Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 (edited) I have a brand new Howa 1500 in .243 with a Nikko Sterling Diamond scope on (Yes I know its not a great scope) that I bought in August. I have only been using it at in indoor range as I have been struggling to get anywhere near decent groups, 2-4 inches with the occasional flyer, I have tried Privi, Gecko, Sako and a few hornaby. I broke the barrel in with the shoot 5 and clean method. At the range on Friday I took 3 shots and got a 2 inch group, let the barrel go cold by leaving for 1/2 hour and the next 3 shots were 4-6 inches lower than the last 3 I'm guessing dodgy scope (bought new with the rifle) but the shop said maybe the scope is mounted wrong ? The scopes not loose in any way so how can it be mounted wrong (I'm a newbie to centre fire so happy to stand corrected if I have done anything wrong) As the shop don';t have anywhere to test fire the rifle it may have to be sent away to the distributor but having spent £50 in range fees plus more on ammo I'm not overly amused if there is a fault Edited September 18, 2012 by Peskyfoxs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 try a different scope and also check the mounts are tight as is the action in the stock. Then check the barrel isn't contacting anywhere, if that fails then send it back but the crucial one to try is a different scope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 only problem is I don't have a 2nd scope suitable for a centrefire, bit oathe to buy one just to try. The barrel is free floating, tried shooting off biod, bags, with bipod, withoput bipod .. with mod /without mod I can't move/rock the scope at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 see if someone local can help or try the scope on a different rifle might be an option otherwise its a send it back but they will really want to know you've tried another scope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry31 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Where abouts are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangon Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 How long is the indoor range Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Range is 103 yds and indoor, based in leeds west yorks. Surely if I buy everything new it shouldn't be up to me to try and get the product working but much prefer to try another scope as this means less down time without the gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jam1e Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Range is 103 yds and indoor, based in leeds west yorks. Surely if I buy everything new it shouldn't be up to me to try and get the product working but much prefer to try another scope as this means less down time without the gun. Are the mounts the double bolt type? If yes and everything is tight, then i would agree with you. It's not your job to "make it work". If the dealer has supplied a complete set-up. As in, gun, mounts and scope, i would say it would be down to them to make sure the scope and mounts are adequote for the rifle they're mounted to. I'd take it back, explain the problem and leave it with them to sort. It's a ball ache to hand back your new "toy" as they say. However, regardless of whether they can test fire or not, it's a case of the goods sold to you must be "fit for purpose" and clearly they are not at this moment in time. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterside Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 This isn't meant in a funny way but how often is your barrel cleaned and with what products? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I have cleaned after each use anything from 10- 20 rounds I have also left it and not cleaned after 26 rounds. I can't remeber the name of the stuff I'm using at the mo, it was reccomended by Henry Kranks gun shop. Adter cleaning I run patches through until, clean. Can cleraning affect the POI 6 inches between groups ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 no it can't not at 100 yards that suggests movement in the scope to me if the bullets used are the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1066 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 What weight of bullet are you trying to shoot in this rifle? If I remember rightly my Howa 1500 .243 had a 1 in 10 barrel and wasn't really happy with anything over about 90gr with 70-85 gr bullets shooting quite well. Trying to shoot the 100gn Privi's you may as well have used a musket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 around 100grn, tried 4 differnt types but would the bullet weight make that much differnce? Maybe not group well but all over the place ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry31 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Been here done this. Right if everything is tight the barrel is free to float then it can only be the scope to make such a range of pattern. Other things can affect grouping but not by as much as you say. If you can get to todmorden I will take you to our range and try to sort it with you pm me if you need help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 the 100 grn may account for bad groups but not bouncing round the paper between groups. Assuming its not a change of make as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 (edited) The 6 inches vertical differnce between the 2 groups were the same make. Been here done this. Right if everything is tight the barrel is free to float then it can only be the scope to make such a range of pattern. Other things can affect grouping but not by as much as you say. If you can get to todmorden I will take you to our range and try to sort it with you pm me if you need help I work in Bury so might well take you up on that, may have sorted a scope to try in the meantime Edited September 18, 2012 by Peskyfoxs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry31 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Just pm me if you need to just out of curiousty which stock do you have on your Howa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peskyfoxs Posted September 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Its the standard hogue synthetic, I managed to get a piece of A4 under the barrel when on the bipod so thinking it wasn't flexing too much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry31 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Can only be scope then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rem223 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I would definitely try and borrow a 'scope first to eliminate that variable, but it may also be worth examining the muzzle in case it has some damage. It doesn't take much to mess up accuracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olliesims Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I had The same with my howa but in .223 after 150 rounds Shoots 3/4 - 1 inch groups now, I only clean mine when it's had about 60-80 rounds in it, i know it's a different calibre but maybe it's just a howa thing? Takes afew to wear barrel in, Check if the scope is being effected by parralax error, try different ammo types Ive stuck with federal, as they shot best, read some of the stuff on here it might I tried it all and did help http://www.ballisticstudies.com/Resources/Articles/The+Dummies+Guide+To+Rifle+Accuracy.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 You know i doubt its the scope but it might be how its set up. its not one that can be answered on the net, someone needs to look at it. If you are at stead hall range there is bound to be someone who knows what they are talking about. 1st thing get them to have a look for the abvious then shoot a group for you with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry31 Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 I've set up or helped to set up 5 howas from 223 to 6.5 Swedish most of them had stock clearance probs however non had crowning or trigger probs and once set up shot very well so if things are as you say then it will be the scope. As for running in the barrel this will only tighten up groupings the gun will group roughly out of the box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Id point my pokey finger at the scope and mounts first especially as its quite easy and quick to check. A six in drop between groups of the same ammo with only 30 min cool down sounds like the scope is faulty provided the mounts are tight and not moving in anyway. Barrel clearance wouldn't do that surley? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeker Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 had a problem recently with my Howa / S&B. Went from happy groups to 3"x 3'. and back. Turned out to be the rail mount, so another possible variable. Be methodical and tight is not to knuckle white, so hopefully you can get acess to a torque wrench too . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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