ThePestControllers Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Hi Guys not sure if i have asked this before but i am really confused as to what reloading chart to use fro reloading ELEY,HULL CARTRIDGE,GAMEBORE. because all the charts are american and only talk about winchester or federal or fiochi. so can anybody please throw some light on this problem for me. i am wanting to use the cartridges i have shot to save buying any new ones for a while. also does it matter whether they have high brass or not in other words can i load the same 28g load in any of the cartridges regardless of high or low brass. Thank you Daz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 What "charts" are you using exactly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 The brass dont matter. Most cases are a poly tube and base wad. I tend to follow American data for Fiochii cases. Most Winchester cases are compression formed. No base wad. U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePestControllers Posted July 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Morning Lads i am using Hull high pheasant 70mm,clear pigeon 70mm,eley vip game 67mm. underdog will these carts be ok to use fiochii data. what data sheets would you recommend for 28g or 30g loads simlar to clear pigeon would be good as i have found that they work ok. Cheers Daz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Phew. I not that scientific about it mate. My reloads involve cases as yours as in poly tubed. 28-32gloads on Alliant Green Dot around 23grain for a fiber wad and 21grains for plas wads. I stopped doin alot years ago. U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fieldwanderer Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 My load (came from someone on here, sadly I can't remember who) is 20.5grains Vectan AS to 28g shot, plastic wad- it's cheap, doesn't kick much and is incredibly clean. My advice would be to switch to AS or the relevant vectan A? For heavier loads, it's cheaper and you use less per cartridge; happy days. While we're on the subject, I've no idea if you need it or not but the best way I can describe the difference in hulls; if you were to fill an "American" hull with water and freeze it - the ice cube would be bullet shaped. If you did the same with what we call plastic tube cases, it would have a flat end with a chamfer around it - these obviously have more space but, apparently the powder burns differently because of the shape of the charge - so using the same amount of powder but finding a wad that gets everything the right height within the cartridge isn't the right way to go either. Clay and game sell sheets with load data that they email to you, I think I paid a pound for one but it only had a few loads on it that were relavant to what I was looking for - may be worth a look for the sake of a quid though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 The TWO main books are the Lyman 5th Edition Shotshell Handbook & the book on Shotshell Reloading by Rick Sapp...as to other books, I buy ANY & ALL reference books I can find; plus check out the dedicated reloading sections on several shotgunning websites/forums A lot of British shells are the Italian "Cheddite" types...so the data is out there, just not as much of it as you say when looking at the USA books which concentrate on USA brands of hulls/powder/wads/etc. There IS some data on the Vectan website & the GIAP sites, but these then go off on a totally different tangent and rely on less common European components.The USA powder maker sites also have a good set of online data for reference/download My own reloads tend to be on the mild side due to the type of shooting I use them for (20gr of Unique with a WAA12 wad & 525gr sabot slug) as I take part in timed shoots, using a pump; so lower recoil = faster recovery back onto target = hopefully a faster finish time Its good to ask any questions on here as you'll get some good info & advice (as long as you dont mention that shooting is fun or anything ie. "Circuit Judge" posts) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 saddler people are missing you over on the stalking directory! http://www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk/showthread.php/67170-Whats-happend-to-sadler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 the european hulls are cheddite and fiocchi. also look out for federal hulls. they are not too dissimilar to euro hulls. my advice would be to aquire as much data as you can for the powder / shot type and weight, then there should be a correlation to the minimal ammount to use and the maximums. the european hulls have alot of volume, so wads are bigger and powder densitys are lighter. (or our powder is more fluffy) for certain applications its more to do with economy. winchester aa hulls are compression formed and have tapered walls, using dense / heavy fast powder with this makes sense. as use less powder and get same pressures and velocity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharf Rat Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 The Eley will require different componants and theoretically less powder due to the shorter length/smaller volume. If you use Cheddite or Fiocchi primers, they will be too loose a fit, as the Eley primer is a fair bit larger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePestControllers Posted July 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 thank you guys what primers do eley use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 The same as everyone elses primer a standard 209 size. Used cases aint what they use to be and my findings are that next to no used cases today want to hold a fresh primer. You use to be able to get a slightly larger primer. The last ones I got I had a choice of two, I asked if I could measure them and chose the slightly larger diameter one! U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharf Rat Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 (edited) The same as everyone elses primer a standard 209 size. Used cases aint what they use to be and my findings are that next to no used cases today want to hold a fresh primer. You use to be able to get a slightly larger primer. The last ones I got I had a choice of two, I asked if I could measure them and chose the slightly larger diameter one! U. Hull Cartridge still accept Cheddites and Fiocchi OK, as do the Gamebore I have tried. Eley are now owned by Maxam, as are Rio, Caladonian and Saga who all use the oversize primer. Oversize Rio primers are available from Clay and Game. What cases where you trying to use UD? Edited July 11, 2013 by Wharf Rat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgun Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Look at Hodgdon reloading data center or Lyman data. There is not much difference between straight wall hulls. Brass height is not much important in plastic shells but base wad height, base wad shape still important. Stick to given recipes to the utmost. also does it matter whether they have high brass or not in other words can i load the same 28g load in any of the cartridges regardless of high or low brass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 All sorts of cases that I have reloaded leave a bit to be desired imo. I have measured loads of primers and find little to no difference. I think pressure slackens new base wads more than the old ones. It was never an issue 20+years ago! I sometimes use a blob of super glue to secure the primer now. Never use too! U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deershooter Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Any one who has the clay game disc will find a page refering to primer size cheddite CX 2000, CX 1000,CX 50 Are all the same size UEE 684 UEE 615 UEE 686 Are all the same size but are approx 3 tho bigger than the cheddites you need to collect cases fron a premier ground where people buy good quality shells not your local club ground that has a sporting twice a month Deershooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePestControllers Posted July 12, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 i am mainly using hull cartridges so should i use fiochii data i get loads of hull cartridges so i can stick to them and forget about the rest. Cheers Daz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyshireDale. Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 i am mainly using hull cartridges so should i use fiochii data i get loads of hull cartridges so i can stick to them and forget about the rest. Cheers Daz Hi there, if you ring clay and game, they will advise you on what to use, dont just download a recipe sheet....speak with them, the chap who runs it , is very knowledgeable and will advise you safely...its in his interests to inform you, as there may be a possible future order! best wishes...Dale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePestControllers Posted July 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 Hi Dale thats really good advice and so straight forward why didn't i think of it. cheers Daz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankook1 Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 yes call steven at clay&game he will put you right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted December 10, 2016 Report Share Posted December 10, 2016 Plus one for asking advice from C&G. They were very helpful when I started loading 410s. Old fashioned service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Albert Posted December 14, 2016 Report Share Posted December 14, 2016 I use Fiocchi F Blue hulls and Fiocchi 616 primers from John down at Folkestone Engineering. I find the plastic seems a better quality and stands up to reloading better than some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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