Advice please - pop-holes and weather

[Kes]

A little advice please.

We have never wing clipped the poults on arrival, just put them in the pen and left them to acclimatise and settle - plenty of food and little disturbance -slow movement around and in the pen - as little as possible in the first 2 weeks and 1 person only, no dogs.

 

I would like to wing clip as a trial, to see if they hold better. Should I block the popholes when they are clipped to keep them safe until they start flying over. Alternatively do I leave them in the pen when unclipped but still with the pop-holes blocked. Practice varies apparently.

 

I would normally clip and block pop-holes until the birds can fly and then open the holes as they are first seen outside the pen. Does anyone block the holes when the poults arrive unclipped to stop them straying or open the holes? Unclipped birds fly out immediately when startled, even at eight/ten weeks and the wisdom I have is, its better to keep the holes open for unclipped birds to allow them to find their way back in and closed for clipped as they are easy prey outside.

 

We also have no water outside the pen and if unclipped birds can't get back through the popholes, I am concerned they will die of thirst. Equally they be much more at risk from predation by ground vermin given they cant keep sustained flight?

Any advice would be appreciated from you practical keepers as the GConservancy seem to suggest; closed for clipped and open for unclipped?

Also does good or bad weather change your approach to clipping / blocking pop-holes ?

 

 

Many thanks.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Kes

[reggiegun]

A little advice please.

We have never wing clipped the poults on arrival, just put them in the pen and left them to acclimatise and settle - plenty of food and little disturbance -slow movement around and in the pen - as little as possible in the first 2 weeks and 1 person only, no dogs.

 

I would like to wing clip as a trial, to see if they hold better. Should I block the popholes when they are clipped to keep them safe until they start flying over. Alternatively do I leave them in the pen when unclipped but still with the pop-holes blocked. Practice varies apparently.

 

I would normally clip and block pop-holes until the birds can fly and then open the holes as they are first seen outside the pen. Does anyone block the holes when the poults arrive unclipped to stop them straying or open the holes? Unclipped birds fly out immediately when startled, even at eight/ten weeks and the wisdom I have is, its better to keep the holes open for unclipped birds to allow them to find their way back in and closed for clipped as they are easy prey outside.

 

We also have no water outside the pen and if unclipped birds can't get back through the popholes, I am concerned they will die of thirst. Equally they be much more at risk from predation by ground vermin given they cant keep sustained flight?

Any advice would be appreciated from you practical keepers as the GConservancy seem to suggest; closed for clipped and open for unclipped?

Also does good or bad weather change your approach to clipping / blocking pop-holes ?

 

 

Many thanks.

We use to clip all our birds, but have stopped clipping now. Its catch 22, if you clip and they do get out, which they always find away, they can't get back in and are easy fox bait. We don't clip now and leave a few pop holes open.

How big is the pen if when the birds are startled they fly out?

[Kes]

We have about 400 in the pen and its the size of a football field - tends to get disturbance - dogs, walkers close etc - last year about 40 flew out when I first went into the pen, despite dressing down and moving v slowly - I dont think they ever came back and - with no water?

Thanks for the help Reggie.

[al4x]

we leave our pop holes open but they are on ramps so the birds can't exit from inside. We also don't clip and certainly last year we had very advanced poults that were over the top within a day or two. Evening walking them in worked and they actually after a week or so we weren't walking many back in, till they were ready to start exiting on a more regular basis. We do have a large pen though and not that many birds down.

[Kes]

we leave our pop holes open but they are on ramps so the birds can't exit from inside. We also don't clip and certainly last year we had very advanced poults that were over the top within a day or two. Evening walking them in worked and they actually after a week or so we weren't walking many back in, till they were ready to start exiting on a more regular basis. We do have a large pen though and not that many birds down.

Thanks al4x our pop-holes are the ground level 't' type so the birds find and use them from either side. Not so easy to walk them back in but will make some 'wings' to make the job earier.

I am leaning towards clipping and blocking pop-holes as the best way to ensure they stay put for the important first two weeks.

Thanks.

[Paul223]

Clipping, my thoughts are if it's going to be dry then clip, if the long range forecast is wet and cold then I don't clip, my thinking is that if the birds are cold and wet and struggle to get up to roost then your more likely to lose more than you gain through controlling wandering.

Pop holes, always open if you have birds walking through them try a different design.

Visiting, for the first couple of days I'm at the pens several times a day, I always carry a bucket and whistle so a not to startle the birds. Then when dogging in no whistling and no bucket, send any of I the birds home.

The birds get used to this routine to the point where with out the bucket the birds run away, and with the bucket they are not bothered, even once the season has started

Edited June 4, 2013 by Paul223

[Keeperchris]

Just a thought, why don't ya just put a funnel on the inside of the pop hole so that the birds can't exit from inside to out. It's wot I have done all my life.

Edited June 4, 2013 by Keeperchris

[Paul223]

Yep funnels, funnels with a blanking screen, or bob wire pop holes if you have the money

[Kes]

Thanks chaps but would you close the pop-holes if they are unclipped ? If they fly over they are lost and with no water ? We have funnels on the inside so its a T shape the leg of the T being the funnel to inside the pen the top of the T then directs the birds at 90 degrees out or the reverse.

Thanks again.

[Keeperchris]

I leave the pop holes open in the areas that the birds are in the early days and gradually open them up as and when they start exploring. I would never have wings clipped. I think they stand more of a chance of getting away from something. Don't forget something could still get into your pen even with all the prevention in the world, u can guarantee a fencer battery will die in the middle of the night and not during the day etc.....

[Ferretboy111]

Er surely it's common practice to have water outside the release pen- they get out whether they are clipped or not so get some drinkers and water outside the pen aswell as in it. They travel further for water than they do food. Admittedly carting water is a chore but it has to be done- Cheers

[scotslad]

Think it's 1 of those questions that almost every keeper will do slightly or totally different.

 

A new keeper started on our neighbouring shoot and he is the first i've ever met that shut's his popholes completely wether birds clipped or not, opens them every morning and closes each nite. Think has cut sheets of ply to suit

 

Every keeper will have there own ideas about clipping, u way find easier to hold them but if ur unlucky enough to get a fox/badger/cat or dog in pen in the first 4/5 nights before there gettin up roosting, it could be a season ender for a small shoot. Unless ur pen is well built or If u have/expect/history off any fox problems i would not be clipping. Depending on ur pen but sometimes extra cover/brash can stop birds flapping over but depends why there going over, off the roost or panicing with disturbance

 

But i'd agree with fenboy wether or not u close/clip i would be putting both feeders and drinkers close to wire to hold any birds that do get out, i find each off my pens the birds have a favourite bit to hang out (usually gets morning sun +bit of cover) and concentrate feeders and popholes there and walk them in from there

I'd also say u should be adjusting ur pophole funnels somehow as the idea is birds can only walk in and not out

[tiny tim]

we put food and water outside the pen ,they are unclipped and jump the pen fairly soon but we walk them back in once a day ....we have wings on the pen so its fairly easy

 

this year we have bob wires on the funnels so they cant get walk out of the pen

[Scully]

We don't clip any of ours and leave all pop-holes open.One or two people walk them back in first and last thing.

[scolopax]

Clipped and pop holes open. Welded anti Fox grid about a third of way down entrance tunnel inside pen. I also have rags soaked in waste oil/ diesel suspended every 20 yards or so around the pen. I do not use an electric fence.

 

Couple of trays of water outside pen with a Manola feeder or two of pellets as well. It is the birds which get out within the first two or three days which just tend to keep going, as they are not 'hefted' to the pen.