GP's letter to licensing

[bostonmick]

I have reposted my first post as it says I would be prepared to pay and get a doctors letter if it helped my renew.i would pay a higer price if it helped provide a better/faster service.my choice not law and by doing so it would be of no detriment to those who did not wish to.i see that another post of mine has been quoted on this thread that has absolutely nothing to do with this.there are questions asked on these forums all the time about different guns some a lot more than what I was talking about.no doubt you could explain where I am missing the point again.another opinion I am of is that yes money will help improve services as another post here says who in their right mind is going to want the fao job at minimum wage level with the responsibility it carries you will not get a decent candidate for the job if any at all so that will improve things.i will however apologise for the fact that I can at my time of life afford to pay for a few bits and pieces that some of the younger people cannot doas they like me years ago are working to get there.i put my opinions on here and do not comment or judge any other member by what they can or cannot afford.lincs police are currently looking for someone to do the fao job at a wage not realistic in this day so chances are they will get no applicants whereby the service will suffer even more maybe if we paid a bit more then they could pay a living wage for the job and we would then get a better service.and do not forget the fao job is largely unsocial hours as we do not want them to do their visits where it puts us out of our routine in any way.more resources equals better people doing the job better service level.i will also try to remove my post regarding the sleeper as it obviously offended some. I do not know how to highlight lines in different colours so just boring old black I am afraid.could not delete the post on sleeper so it will have to stay for the time being.

Edited November 26, 2013 by bostonmick

[bostonmick]

+ 1

[bostonmick]

with actions like this to solve the staff shortages in the lincs firearms dept I can be assured of an excellent turnaround when my next renewal is due.i bet they were showered with applicants.who wouldn't for around 7k a year.

Edited November 26, 2013 by bostonmick

[David BASC]

Dear All,

 

If any of you have had a letter asking for a medical report and suggesting that this is required for your application / renewal can you let me know the constabulary concerned and if at all possible could you scan and send me a copy of the letter please to david.ilsley@basc.org.uk.

 

We are still working on Durham, and if we can get copies of letters from other authorities too we can take it up with ACPO and get this sorted!

 

David

[Kes]

Bostonmick,there is an old saying about "holes " and " digging" - you would be well advised to recognise, like myself you got your approach wrong.

Its not terminal.

Regards,

Kes

[bostonmick]

I thought this was done and dusted.but all good fun.

[shaun4860]

Slightly off topic

 

I was in my doctors yesterday having a review of my prescriptions

 

She turned the screen so we could both see it,

 

Top of the screen was a note, something along the lines of "Shotgun/Firearms Application"

 

So its obvious upon renewal last year the police did get in touch with them,

 

But still I have had both of my renewals back within 2 weeks (Northumbria)

 

[HDAV]

Top of the screen was a note, something along the lines of "Shotgun/Firearms Application"

 

So its obvious upon renewal last year the police did get in touch with them,

 

But still I have had both of my renewals back within 2 weeks (Northumbria)

 

I guess part of the issue is the possibility of people falling through the beaurecurcy and bring stick between police wanting a report and GP not willing or bothering to send one at present iirc no reply means the police can proceed with no medical concerns. The requirement for a report/answer is very different to a real concern being raised.

[norfolk dumpling]

I fully support the view that my licence and fee are only there to keep the authorities happy - my neighbours know me, like me and know I shoot but none of them care a toss that I have a licence and this applies to 99% of us so why do we have to go through all of this ******** so that the police can tick a couple of boxes???

[simon1979]

I wouldnt have any issues in getting a doctors latter, but the fee they charge would have to capped, i know my locall practise used to charge around 20.00 to write a letter.

But they last time i asked my local gp to sign my photos he refused as he didnt agree with firearms, so could this happen with the letter to?

and as already said in a earlier post, we tick the box for the police to access our medical records, surly can access the NHS system and our records.

 

I still cant see it speeding up the appliction though

[Luckyshot]

Finally got my renewal through (fac) without a letter from my doctor so if I can do it now hopefully the shooting organistions can get there finger out and do something to help others who are in the same situation.

Edited December 8, 2013 by Luckyshot

[Greenhorn]

This is from the home office guidelines for sgc and fac licsencing and renew

The application forms for firearm certificates require the applicant to give permission for the police to approach the applicant’s General Practitioner (GP), who should be registered in the UK, in order to obtain factual details of the applicant’s medical history so far as it relates to the safe possession of firearms. There are a small number of applicants who are not registered with a GP in the UK. If an applicant does not have a GP in the UK they do not fulfil the criteria to be issued with a firearm certificate as they cannot complete the application form.

10.22 There is no requirement for a GP to monitor or assess a patient who currently holds a firearm certificate, though there is a duty for a doctor to disclose information where they believe the patient may present a risk of death or serious harm to themselves or another.

10.23 GPs should not be asked to give general access to applicants’ medical records or to offer an opinion on any of the medical information given. In particular, GPs should not be asked to either endorse or oppose applications, though it is open to them to do so.

10.24 Chief officers of police may reach their own conclusions as to the significance of the information supplied, based on their own knowledge and experience, but may wish to seek advice from the force medical officer where available in cases where the medical information supplied is difficult to understand, or where its significance in terms of the possession of firearms is unclear. Any final decision as to the applicant’s fitness, whether on medical or other grounds, should be taken by the properly authorised officer in the usual way.

10.25 Once the applicant’s consent is given, it is open to the police to approach the applicant’s GP at any time during the life of the certificate if there are concerns about the applicant’s continued fitness to possess firearms.

[bostonmick]

This is from the home office guidelines for sgc and fac licsencing and renew

The application forms for firearm certificates require the applicant to give permission for the police to approach the applicant’s General Practitioner (GP), who should be registered in the UK, in order to obtain factual details of the applicant’s medical history so far as it relates to the safe possession of firearms. There are a small number of applicants who are not registered with a GP in the UK. If an applicant does not have a GP in the UK they do not fulfil the criteria to be issued with a firearm certificate as they cannot complete the application form.

10.22 There is no requirement for a GP to monitor or assess a patient who currently holds a firearm certificate, though there is a duty for a doctor to disclose information where they believe the patient may present a risk of death or serious harm to themselves or another.

10.23 GPs should not be asked to give general access to applicants’ medical records or to offer an opinion on any of the medical information given. In particular, GPs should not be asked to either endorse or oppose applications, though it is open to them to do so.

10.24 Chief officers of police may reach their own conclusions as to the significance of the information supplied, based on their own knowledge and experience, but may wish to seek advice from the force medical officer where available in cases where the medical information supplied is difficult to understand, or where its significance in terms of the possession of firearms is unclear. Any final decision as to the applicant’s fitness, whether on medical or other grounds, should be taken by the properly authorised officer in the usual way.

10.25 Once the applicant’s consent is given, it is open to the police to approach the applicant’s GP at any time during the life of the certificate if there are concerns about the applicant’s continued fitness to possess firearms.

 

i have replied to this through the message section as i did not realise you had also posted on the general thread.my original comment was based purely on my own experience 5 months to renew and with no information asked for from doctor.i doubt that anyone who had to wait that length of time knowing there was no reason for it would not be anxious. also as i said it was my own opinion that i would pay for this IF it meant a faster service than i received last time.also i believe that if some police forces are doing this on a trial basis then it will be with the full knowledge of the home office and will before to long be part of the normal application/renew process.

[norfolk dumpling]

Why are we accepting this so readily? We are the most law abiding sector of the community - we have to be. The number of incidents where non-shooters are injured are so few as evidenced by a complete lack of press mentions. Motor vehicle drivers kill or injure thousands of motorists, cyclists and pedestrians but only get asked a few questions when they reach 70.

 

No, we must resist this at every stage and with every power that we have. Persecution of a minority group.

[Luckyshot]

Why are we accepting this so readily? We are the most law abiding sector of the community - we have to be. The number of incidents where non-shooters are injured are so few as evidenced by a complete lack of press mentions. Motor vehicle drivers kill or injure thousands of motorists, cyclists and pedestrians but only get asked a few questions when they reach 70.

 

No, we must resist this at every stage and with every power that we have. Persecution of a minority group.

 

You're right, its just a shame certain shooting organisations don't have the same way of thinking.

[David BASC]

I agree, which is precisely why I have been asking if anyone on here (apart for those in Durham, we are well aware and are on the case) have had any issues with their application or renewal on this basis so we can take it up with ACPO

[Luckyshot]

I agree, which is precisely why I have been asking if anyone on here (apart for those in Durham, we are well aware and are on the case) have had any issues with their application or renewal on this basis so we can take it up with ACPO

 

David how about instead of waiting for people to complain about this try knocking it on the head now. It isnt a legal requirement (fact) so being the largest shooting organisation why not just tell everyone not to fill the form in (members of course) and you will use legal force against the police force involved. Make an example of one force and the rest will follow suit. If you heard what my force expected from my doctor you might actualy get off your **** and do something about it as I have.

Edited December 8, 2013 by Luckyshot

[David BASC]

We know its not a legal requirement]

 

We have alredy got off our xxxx as you put it and told peope not to fill in the forms,

 

We have done more than that and taken the mater up with Durham ,things will change.

 

We need to know if other forces are trying it on too (that's why I asked!) so we can take it up with them too.

 

David

[bostonmick]

We know its not a legal requirement]

 

We have alredy got off our xxxx as you put it and told peope not to fill in the forms,

 

We have done more than that and taken the mater up with Durham ,things will change.

 

We need to know if other forces are trying it on too (that's why I asked!) so we can take it up with them too.

 

David

I am not a member of basc I am cpsa due to I shoot on my own land mostly and did cpsa for the fea clay comp's I do I have written to them asking what if anything they are doing with regard to this and have heard nothing yet but I did it I believe in a friendlier manner than some.

[phaedra1106]

We know its not a legal requirement]

 

We have alredy got off our xxxx as you put it and told peope not to fill in the forms,

 

We have done more than that and taken the mater up with Durham ,things will change.

 

We need to know if other forces are trying it on too (that's why I asked!) so we can take it up with them too.

 

David

David, can I ask when and where BASC have definitively said this, the only thing posted on here that I can find has been,

 

Posted by David BASC 12 October 2013 - 07:41 PM

"It is my understanding that if you refuse to fill in the form your application or renwal will not progress, so no I am not saying don't full the form in I am saying please let me know if you are a basc menber and have had to fill it in

David"

 

Which isn't particulary clear (at least not to me) and the posting on BASCs own site here http://basc.org.uk/blog/press-releases/latest-news/basc-opposes-durham-police-demands-for-mandatory-medical-references/ doesn't say it either.

 

At least one other force is trying this on, it was pointed out several weeks ago on the other thread here, http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/265661-new-firearms-licensing-forms-to-be-introduced-in-december-2013/?hl=mercia&do=findComment&comment=2342489

 

Original post by Scully is here, http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/264867-gps-letter-to-licensing/?hl=mercia

Edited December 8, 2013 by phaedra1106

[Luckyshot]

We know its not a legal requirement]

 

We have alredy got off our xxxx as you put it and told peope not to fill in the forms,

 

We have done more than that and taken the mater up with Durham ,things will change.

 

We need to know if other forces are trying it on too (that's why I asked!) so we can take it up with them too.

 

David

 

I dont mean to call you a liar David so could you point me in the direction you have said this. If you have already taken Durham up on this then why are they still asking people for it. I hope BASC does a better job with the other forces insisting on this.

 

 

David, can I ask when and where BASC have definitively said this, the only thing posted on here that I can find has been,

 

Posted by David BASC 12 October 2013 - 07:41 PM

"It is my understanding that if you refuse to fill in the form your application or renwal will not progress, so no I am not saying don't full the form in I am saying please let me know if you are a basc menber and have had to fill it in

David"

 

Which isn't particulary clear (at least not to me) and the posting on BASCs own site here http://basc.org.uk/blog/press-releases/latest-news/basc-opposes-durham-police-demands-for-mandatory-medical-references/ doesn't say it either.

 

At least one other force is trying this on, it was pointed out several weeks ago on the other thread here, http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/265661-new-firearms-licensing-forms-to-be-introduced-in-december-2013/?hl=mercia&do=findComment&comment=2342489

 

Original post by Scully is here, http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/264867-gps-letter-to-licensing/?hl=mercia

 

My thoughts exactly phaedra1106 its hard work when you tell that many lies you always trip yourself up. This may come accross as a BASC bashing thread but its not, its just they are the only ones on here and it would be nice to see them actually doing something for the average shooter that will actually make a difference right here right now.

Edited December 8, 2013 by Luckyshot

[THE MEK]

Durham force,

Started my renewal on 6 September my certs expire tomorrow. Cheque has been cashed,had the home visit still no new certs reason GPs letter not received .They can't handle the previous paperwork never mind starting pilot schemes!!

[bostonmick]

Durham force,

Started my renewal on 6 September my certs expire tomorrow. Cheque has been cashed,had the home visit still no new certs reason GPs letter not received .They can't handle the previous paperwork never mind starting pilot schemes!!

have you asked for a temp cert to cover you

[Luckyshot]

Durham force,

Started my renewal on 6 September my certs expire tomorrow. Cheque has been cashed,had the home visit still no new certs reason GPs letter not received .They can't handle the previous paperwork never mind starting pilot schemes!!

 

Dont worry BASC has it in hand

 

On a more serios note, contact them and tell them you are not taking part in their pilot scheme and require your fac/sgc processing or refused in writing stating the legal requireents you have not met.

[Scully]

Durham force,

Started my renewal on 6 September my certs expire tomorrow. Cheque has been cashed,had the home visit still no new certs reason GPs letter not received .They can't handle the previous paperwork never mind starting pilot schemes!!

Have you complied with the GP's letter requirement or is the delay because you haven't complied? Have you informed BASC of the requirement as they advise or are you not a member?