornady v max blue tips and shot them for over a year now. But it was only in work this afternoon, i was killing time before end of shift, that i picked a few spent cases out my jacket pocket and looked at them. Out of about 50 spent cases i found about 8 all in all with various lengths of splits in the neck area. Some only like scratches and others more noticable about 2 mil long.

 

Should i stop using this amunition because its now dangerous to either the gun, or more important to myself.

Or is this just what happens to hmr ammo in general after its shot.

 

Any info on this matter would be greatfully recieved, as i'm a bit wary of using it till i know its either safe to do so.

Or a no go area and i may have to buy another batch of new ammo.

 

Reguards

 

DD

[barrelsniffer]

Ive never used the blue tip ammo always used remington or hornady vmax red tips and never had any split cases..take them back the shop see if they will change them to a other brand ??

 

Mick

[al4x]

personally I wouldn't worry, it seems some guns don't like some batches of ammo but if they are firing ok and extracting ok just keep on going. It was thought it was something to do with the cases being necked down but really as you don't reload them its of little significance

[Billy.]

This did the rounds about 8 months ago. Someone got really upset and offended when I said there's a chance the breech might be microscopically larger than intended, thus giving the case room to expand and break.

 

Personally I'd not be happy and ask for a new gun. The spent cases can be harder to extract and you don't want that in the middle of the night.

Edited October 12, 2010 by Billy.

[Dekers]

This is a known issue and has been bouncing around for years, have a look round the web an you will find lots about it...this will get you started.....

 

http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/qa/139480/Are_...hells_safe.html

[deputy dog]

This is a known issue and has been bouncing around for years, have a look round the web an you will find lots about it...this will get you started.....

 

http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/qa/139480/Are_...hells_safe.html

 

Thanks Dekers mate.

 

That link was pretty helpfull. It stated that the round is still safe to use if the splits are not major in any way.

And that the pressure is so low that it cant harm the breech or loading area. I'll just keep an eye on the last 100 i got from the batch and

when i use them up, i'll buy a box or 2 of new bullets and watch for cracks on them. But according to that link i just read .17hmr ammo has always had

certain problems with case splits around the neck area. Due to the way their manufactured and the strains on the brass tolerances around the neck areas.

 

But in your honest opinion would you still use them.

[Billy.]

And that the pressure is so low that it cant harm the breech or loading area.

 

So you didn't read the thread the other day when someone's CZ .17HMR blew up?

Edited October 12, 2010 by Billy.

[deputy dog]

So you didn't read the thread the other day when someone's CZ .17HMR blew up?

 

 

What thread and why did it blow up. Sorry i must have missed that one.

Edited October 12, 2010 by deputy dog

[Billy.]

What thread and why did it blow up. Sorry i must have missed that one.

 

I was looking for it, but it's lost in the depths of the forum.

 

From what I recall, pretty bad.

 

Can someone post a link?!

[Billy.]

>Here we are<

[deputy dog]

>Here we are<

 

 

Read that link mate. I think its a little iffy to say the least. I always check the heads of my ammo before i load them.

And i may be no expert but i would imagin that any would feel a bullet head that loose in the neck of the case.

 

Iv read a few other links on the web about this would be problem. And according to nearly all of them.

.17hmr ammo does an will have a slight problem with neck splits. All reckon its down to prodution methods and lack of annealing, i think thats the word.

 

So i'm quiet convinced that i'm still pretty safe to shoot these last 2 boxes off.

As i aint found one link or post saying about a nasty accident from shooting .17hmr which may split.

 

But thanks for the time an effort you took to find the link up. Very greatfull to you

 

ATB

 

DD

Edited October 12, 2010 by deputy dog

[Hornet 6]

Splits in HMR ammo has two causes, old ammo, the brass hardens with age and splits instead of stretching.

And an over size chamber, it does happen, happened with an HM2 I had, never did work out why, the only ammo in the country was at least 5 years old, but my guess was an oversize chamber, dealer refunded.

I use blue tip Hornady, and have used over 8K, no splits at all in my Annie.

Also note that blue tip is not going to be old, it first appeared around april or may last year, and was loaded just for UK sale..

 

Neil.

[marlin vs]

I posted this before.

 

 

Bob Palmer at Hornady, in an e-mailed reply to me:

CCI makes the cases for all the .17 HMR ammo and loads it for the different companies. When they make the cases they draw the case out to a .22mag case that has a straight wall. Then the priming compound is put in the rim of the case. The case is spun to put the primer evenly in the rim.

 

After the priming is complete the case mouth is reduced to the .17 caliber to hold the bullet. The reduction process, however, puts stress on the neck of the case. They obviously cannot anneal the neck of the case to relieve the stress because of the compound in the rim, so from time to time you will get a case that cracks. Some batches may produce more splits than others. The chamber pressure on .17 ammo is so low that it does not hurt the chamber on the rifle.

 

They have tried to anneal the cases more before it's formed to .17, but this did not eliminate the cracks altogether. If the cracks were minor I would continue to use the ammo. The cracks do not affect the accuracy of the round and the brass is not reloadable.

[Billy.]

I posted this before.

 

 

Bob Palmer at Hornady, in an e-mailed reply to me:

CCI makes the cases for all the .17 HMR ammo and loads it for the different companies. When they make the cases they draw the case out to a .22mag case that has a straight wall. Then the priming compound is put in the rim of the case. The case is spun to put the primer evenly in the rim.

 

After the priming is complete the case mouth is reduced to the .17 caliber to hold the bullet. The reduction process, however, puts stress on the neck of the case. They obviously cannot anneal the neck of the case to relieve the stress because of the compound in the rim, so from time to time you will get a case that cracks. Some batches may produce more splits than others. The chamber pressure on .17 ammo is so low that it does not hurt the chamber on the rifle.

 

They have tried to anneal the cases more before it's formed to .17, but this did not eliminate the cracks altogether. If the cracks were minor I would continue to use the ammo. The cracks do not affect the accuracy of the round and the brass is not reloadable.

 

This is the same thing that I upset someone over last time. I said what I am saying below, but they wouldn't listen.

 

Why is it then that this happens in some rifles and not others? I have fired tens of thousands of HMR rounds and never had a cracked case.

 

And why is it that certain people have this issue over and over again, but others don't? It must be a problem with the rifle.

 

Yes, the brass can be brittle, but surely this is repeatable over only a few hundred rounds, as the cases are all almost identical.

[Beardo]

i've had a few but maybe only 1 in 100 or so

[al4x]

This is the same thing that I upset someone over last time. I said what I am saying below, but they wouldn't listen.

 

Why is it then that this happens in some rifles and not others? I have fired tens of thousands of HMR rounds and never had a cracked case.

 

And why is it that certain people have this issue over and over again, but others don't? It must be a problem with the rifle.

 

Yes, the brass can be brittle, but surely this is repeatable over only a few hundred rounds, as the cases are all almost identical.

 

 

there was me thinking you only had a slot for HMR and hadn't filled it :blink: , tens of thousands of rounds is a fair bit however if you don't reload as obviously you don't with HMR who looks closely at all their empties? If they fire ok, and extract ok then you have little reason to look. Ok we can assume some chambers are slightly larger hence they expand the neck more on firing much like fireforming a case with a centrefire but these have far less brass and poorer quality so stretch and some crack. I see the odd one in the back of my truck from time to time but most go over the side and never get looked at. I've had one split down the side that jammed in the chamber that was a nuisance but that is in 5 years use so I can live with that. If it shoots ok and extracts ok I wouldn't be bothered in the slightest. Its been done to death on a global basis on forums ever since the HMR came out and people have sent rifles back but generally its one of those things. having looked at my CZ closely last night (after trying to drive over it :blink:) I concluded the post on the chamber blowing out was complete BS as it doesn't tally with how the gun is made that it could blow the mag out and the rather thick steel round the chamber.

[Billy.]

there was me thinking you only had a slot for HMR and hadn't filled it :blink: , tens of thousands of rounds is a fair bit however if you don't reload as obviously you don't with HMR who looks closely at all their empties? If they fire ok, and extract ok then you have little reason to look. Ok we can assume some chambers are slightly larger hence they expand the neck more on firing much like fireforming a case with a centrefire but these have far less brass and poorer quality so stretch and some crack. I see the odd one in the back of my truck from time to time but most go over the side and never get looked at. I've had one split down the side that jammed in the chamber that was a nuisance but that is in 5 years use so I can live with that. If it shoots ok and extracts ok I wouldn't be bothered in the slightest. Its been done to death on a global basis on forums ever since the HMR came out and people have sent rifles back but generally its one of those things. having looked at my CZ closely last night (after trying to drive over it :blink:) I concluded the post on the chamber blowing out was complete BS as it doesn't tally with how the gun is made that it could blow the mag out and the rather thick steel round the chamber.

 

Ok, 'several thousand' would be a bit closer.

 

I had two slots for HMRs and I never filled the second slot.

 

I've shot it in enough places where I've had to clear up the empties and you do sit there looking at them in an amazed way at how such a small round can have an almighty punch...! I'd have easily spotted a crack

 

Here's the thread from a while back and a post which interested me (Marlin, I hope you don't mind me digging this up)

 

I get them regularly I only use Hornady, it's only a nuisance when an empty case gets stuck, otherwise i'm not bothered. I emailed C.C.I. with pictures and they assured me there was nothing to worry about.

 

 

 

The cracks are very consistent, which doesn't exactly say much for random brittleness. It clearly looks like there's room for expansion in the chamber and if you just imagine what a tiny bit of room and tens of thousands of PSI can do to a thin piece of brass, it paints a clear picture.

 

>>HERE'S THE ORIGINAL THREAD<<

Edited October 13, 2010 by Billy.

[Beardo]

you're barking up the wrong tree Billy - yeah they're consistent - but consistent with thin brittle brass being resized

[al4x]

they do look severe but the OP had 8 out of 50 so not something that would indicate an oversized chamber as that should affect most rounds. In that case it looks like a problem which also causes extraction issues so something is amiss

[Billy.]

According to a site, Remington recalled the .17 HMR Model 597 due to splitting cases :blink:

[Hornet 6]

The cracks let pressure escape so will affect accuracy, by how much is another matter.

For all those who have had this problem, take a chamber cast and measure it, may be in speck but will be top end.

 

Neil.

[garyb]

All the HMR's i've shot have split cases on extraction.

 

Not every round, but a high number of them have.

[Billy.]

All the HMR's i've shot have split cases on extraction.

 

Not every round, but a high number of them have.

 

Not mine :blink:

[garyb]

I can't remember seeing as you sold it 6 months ago..

 

But all the other Cz's I've used - I have seen this problem.

[MC]

My cases out of my CZ never even look that dirty, let alone split. All you ever see on mine is a little soot around the neck. However I don't check every case as I am not that sad or bothered.

 

As long as the rabbit is dead I really couldn't care about the case.