happypig Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 I've shot a couple of sim days this year. Including the BASC shoot All were in the region of 500 cartridge days! With a little forethought I downsized to 21g cartridges... Soft on the shoulder... This week I shot the Kent police shoot at the west Kent shooting school and used some leftover 21g carts I had a few 28s mixed in and the felt recoil was marked. Not being GD my score was on a par with my usual and I only dropped one on the high tower stand with the screaming midi. No one straighted this stand. It begs the question... Should I bother with the 28's or stick to the 21's Cheaper.... Lighter and they break the clays if you put the lead in the right place... I'm not going to cry if a bird slips through the pattern.... Are we all trying to be macho by shooting the heaviest cart allowed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 No great shakes on easy birds or if the scores don't matter as such but despite everyone accepting that reduced recoil is a good thing, not a single top end shooter will commit to even 24g loads in competition. There are 25% fewer pellets, you do the maths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitebridges Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Some people don't suffer from recoil. Others get badly kicked about. Years ago it was normal to use 32g 7 1/2 Winchester AAA and nobody flinched an inch. If I was using 21g or 24g i'd stick it through a 20 bore. Would it be fair to say the more shot you put in the air the more chance you have? A soft shooting 28g cartridge is a nice option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnytheboy Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 I was the same as you, always used 28g for clays, but cracked clays just fine on a sim day with 21g fibre was cheddites! I have a problem with recoil since dislocating my shoulder, thus I've settled on 24g mirage supertargets.mthey break the clays fine and the recoil is name bother! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 (edited) Are we all trying to be macho by shooting the heaviest cart allowed? This tickled me, as it always does. On the one side, you have one lot of people saying "more pellets / more lead" because 21g isn't enough. Neither is 28g - nor is 32g, or 36g or, or, or.... On the other side you have another lot of people who shout "proper shooters only need a .410 or a 28 gauge to hit all the birds anyone else hits" implying that 14-21g of shot is enough for anything. Then there are a third group of very confused people who think that they should stuff colossal quantities of shot up tubes designed for half the amount they propose, because they want to be seen to be an expert shooting a small gauge gun (but only if they can have their usual 28g of #7½, thank you very much). The simple answer to your question is that most people have no idea what they're trying to be, but some are certainly trying to be macho. The slightly more complicated answer to your question simply asks the question "is there a reason that for at least 100 years, the 'low brass' load for a 12 gauge has been 32g and the 'high brass' load has been 36g?" (It goes on to ask whether our forefathers faffed less with loads and shot more birds because of it...) The actual answer to your question is that we're wasting a lot of time talking about loads, when in fact, the quantity of shot you should be putting out of your (appropriately-sized) tube is inversely proportional to the number of birds you can feel happy about bashing over the head / strangling / otherwise despatching and still maintaining a clear conscience, when your particular shooting skill is incorporated into the equation. Then again, if it's clays, I don't suppose it matters. Edited July 17, 2015 by neutron619 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8 90 Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 not a single top end shooter will commit to even 24g loads in competition. There are 25% fewer pellets, you do the maths. What do they use at all the Olympic disciplines I know quite a few Competition shooters who use 24g all the time Rob Eaton, one of the country's top coaches uses 21g CompX for 99% of his shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Rob Eaton, one of the country's top coaches uses 21g CompX for 99% of his shooting Now there's a man who can shoot - don't know anyone who can shoot better, in fact. Nor do I know anyone else who can take a mediocre shotgunner (i.e. me) and make them feel like Digweed in the space of an afternoon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Continental Shooter Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 in my view, if you shoot for the pleasure of hearing the bang, then you can shoot with whatever you feel like! If you shoot in competitions then I assume you shoot to win or get yourself into a decent position. To do that, the rule of thumb should be: shoot the highest possible weight allowed of the smallest possible pellet's size. Reason being the higher amount of pellets given by both the weigh and size, will give you a better chance or, at least, puts you on a par with most competitors. Yet again, it's your choice!! same as for game or pest shooting: wanna shoot a 32gr through a 20 gauge or a 21gr through a 12gauge? it's your choice and no one should feel the need to criticise your choices! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 (edited) What do they use at all the Olympic disciplines I know quite a few Competition shooters who use 24g all the time Rob Eaton, one of the country's top coaches uses 21g CompX for 99% of his shooting Not what my answer was meant to imply is it ? The OP is not talking about Olympic disciplines, he asked whether 21g loads are as good as 28g loads and they're not. Shot guns are scatter guns so they rely on a dense, wide pattern to hit moving targets and as such (recoil notwithstanding) every single gram which means extra pellets will be better, factually. Name these competition shooters who shoot 24g all the time where 28g is allowed ? Remind me of the titles Rob Eaton has won using 21g loads where the others used 28g ? He uses 21g loads because they're a tad cheaper, give far less recoil and are adequate for his needs. Edited July 17, 2015 by Hamster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milo Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Some people don't suffer from recoil. Others get badly kicked about. Years ago it was normal to use 32g 7 1/2 Winchester AAA and nobody flinched an inch. If I was using 21g or 24g i'd stick it through a 20 bore. Would it be fair to say the more shot you put in the air the more chance you have? A soft shooting 28g cartridge is a nice option. So true. Those double As were real headache material. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun4860 Posted July 21, 2015 Report Share Posted July 21, 2015 Shoot what you feel happy with, 95% of shooters on this forum won't notice the difference in patterns, they will notice the recoil. I shot 21g compX for years due to a shoulder problem, all healed up now so have switched back to a smooth 28g (Gamebore Velocity) I would prefer to shoot a 24g but velocity only come in 28g As I said, shoot what your happy with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisAsh Posted July 26, 2015 Report Share Posted July 26, 2015 (edited) Why would cartridge makers sponsor a shooter using low profit 21 gram when the can use their top end 28gram cartridges to advertise them and make much bigger profits from bigger sales as people copy the top guys and girl shooters Pattern size is the same with 28gram or 21gram its only the density that changes and if you have no major holes in it you have limitedchance for improvement of scores using larger size cartridges Edited July 26, 2015 by ChrisAsh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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