330yds Target practice

[Dougy]

Just thought i would put this up, will put a vid up later.

Got a bit board so I took my 22.250 out for a play this afternoon, I have the elevation just about right but as the long range experienced shooters on here will know the windage is quite allot more difficult to judge.

Wind was quite variable ranging from 2mph to 4.5mph showing a difference of just over 2inch.

 

The top 2left are from a MIGHTY 30.06 at 295yds a few week's ago next to that top row were sighters . The group measures 1.7in and 10 shots taken including 1 clean miss which I called.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Dougy

[zx10mike]

that's one messy rabbit every time,well shot in wind.can't beat a good bit of plinking practice.

[Mungler]

'Mighty'

[Dougy]

'Mighty'

sorry,,

 

edited to correct description of the MIGHTY 30.06

[kent]

It opens most peoples eyes when they actually do it. I have a little chuckle to myself when people claim to shoot well at such ranges at night lamping when wind is even harder to read. Sub MOA with a sporting rifle at such ranges aint too shabby, 1st ccb sighter shot within 1/2 moa of aim point is so much harder even in those light winds

[la bala]

pucker job.

[Dougy]

It opens most peoples eyes when they actually do it. I have a little chuckle to myself when people claim to shoot well at such ranges at night lamping when wind is even harder to read. Sub MOA with a sporting rifle at such ranges aint too shabby, 1st ccb sighter shot within 1/2 moa of aim point is so much harder even in those light winds

 

Kent thanks for the compliment (i took it as one anyway) they're not too common from your neck of the woods.

 

It would or I should say could have been a better group if I hadn't have been trying to walk my shots to centre . Trying to fine tune a ballistic app at the time, its not far off but getting the wind right was confusing my brain cell.

Edited December 11, 2013 by Dougy

[Grandalf]

Glad to see you were paying attention when we last met at Catton Park Dougy...

 

Seriously good shooting mate.

 

Hope you are keeping well and the compliments of the season to you.

[Dougy]

Glad to see you were paying attention when we last met at Catton Park Dougy...

 

Seriously good shooting mate.

 

Hope you are keeping well and the compliments of the season to you.

One thing I hope I will allways try to do Sir, thats listen to those who are older and mostly wiser than myself, Thanks Alf and wishing you and your family all the best over the festive season. Hope to see you next year, happy shooting.

[kent]

Kent thanks for the compliment (i took it as one anyway) they're not too common from your neck of the woods.

 

It would or I should say could have been a better group if I hadn't have been trying to walk my shots to centre . Trying to fine tune a ballistic app at the time, its not far off but getting the wind right was confusing my brain cell.

 

Just tend to say it as it is- either way round. To ease confusion chuck the app away in you pocket were it belongs and know your 10mph full value windage through your range window and record it on a list often called cheat sheet or dope data.

This way you just think is it less than or more than 10mph? 1/2 it or 1/4 etc it to suit (nobody can read better than that as the wind will run different down range than it is at the shooter position there is no point either) This gives your full value 5mph being half the wind allowance in MOA or inches etc whatever you use 15mph 1 1/2 times etc

Now learn the clock face angle values again by fractioning from 12 o'clock 15 degree across target 1/4 value 30 deg 1/2 value, 45 deg 3/4 value 65 deg 9/10 value

 

To make your S.W.A.G

wind "bout half 10mph" 10mph at range is 4 moa according to you list lets say, so 2 moa correction

wind angle approx 45 deg " bout 3/4" of that full value so now 1 1/2 moa correction

Just dial it in or hold off to 1 1/2 moa

Its fine to have all this computer calcs if you have a spotter at your side calling the dope and its cycles/ changes and also range but with practice you find it quicker and easier to do as above and it certainly teaches instant recognition hence correction through the wave patterns of wind that occur. No use having perfect calcs if conditions change before you take the darn shot, remember with all the gizmos there is still lots of estimates happening along the way

 

The trick is don't over complicate it to such a point that you need a PDA in the first place, a simple list of ranges with one drop value and one full value 10mph windage correction on a card is all the sportsman needs. You don't even need a maths head case in point I am badly numbers dyslexic and cannot keep more than one set of numbers in my head at one time but I can do this, with more familiar rifles without actually looking at the cheat sheet

 

Ok so there is a bit more to look at as regards contours, pressures and the like but that's the long and short of it and will get a hunter out to 3-400 yds with practice

[simon6ppc]

good shooting dougy,me and driller are slightly obsessed at the moment with long range popping,which app are you using,today we had it almost spot on at 480 yard,i was using my 6ppc with 65 grain v.max and doing okish at that range,a wind meter is our next investment,very addictive once you get into it,cheers simon

[Fisheruk]

Good shooting mate. Yep can't wait till the next Catton shoot.

ATB

David

[Dougy]

Kent, I certainly don't disagree with your expert opinion, but must say the phone app has put my just about perect on the centre ( as shown) at not only at 330 yds but also out to 442yds I'll be it just a tad 1.5inch low, not bad for such a small cal and a £3 phone app.

 

S.W.A.G is as it implies is guessing but with some maths added to try and improve the limitations. After the shots, I studied the group hence the calipers compared with the app and fiddled with wind speed and measured and noted the differences. None of which have been too far off, so end of day, I am wiser regards to wind variations not perfect, but a little wiser, without the app I would probably still be there in the field trying to hit the target.

;-)

[kent]

Of course the App should work, it only does similar without you knowing anything of the process that is all. was just suggesting an easy quick way to "learn" ie "understand" what you implied you were struggling with. You know wind work is always about some guesses, if you look at the grass or trees you will see that and it channels and turns with contours, funnels through spaces, wind indicators only read wind were you are not all along the bullet travel (though these are available now think re-mortgage to purchase one). Learning it can and will improve your skills if you then choose to use a PDA at least the understanding is there when the batteries go flat or its leathering it down, coming up with rubbish etc.

Once you get onto punching numbers into a screen the brain can disconnect and understanding is soon lost, this is why my 8yr old is still taught paper based arithmetic is it not

The cost of the device and program or its accuracy are not under question

[simon6ppc]

Ive been rifle shooting for just over 25 years and like every one i have done some top shots and some rubbish ones,but i have got to admit dougy i have just down loaded an app last week and i 95 percent under stand it now,i personally think they are brilliant,once set up right and i have to repeat that set up right you can easily dial in to 300,400 yard and if dialed correctly can hit a match box at that range which i have done before but with more luck than skill if i be honest,fair play kent i agree with what you say but some times you have to move on with modern technology like i did last week as my mate has just got his fire arms 3 week ago and can now hit a coke can at 400 yards,some thing which has took me nearly 25 years of practicing and a lot of money ha ha,cheers simon.....

[kent]

Oh I don't dislike such things, I even own such. But it sure shouldn't take so long to learn the old way, that's actually wrong "the old way" because the Military use the same system world wide to train their guys, when your spotter with all his high tech gear has had to go hands on with his own weapon you don't want to be inputting data, just the same in the field hunting, what is it they say about "stuff" happening.

In training you don't want to be given answers but how to find the answers and understand the calcs

 

Take this example I should never venture out in the dark onto a dangerous saltmarsh without a compass, yet a GPS is easier with waypoints plotted. Reason is Compasses are hard to break and the battery never fails and you can even give them a dunking. Most of the time you can pick a land feature or light and use neither, I hope you get the point

[simon6ppc]

Oh I don't dislike such things, I even own such. But it sure shouldn't take so long to learn the old way, that's actually wrong "the old way" because the Military use the same system world wide to train their guys, when your spotter with all his high tech gear has had to go hands on with his own weapon you don't want to be inputting data, just the same in the field hunting, what is it they say about "stuff" happening.

In training you don't want to be given answers but how to find the answers and understand the calcs

 

Take this example I should never venture out in the dark onto a dangerous saltmarsh without a compass, yet a GPS is easier with waypoints plotted. Reason is Compasses are hard to break and the battery never fails and you can even give them a dunking. Most of the time you can pick a land feature or light and use neither, I hope you get the point

i get your point pal, as i to have learnt to shoot old school as well and it doesn't seem right how you can now down load a silly little app that if done correctly can turn an armature in to almost bob lee swagger,good thing though as its put a few hundred yards on my accuracy if i be honest ,cheers simon...

[Grandalf]

One thing I hope I will allways try to do Sir, thats listen to those who are older and mostly wiser than myself, Thanks Alf and wishing you and your family all the best over the festive season. Hope to see you next year, happy shooting.

I'm certainly much older - not sure about the wiser.

[rapid basher]

What are you guys useing as wind reader ?

I've just down loaded strelok and would like

To now if there is a good wind app reader?

 

Nice groups by the way

[kent]

What are you guys useing as wind reader ?

I've just down loaded strelok and would like

To now if there is a good wind app reader?

 

Nice groups by the way

 

Wind reading itself cannot be done by PDA you need a windmeter (unfortunately that only reads the wind at the place you hold it) or visual through mirage or watching grass twigs, dropping a handful of leaves or a flag and noting its angle. There is one more wind reader that can read wind at multiple points along the bullets path but forget about it - its mega bucks and beyond the shooters budjet

The point I make is no matter how good computers get you still need to spend a lot of time learning all the old stuff

[simon6ppc]

What are you guys useing as wind reader ?

I've just down loaded strelok and would like

To now if there is a good wind app reader?

 

Nice groups by the way

its the strelok ive been using,ime gona get a kestrel wind meter as thats what every one seems to use,i do agree with kent though as experience is always better,but ime giving this silly little app a try at the moment and as yet i am impressed a lot more than i thought.atb simon

[rapid basher]

There must be a simple wind app available

I think in the future it will be a Mandortoty thing

To take along , just like havein a bipod or range finder Beno"s etc

It's blow a gale down here at the minute but I shure

Carnt wait to try it, only thing that's got me a bit worried

Is the click ratio,as I've been looking at that guy on you

YouTube

Do a search on this guys vids very Intresteding.

And my clicks and his is not the same @246

But that might be down to a number of factors temp. Angle.

Scope hight etc,

[kent]

Click ratio? what the heck is that? Listen British forces make snipers compile their own "real world data" you bet they have some fancy kit that outstrips anything in the Civilian market - Why do you think this is, because it works no app unless tagged to a windfinding lazer (yes they detect wind speed at range) will ever be worth jot

Dope should be compiled in set measurement for hold ie feet and inches / meters etc or measurement of angle ie. Minute of angle.

[Dougy]

I use a basic Kestrel. Just reads wind speed , it shows max, average and lowest.

[rapid basher]

I use a basic Kestrel. Just reads wind speed , it shows max, average and lowest.

That was more along the lines of

Of reply I was looking for thanks

No offence kent lol