40gn ballistic tips in .223 Rem

[sixhills 69]

Hi I Have spoken to my local gun shop and asked what type of ammo is being used for foxing he told me their is a 40gn ballistic tip for the .223 Has any one used these and are they any good he states they give a flater trejectory due to the higher speed is this correct

 

Thanks

[Kes]

Hi Six - I use 40 grain hornady V-Max over 26.0 grains of N-133.

Given a 100 yd zero, its up 1 min of angle (4 clicks) at 200 yds, a 2" rise to hold zero - and 2 mins of angle (8 clicks) at 300 yds or 9" at the target.

Gives 3,600 ft per sec.

It is amazingly effective.

I have recntly shot 2, called to about 130 yds where there has been no exit wounds from a face on chest shot. In both cases the fox just dropped and didnt move again. A very satisfying outcome.

Good luck

Kes

[wymberley]

Hi,

I dropped down from 55gr to 40 because for the ranges that I shoot at I was wasting energy, ergo money. With the 40 exiting at 3500, I have noticed no difference other than to my wallet and am now looking to further reduce that velocity. However, please note that my range rarely, if ever, exceeds a few yards past the 200 mark.

Cheers

[al4x]

buy 20 and try them on paper, mine didn't used to like them with a 1:9 twist but shot 55's spot on. If they shoot fine then try some

[casts_by_fly]

That's what my 223 shoots. For anything under 300 yards you're in good shape.

 

Thanks,

Rick

[tick]

Hi S/H.

I also use 40gr V-Max out of my Rem .223-1/12 twist.

I load 26.5 of VithV N133 comes out @ 3795fps and spot on for Charlie.

Brass "Lapua" & CCI Primer's.

 

This load is at the top end so start "lower" and work up, very accurate.

 

ATB

Wullie.

[Ackley]

Hi,

I dropped down from 55gr to 40 because for the ranges that I shoot at I was wasting energy, ergo money. With the 40 exiting at 3500, I have noticed no difference other than to my wallet and am now looking to further reduce that velocity. However, please note that my range rarely, if ever, exceeds a few yards past the 200 mark.

Cheers

 

I dont quite understand your logic mate,you say you want to reduce your velocity by uisng a 40gr bullet ??

using a light bullets means using more powder in turn will mean more velocity,if you want to save on powder (god knows why as it will equate to pennies) using a heavy bullets which will use less powder which will have less velocity

[wymberley]

I dont quite understand your logic mate,you say you want to reduce your velocity by uisng a 40gr bullet ??

using a light bullets means using more powder in turn will mean more velocity,if you want to save on powder (god knows why as it will equate to pennies) using a heavy bullets which will use less powder which will have less velocity

OK, that's not what I said. I said I came down to 40 to reduce what is in effect wasted energy and save a few pence. I now realise that that new energy fgure is still excessive so am going to reduce it further by reducing the velocity even more. Got the 223 because I downsized from 243 when the estate took the deer "in house". If you're married you'll understand the logic in using this to swap a poor 243 for a good 223! Stuffing 27grains behind 55 for c3350 is more expensive than 22.1 behind 40 for 3500. However, cost is not the critical factor, what is, for me anyway, is tossing that energy around in the dark when it simple isn't necessary. Now, having played with my shooting oppo's rifle and come to the conclusion that I'm still in an overkill situation, I'm now going to reduce that velocity even further but still maintain sufficient energy to do the job effectively at the range appropriate to me. 13+ behind 40 (with a good BC) for 3000 is good and saves a few more pennies.

Your name gives a clue in as much as it could be but it isn't.

[Ackley]

OK, that's not what I said. I said I came down to 40 to reduce what is in effect wasted energy and save a few pence. I now realise that that new energy fgure is still excessive so am going to reduce it further by reducing the velocity even more. Got the 223 because I downsized from 243 when the estate took the deer "in house". If you're married you'll understand the logic in using this to swap a poor 243 for a good 223! Stuffing 27grains behind 55 for c3350 is more expensive than 22.1 behind 40 for 3500. However, cost is not the critical factor, what is, for me anyway, is tossing that energy around in the dark when it simple isn't necessary. Now, having played with my shooting oppo's rifle and come to the conclusion that I'm still in an overkill situation, I'm now going to reduce that velocity even further but still maintain sufficient energy to do the job effectively at the range appropriate to me. 13+ behind 40 (with a good BC) for 3000 is good and saves a few more pennies.

Your name gives a clue in as much as it could be but it isn't.

mate your missing the concept here,if you want to slow the velocity down you need to use a heavier bullet,if you insist on using a 40gr bullet with a reduced powder charge you wont get the case to form correctly on your chamber walls which will mean powder burning down the sides of your case,which will waste energy.

Iam the total opposite of your theroy,you cant have enough power and enough velocity and theres no such thing as overkill

i dont undrstand your comment regarding my name

[wymberley]

mate your missing the concept here,if you want to slow the velocity down you need to use a heavier bullet,if you insist on using a 40gr bullet with a reduced powder charge you wont get the case to form correctly on your chamber walls which will mean powder burning down the sides of your case,which will waste energy.

Iam the total opposite of your theroy,you cant have enough power and enough velocity and theres no such thing as overkill

i dont undrstand your comment regarding my name

In my original post, I was simply answering the OP's question and to emphasise that the 40 would be fine, added that they would still be fine if you reduced the velocity more than the norm although there could be range limitations if you went too far.

Naturally, what you say about reduced charges is perfectly correct, but the concept revolves around "playing with my shooting oppo's rifle" - calibre unspecified - 13+ grains and Ackley. Mistakenly obviously, I thought Hornet may have rung a bell with you.

Could I just add that we do agree to differ: In this crowded Isle you can have too much power and energy and there is such a thing as overkill - the logical extension of your point of view would be using 11/2oz of No3 for pigeon!

[njc110381]

I think what wymberley is getting at is that 40gr bullets are slightly cheaper than heavier ones and that loading less powder is also cheaper. There's not much in it but that's what reloading is for - doing things how you prefer them.

 

Just be careful not to go too low on the powder. Lightly charged cases can be dangerous due to detonation so if you do go really low, select the correct powder for the job.

[al4x]

I don't get your logic anywhere wymberley, to start with swapping rifles tends to be more pricey than just staying as you are without buying new kit.

 

Secondly I'm far happier with a faster round and throwing that about in the dark, faster equates to less chance of going anywhere rather than slower. My .243 throws 55 grain vmax's at a speed I'm as happy using anywhere as my .223

if the area is iffy I wouldn't take the shot with either if I was unhappy. Worrying about the cost of a few grains of powder is neither here nor there in a general foxing application.

[Salop Matt]

So what is the cost of a .223 40GRN BT round reloaded ? Am watching this thread trying to compare it cost wise to the hornet !

 

[al4x]

why bother reloading it, if you are on a budget just run it on PPU ammo at 50p a pop save the brass and at some point in the future reload but you would be doing it for accuracy rather than saving much money.

[Salop Matt]

Its the desire to "Fiddle" that the reloading stisfies aswell and the PPU, what GRN is that ? Way more than the 40GRN BT that I am thinking of for head shooting bunnys aswell as charlie !

 

[Dekers]

As intimated you need to make sure your barrel/twist gets on with 40g.

 

My T3 Lite Stainless is 1-8, and does get on well with everything from 40-75g in .223, I have no idea why, nevertheless the vast majority of what I use is 55g SP.

[sixhills 69]

I have a CZ 527 in 223 before i purchased it i googled the spec and im sure i read they are a 1 in 9 twist off the shelf but the man i bought it from said it was a 1 in 12 and he had never heard of a 1 in 9 twist.

Thanks for the feed back and will be trying them and if i can get simlar results i will be more that happy if anyone has any further info on the twist of my rifle i would be very greatful.

 

Thanks Sixhills69

[sixhills 69]

I have a CZ 527 in 223 before i purchased it i googled the spec and im sure i read they are a 1 in 9 twist off the shelf but the man i bought it from said it was a 1 in 12 and he had never heard of a 1 in 9 twist.

Thanks for the feed back and will be trying them and if i can get simlar results i will be more that happy if anyone has any further info on the twist of my rifle i would be very greatful.

 

Thanks Sixhills69

[Kes]

Six - hi again my remmy, like the one above is 1 in 12 and this seems to suit the 40 grain combination with n133.

Take close note of the advice by the poster who uses 26.5 grains of Vit N 133- its very close to the 'never exceed' load of 26.8.

As Alix says though this combination suits a lot of .223's and the Vit N 133 was apparently developed as a .223 powder. If you want to to use 50 grain V-max, I'd recommend using Vit N 130 powder - it seems to perform as well in my rifle. Let us hear how you get on.

Cheers

Kes

[Redgum]

surely going down to a lighter bullet AND decreasing the velocity in the name of saving the odd penny is a little crazy. I don't have a 223 but you want that 40grain bullet to shoot flat and fragment in the prey expelling most of the energy in the carcass.Slowing down a light bullet will give a less flat trajectory and make it more likely to pass through the carcass with little damage just maiming the prey.Ever wondered why they don't make a subsonic round for a .17hmr.

[sixhills 69]

I have not thought of loading my own i am only going to use on foxing and the odd long range rabbit i would'nt expect to be going through a lot of rounds a year so would it pay to reload or just buy them in ready made.

[wymberley]

surely going down to a lighter bullet AND decreasing the velocity in the name of saving the odd penny is a little crazy. I don't have a 223 but you want that 40grain bullet to shoot flat and fragment in the prey expelling most of the energy in the carcass.Slowing down a light bullet will give a less flat trajectory and make it more likely to pass through the carcass with little damage just maiming the prey.Ever wondered why they don't make a subsonic round for a .17hmr.

Yep, I did say downsizing saved a few pennies, but also said it was of no consequence but, of course, it is. I'm a working class pensioner looking at the increasing price of diesel to put in the Ranger so yesterday I picked up a little run about to save the costs. Got a cracking little 57 plate MX5 with a very low mileage. Looking forward to nipping up the M5 to collect the barrels off the beautiful little 1934 EJ Churchill which I just got my hands on and which UK Gun Repairs have just re-blued. On the way back, it's in to Exeter to collect the new Weihrauch Hornet just back from having the moderator proofed. Yep, saving the pennies does help and makes it easier to buy the essentials in life! Sod the roof!

You don't have a 223. If it helps, I think I'll be selling mine soon. However, perhaps you could help: As specified I don't shoot much more than 200yds. Would a 40gr Nosler BT which has a BC of .221 and given a MV of 3000ft/sec still have sufficient velocity at that distance to perform as advertised?

Finally and to be honest, no, I've never wondered why they don't make a sub-sonic round for the .17HMR - I've only wondered why they came up with the calibre in the first place.

[al4x]

The HMR was created as a flat shooting rimfire fast enough to use a ballistic tip and put small varmints down very effectively, compared to the .22lr it gives you a lot more flexibility. You've only got to look at its popularity to see how good it is, round here I don't know a keeper who doesn't have one.

As for buying an MX5 don't expect great economy my other halfs one does about 35mpg vs my L200 at 30-32 and yes she can get the dog in it but struggles to get me in as well

 

As for saving pennies worth of powder couldn't you do an hours gardening for someone to pay for the amount you'd save over a year

[wymberley]

The HMR was created as a flat shooting rimfire fast enough to use a ballistic tip and put small varmints down very effectively, compared to the .22lr it gives you a lot more flexibility. You've only got to look at its popularity to see how good it is, round here I don't know a keeper who doesn't have one.

As for buying an MX5 don't expect great economy my other halfs one does about 35mpg vs my L200 at 30-32 and yes she can get the dog in it but struggles to get me in as well

 

As for saving pennies worth of powder couldn't you do an hours gardening for someone to pay for the amount you'd save over a year

Morning, mate,

Can't possibly comment on why your wife would pick a car just big enough for her and the dog!

Thanks for the tip about the gardening: I'll see if the wife's up for it!

Cheers

[nathanhutchison]

I have a CZ 527 in 223 before i purchased it i googled the spec and im sure i read they are a 1 in 9 twist off the shelf but the man i bought it from said it was a 1 in 12 and he had never heard of a 1 in 9 twist.

Thanks for the feed back and will be trying them and if i can get simlar results i will be more that happy if anyone has any further info on the twist of my rifle i would be very greatful.

 

Thanks Sixhills69

i was confused by this too.

its only the varmint kevlar model that has the 1in9 twists all the others have a 1in12