Whitebridges Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 I read John Humphreys article in the ST when he announced his health problem. I had a tear in my eye. He is an incredibly talented writer one of the all time greats. I'm a BASC member and have been for years. Decisions around such questions you raise David BASC should lie entirely with the BASC's management. I appreciate you asking the question but i'm not sure you will get a consensus of opinion. Just buy it. It's a piece of history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanj Posted November 17, 2011 Report Share Posted November 17, 2011 Many of you will know that John Humphreys, who is terminally ill, has announced that he is selling "Roaring Emma", an iconic and historic fowling piece. The price tag is £16,000. There is a strong feeling that BASC should buy Emma and that she should join the other iconic guns at the Mill such as Col Hawker's double punt gun, Irish Tom and the Tolley known as the WAGBI 4 bore which are seen by the many fowlers who visit the Mill. We would preserve her for the fowling community as a whole and we would make arrangements - in accordance with John's wishes - to ensure that fowlers can still use her on the marsh. The view is that we should not use members subs for this purpose but raise the money separately. Given John's failing health he is keen to realise funds for Emma and therefore this appeal is urgent. We started fundraising yesterday and immediately received a private donation from a prominent fowler and a donation from a North West club to kick off the appeal is style. I'm posting here to ensure that as many people as possible in the wildfowling community are aware of this and have the opportunity to support the appeal. There's no obligation on anyone but if you or your club can contribute that would be excellent. BASC staff members will also put their hands in their pockets. All donors will be recognised - and we are currently considering listing them on the plaque where the gun will be displayed. This will also be a way of recognising John's lifetime achievement for shooting. Donations towards the appeal to preserve Emma for the wildfowling community can be made by calling Nick Glazebrook on 01244 573 004 - or emailing him at nick.glazebrook@basc.org.uk . Bill Harriman has penned a few paragraphs on the history of the gun which I've pasted below. The 8 bore shotgun known as “Roaring Emma” was built c.1870 by the celebrated London gunmaker Joseph Lang. He is perhaps best remembered for being one of the pioneers who introduced breech loading shotguns into Britain. He also popularised field trials for gun dogs. Lang was married to James Purdey’s daughter and their son was apprenticed at Purdey’s. When he took over the business from his father he ensured that the high standards to which he had been trained carried on in the firm. Consequently Lang’s guns rank with Purdey’s in both quality and finish. The gun was acquired by the famous wildfowler and author James Wentworth Day who christened her “Roaring Emma” on account of her thunderous discharges. Wentworth Day wrote the Modern Fowler in 1934 and Emma is mentioned in it. “Roaring Emma” is an iconic piece of wildfowling history on a par with the guns of Colonel Peter Hawker, Sir Ralph Payne-Gallwey and Stanley Duncan. She would be a worthy companion for Frank Southgate’s mighty Tolley gun - aka the WAGBI 4 Bore – which is displayed at Marford Mill. David I've always enjoyed Johns articles and consider him a true countryman. Thing is......... these valued artefacts are valued more by the genuine wildfowlers who will actually use them. David, this isnt a pop at BASC (of which I am a member) but I too am intrigued as to who would get to use it. Could any BASC member pop buy and use it for a dayt or 2 I doubt it. IMO John should sell the gun (for it is his to sell) to a fellow (prominent)wildfowler (Jarrett, Knox or whoever) for whatever price he can get. If he sells it to some collector then that would be a shame but would ultimately be decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted November 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 If Pole Star can point me in the direction of the old boy’s network at BASC I would appreciate it as I would love to join. By the sounds of it this group get all sorts of perks… Anyway, all joking apart, I am sure that with our network of 135 or so wildfowling clubs and the BASC wildfowling committee it won’t be difficult to arrange a simple booking out system for the gun for fowlers to use on the marsh. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pole Star Posted November 18, 2011 Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 (edited) If Pole Star can point me in the direction of the old boys network at BASC I would appreciate it as I would love to join. By the sounds of it this group get all sorts of perks… Anyway, all joking apart, I am sure that with our network of 135 or so wildfowling clubs and the BASC wildfowling committee it wont be difficult to arrange a simple booking out system for the gun for fowlers to use on the marsh. David Ha ! ha ! only kidding David ! & a raffle I think would be a fair way , perhaps ? . Good luck Pole Star Edited November 18, 2011 by Pole Star Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted November 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2011 I know you were kidding, just glad we can keep things light hearted! There are many ways in which cash for this can be generated and how the gun will be distributed around. I will let the wildfowlers work this one out! David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magus69 Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 David I'm with dougall 100% on this one as I think it's the best suggestion to date. I love my old fowling guns and use them as much as I can,I would however be looking to give Roaring Emma a try if the gun was made available to rent by interested parties, and believe that there would be many others who would also jump at the chance to shoot such an iconic piece of wildfowling history. Pricewise it may seem very high but the reason I collect such pieces is they aint making any more so the only way the price of classics such as these are going to go is up. I have been offered 11K for my 4 from the states and if I were terminally ill then that's where it would be heading as I would want to leave as much as I possibly could to those I leave behind,so although high I think the price is justifiable for what it is and the conditions under which it has entered the market place. Mike... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted November 19, 2011 Report Share Posted November 19, 2011 Surely it will not be a very simple process to just rent the gun to those who would like a flight with it ,for one where is it to be kept ,if the guns in wales lets say ,how would a fowler that wants to shoot the wash obtain it ? drive to wales and collect or RFD ? or is it just to be used at the local foreshore ? I think as already mentioned it would be better to use it as a prize in your yearly fund raising raffle as a package with a guide and the gun included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichardH Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 (edited) David I actually think its a very nice idea to make it available to your members. Could you not buy it with BASC money then rent it out to members, you'd be in profit after a few years and i for one would love a day out with it. Richard Edited November 21, 2011 by RichardH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucas Posted November 21, 2011 Report Share Posted November 21, 2011 No simple answer to this one. While preserving old tools of the trade is important it is more so to get new people started. It is a lot of money for something which effectivly does the same job at the other end. If it was purchesed by basc and then rented it would eventualy re-coup the losses. Especialy if taken to game fairs etc. I cannot see the logic or renting it out, if it got damaged etc then would this option be viable?. Maybe it would be better for a auction house or similar to buy this as a showpiece rather than a association. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted November 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 We will see how it goes, the Elected Council of BASC do not want to spend central funds on this at the moment hence the fundraising effort. If we can raise the money over the next couple of weeks all wel and good, if not then I believe somone has already offered the asking price. We will see, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 David, BASC as ever are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I can see it now, the news that the "gun sold for full asking to private collector" followed by howls of "BASC should have done more to preserve our shooting heritage"... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucas Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 surely if a private collector had it tho it would be better than it getting destroyed by renting it out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted November 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 Mungler, yep I agree, was it ever thus! David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artschool Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) i am a member of the basc and as such feel that i can voice a view. whilst i can see that preserving heritage is important, this would be much better achieved by philanthropy rather than buying in museum pieces. so if john wants to he should donate the gun to the basc, if he just wants some cash then just sell it on the open market. my honest opinion is that i didnt think my fees would be used in this way. Edited November 22, 2011 by artschool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted November 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 Take your point which is why we dont intend to spend money from membership income on the gun - hence the call for donations to our wildfowling clubs. Thanks for your input. My regards David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayano3 Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 How sad to read about John's illness, my thoughts are for him and his family at this time. If BASC generally feel that this obviously historic Wildfowling gun is of historic value then go ahead and buy it. Do we members (I have been a member for over 30 years)ever question how you spend our subscriptions ?? Do we ever really look into where BASC spend our hard earned money ?? Maybe a £1 a year on our subs could be put to one side for such purchases. That is not just wildfowling history, but all that the people we entrust to represent us in all aspects. Another idea to raise the cash, assuming not everyone wants to donate to the history of our sport, would be to do a 'Gun Stamp' along the same lines as our Wildlife Habitat Fund Duck Stamp as a one off. Just a thought, maybe the subscribers could then get a chance to see this gun once it is in the area, or their local clubs could also do a membership number lottery to get the chance to actually fire it. Just a thought. Remember where Basc started.. The organisation started out as the Wildfowlers' Association of Great Britain and Ireland, (WAGBI) in 1908. It was founded by Stanley Duncan, an engineer from Hull, who was also a highly experienced wildfowler and naturalist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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