phaedra1106 Posted October 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2013 (edited) This has been dragging on for 3 years since his original GPs appalling letter ruined his application. I'm going to ring the FLM Monday morning and ask for a face to face meeting to go over the new report and see what she says. Needless to say if asked for the new medical form it will not be being provided. Edited October 11, 2013 by phaedra1106 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Joe Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 It’s a voluntary scheme, the Chief Constable has said so, maybe this has not filtered down to firearms licencing??? If may member has been asked or de facto forced to pay for a medical check that NOT required under the Act or Guidance please get in touch with you name and membership number and we will take this up with the constabulary. David Thing is that it's not really voluntary for those unlucky enough to not be advised so is it? Why would anyone pay to provide any such information voluntarily unless they are being coerced and bullied to do so by the implied threat of it affecting your application if you don't comply with these demands? David, are BASC advising members in the Durham area not to proceed with this medical form.? The link to BASC's website on this thread falls sort of saying so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 David, are BASC advising members in the Durham area not to proceed with this medical form.? The link to BASC's website on this thread falls sort of saying so. Yes we know that but what about those who aren't lucky enough to be taking advise from BASC? The BASC should be tackling it at its roots so no-one is asked to do this in the first place and so not be put in an awkward position where they are having to defy the firearms department requests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 We are taking this up with the police and as I say if any menber has been asked to fill in the form let me know David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Joe Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 Yes we know that but what about those who aren't lucky enough to be taking advise from BASC? The BASC should be tackling it at its roots so no-one is asked to do this in the first place and so not be put in an awkward position where they are having to defy the firearms department requests. I agree with you.. We are taking this up with the police and as I say if any menber has been asked to fill in the form let me know David So is that a yes or no David.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 It is my understanding that if you refuse to fill in the form your application or renwal will not progress, so no I am not saying don't full the form in I am saying please let me know if you are a basc menber and have had to fill it in David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 This apparent abuse of power is quite breathtaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazooka Joe Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 Thanks David, I'm in the Durham area, my reason for asking.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moorvale55 Posted October 12, 2013 Report Share Posted October 12, 2013 If you have to sign that the Police can contact your GP and release details under the Data Protection Act then surely it is the Police who should do so and if the GP needs payment then the Police should pay. You have already signed to say that the Police can check so why do it twice and pay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 It is my understanding that if you refuse to fill in the form your application or renwal will not progress, so no I am not saying don't full the form in I am saying please let me know if you are a basc menber and have had to fill it in David This statement make me glad I'm not with BASC anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 This statement make me glad I'm not with BASC anymore. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 Why? If it isn't a legal requirement then why are BASC the largest shooting organisation giving out duff information on a public forum. Do you not think they should be doing something pro active and fighting this or just roll over and let the police do what they want to the shooters who dare not question what the police say !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 If it isn't a legal requirement then why are BASC the largest shooting organisation giving out duff information on a public forum. Do you not think they should be doing something pro active and fighting this or just roll over and let the police do what they want to the shooters who dare not question what the police say !!!! It isn't duff information. If the police have said that applications wont go forward without this it would be unwise for BASC to advise members to refuse outright for obvious reasons. It needs challenging and no doubt BASC will but they can only talk to the police and have no power over them if the police refuse to concede. What other organisation is doing anything to challenge this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Mat Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 This statement make me glad I'm not with BASC anymore. If the force will not process applications without it, then why is it BASCs fault? They are not in charge of licencing, they do there best to get rid of these stupid conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 It isn't duff information. If the police have said that applications wont go forward without this it would be unwise for BASC to advise members to refuse outright for obvious reasons. It needs challenging and no doubt BASC will but they can only talk to the police and have no power over them if the police refuse to concede. What other organisation is doing anything to challenge this? I'm a member of SACS and didn't even need to contact them as my doctor refused to fill the form in and MY renewal has gone through no problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 If the force will not process applications without it, then why is it BASCs fault? They are not in charge of licencing, they do there best to get rid of these stupid conditions. Who has had there renewal/grant refused without this form being filled in as I haven't seen any refused yet ! BASC say it is above and beyond what is required so why roll over and let the police do as they like. It is my understanding that if you refuse to fill in the form your application or renwal will not progress, so no I am not saying don't full the form in I am saying please let me know if you are a basc menber and have had to fill it in David Just out of interest David how many members have contacted you who haven't filed this form in and have had there grant/renewal refused ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VicW Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) Another slant on this medical reference business and grants and renewals. My recent renewal included a request by the Firearms Licensing Office direct to my Doctor for a medical reference. In the process of chasing this up with the Licensing Office I confirmed that the police pay for the reference and was told that some Doctors were asking £100 for it and are extremely slow in replying,as mine was. This is clearly not financially viable for the Police forces to cope with and I was told that some consideration is being given to getting the certificate or licence applicant to get and pay for a medical reference as a revised part of the application process. This medical reference requirement seems to be quite widespread across the country so where did the instigation come from? My guess is from the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) perhaps with some input from the Home Office. Vic. Edited October 13, 2013 by VicW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted October 13, 2013 Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 To the best of my knowledge no member has been in touch yet. I woulld welcome any feedback from members about their experience with this constabulary. I can repeat that we have taken this up at the highest level, and will continue to do so until a satisfactory concluding is arrived at. Best wishes David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phaedra1106 Posted October 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) So, just to fully clarify this before talking to the FLM next week. a. It isn't required by the Firearms Act b. It isn't even suggested by the HO guidance c. According to the Chief Constable it's voluntary so (in theory) it should be able to opt out without any consequences to the applicant d. BASC are saying "we're not saying not to fill it in" but are not saying do fill it in or don't fill it in Which in effect leaves the decision up to the individual applicant with no clear guidance or support until after there's a problem It would be nice if any shooting organisation would actually stand up and say very clearly "refuse to fill it in as it's not required by law" Edited October 13, 2013 by phaedra1106 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luckyshot Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 So, just to fully clarify this before talking to the FLM next week. a. It isn't required by the Firearms Act b. It isn't even suggested by the HO guidance c. According to the Chief Constable it's voluntary so (in theory) it should be able to opt out without any consequences to the applicant d. BASC are saying "we're not saying not to fill it in" but are not saying do fill it in or don't fill it in Which in effect leaves the decision up to the individual applicant with no clear guidance or support until after there's a problem It would be nice if any shooting organisation would actually stand up and say very clearly "refuse to fill it in as it's not required by law" You are right it would be nice to get a clear answer, I'm with SACS and haven't had to get them involved with my renewal as my doctor refused to fill the form in, but it would be nice to hear from anyone that has actually had problems with there renewal/grant of there sgc/fac due to not filling in this form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 I'm not with Durham so this is an 'oblique' comment. In Cheshire there is a question on both grant and renewal forms, from memory (not always good), that asks you to confirm your doctors address and your willingness to allow access to your medical records. The impression given is that this info might be part of an assessment if perhaps the FEO has doubts at the interview. I have always agreed and presumed this was a nationwide requirement. Is this what other forces do as I've been in the same county for a lllooooonnng time ? Is it also a legal requirement? One wonders if it may be time to take a stand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 Kes You are quite correct, the application/Renewal Form 101 is a standard national form and as such it's the same one we all must fill in. Completing the medical section is a requirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phaedra1106 Posted October 14, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 The "I hereby give permission for the police to approach my GP to obtain factual details of my medical history." has been a part of the SGC/FAC application for as long as I can remember. The new additional form required by Durham is simply a way of making the applicant pay any fees the GP may charge for providing the information. At present, as it's part of the official application process, if the police require such information they contact the GP and any resulting costs are between the GP and the police. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted October 14, 2013 Report Share Posted October 14, 2013 (edited) This extra letter and process 'required' by Durham is not covered under the Act or the latest HO guidance. It is our understanding that this is a voluntary scheme, but this is blatantly missed off the letter that's being sent out. Its our understanding that the constabulary could delay / resist an application if the form is not filled out , this is obviously wrong if its a voluntary system but as I said, if any member has experienced this problem let us know and we will do all we can to help. Similarly if any member checks with their FEO about filling in the form and is told that by failing to do so will delay or stop their application, again let us know and we will do all we can to help. If any member has filled in the form and thus incurred a cost, let us know. We continue to take this mater up with the constabulary and as soon as we have more news we will, of course, let you know. David Edited October 14, 2013 by David BASC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxus77 Posted May 7, 2014 Report Share Posted May 7, 2014 (edited) Hi David, just watched an article on itv news, will try post video when its online and it mentions that the durham questionnaire is now being rolled out across all forces just wondering what BASC and other peoples thoughts are on this, it feels like we are going to have our rights taken yet again? Durham seem to be pushing any blame away from them imo ! edit heres the link http://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2014-05-07/durham-gun-licence-pilot-goes-national/ Edited May 7, 2014 by maxus77 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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