naddan28 Posted April 17, 2007 Report Share Posted April 17, 2007 Firstly, when zeroing your rf's what do you use as a backstop and target holder? Secondly does anyone know the distance required for both .17 HMR and .22lr require in terms of open land to find a suitable backdrop? Thirdly is either of the rf calibres more likely to be granted to a first time shooter than the other? Finally what range is a .17 hmr and .22lr practical over in normal shooting conditions. I know in a perfect world a hmr would be good to 200 but nothing about real world ranges. Thanks Lads, Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taffygun Posted April 17, 2007 Report Share Posted April 17, 2007 Firstly, when zeroing your rf's what do you use as a backstop and target holder? Mother Earth is the best backstop you can have and printed targets stapled to a board. Secondly does anyone know the distance required for both .17 HMR and .22lr require in terms of open land to find a suitable backdrop? The label says that the HMR round is lethal out to 2miles and the 22LR out to 1 1/2 miles, but thats obviously shot at optimum angle. Real world terms the FEO is looking for plenty of hilly terrain in order to ensure a safe and suitable backstop. Thirdly is either of the rf calibres more likely to be granted to a first time shooter than the other? Here in the Gwent force firearms area the .17HMR is more likely to be granted because of the ballistics of the round on contact, but thats not necessarily the case overall. Finally what range is a .17 hmr and .22lr practical over in normal shooting conditions. I know in a perfect world a hmr would be good to 200 but nothing about real world ranges. I have seen and shot the HMR over 150yds and that is practical out in the field for bunnies and more than capable on foxes out to 100yds, as for the 22LR then I can only go by reports that its practical out to about 70-80yds but capable on bunnies beyond that if you're up to it. Thanks Lads, Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnGalway Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 Can't answer all your questions Dan but here goes... 1. I use a grassy steep hillock as a backstop. I shoot at a board which is staked into the ground with an A4 sheet of white paper stapled or taped onto it and use inch or half inch black dots as targets at 50, 60 and 100 yards. 4. I've used my .22lr on greycrows as far out as 94 yards, foxes (headshot) at 80 yards. Both were in clam conditions. Having used a HMR a little I'd say they would easily go out to 150 on rabbit, winged vermin (again in calm conditions). Never shot a fox with one so I won't comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Sick Old Man Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 I use a 400m field that slopes up, I zero my .22 at 60m on a two foot by four foot sheet of marine ply. the .17 I zero at 120m, the .17 is the safest round as it does not richochet but it is loud. The .22 is sooooooo quiet that you can forget how potnentialy lethal it can be, it bounces like mad. Even sub sonics will fly off stones, so just be sensible before you pull that trigger. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 Thanks lads well were I intend to use it is all flat farm land no real backstops other than cabbages and cover crop. One farm I reckon is probably 700*1000yds but has a road running on 2 of its edges. So just wondering if I did apply whether it would be at all suitable for shooting tbh. The other one is bigger again but the only backstops would be crops and hedges (hardly what I would describe a safe backstop!) The farm is teaming with corvids but I can never get close enough with the air rifle due to the open nature and as I was thinking of applying for an SGC i thought I may go with the FAC too (co terminous for an extra £10) and put down a rf, FAC air rifle to expensive probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham M Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 In that case the .17hmr using 17gr V-max bullets would be preferable due to their frangibility (almost no ricochets). G.M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 That flat land might get a stipulation that a high seat is to be used. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatingisbest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 It says that .22lr is dangerous within 1 mile not 1 1/2. You know what i have said about all this Dan If it is right or not is another question Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevethevanman Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 The 17hmr is cinsidered by many to be the safest rimfire round there is, a lot of people use it well out to 150yds and out to 200yds on a good day, I you want to exterminate bunnys then go for the 22rf as it is practicaly silent with a mod but it does come at the price that it bounces quite a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatingisbest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 you can get a lot of riccocets with a .22lr i have heard that the bullets can riccocet off blades of grass and travel upto 200metres. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 18, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 you can get a lot of riccocets with a .22lr i have heard that the bullets can riccocet off blades of grass and travel upto 200metres. Bloody hell 200m in the wrong direction!!! Scary stuff! To be honest just thought about the high seat, we have a pile of pallets about 20m up that others have been using as a hide so from there I could probably hit all of the maggies (my main aim) with the ability to use the ground as a good backstop! A plan possibly will ask the farmer when shooting next time. He has been on about me getting a proper gun (only own an air rifle) espically if hmr was cleared for fox! Thanks lads, Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevethevanman Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 i have heard that the bullets can riccocet off blades of grass and travel upto 200metres. I can believe the 200m bit but ricocheting of a blade of grass is hard to believe, the bullet probably weighs more than the blade of grass, it will deviate the aim a bit but as far as it actualy hitting it and bouncing off completely goes, I find it unbelievable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invector Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 You do sometimes get ricochets with the .17HMR!! I've had a few. They sound higher pitched than the .22 ricochets so they might be small pieces of copper jacket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pointer Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 naddan28, not being able to see land is a tough one. The FEO should be more than happy to walk the land with you and decide what is best. Both calibres have their plus and minus points. Have you considered cost at all ? The .17 is expensive to feed, about 20p a go ( but very addictive) whilst a .22 is cheap at 5p a go. Rgds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 19, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 naddan28, not being able to see land is a tough one. The FEO should be more than happy to walk the land with you and decide what is best. Both calibres have their plus and minus points. Have you considered cost at all ? The .17 is expensive to feed, about 20p a go ( but very addictive) whilst a .22 is cheap at 5p a go. Rgds Yeah I have considered the cost as well but I am putting safety etc first. I will have to ask the farmer see if he knows what is already cleared for each of the farms and then make a decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axe Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Dan, From what you have explained of the land I would suggest considering an FAC Airgun. It will shoot up to the practicle ranges of a .22LR Sub and will get clearance without a doubt. When it comes to FAC Airguns you'll be surprised to learn that they do not hold their value and very good deals can be found. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Dan, From what you have explained of the land I would suggest considering an FAC Airgun. It will shoot up to the practicle ranges of a .22LR Sub and will get clearance without a doubt. When it comes to FAC Airguns you'll be surprised to learn that they do not hold their value and very good deals can be found. God, just looked on guntrader and seen a BSA Superten with tank (needs retest) scope, mod the lot for £250!!!! I think I may well consider that axe, I have gone off the idea of live rounds as currently have little to no knowledge regarding life rounds and would prefer to get a good grounding and safe knoweldge. Plus as stated the land is not ideal and know they have fac air rifle clearance as farmer said the other day someone had one up there and was amazed with the power! Might see if my nieghbour is selling up, he has a custom rapid at 60ftlbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 I just got my land passed today. It's 170 acres in a square, and dead flat. The FEO said that a HMR was a better round for safety, and cleared all the land for it. If I want a .22lr then a few of the fields are unsuitable. I have to use a high seat no matter what I use. Forget cost of bullets, a dead walker doesn't come cheap these days so 20p per round is a small price to pay in comparison! The .22 will ricochet 200m easily I would have thought, and with a 40gr bullet it will be carrying some power when it gets there too. I'd say you'll get rimfire from a high seat on your land, and rimfire is ok for inexperienced shots as long as you're sensible. You may have guessed which calibre I'd go for. HMR is ok for fox here (glos). If rimfire is turned down, ask for FAC air. Don't forget the trouble of recharging them, you don't get many shots per fill when the power goes up. They're also no good for fox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 I just got my land passed today. It's 170 acres in a square, and dead flat. The FEO said that a HMR was a better round for safety, and cleared all the land for it. If I want a .22lr then a few of the fields are unsuitable. I have to use a high seat no matter what I use. Forget cost of bullets, a dead walker doesn't come cheap these days so 20p per round is a small price to pay in comparison! The .22 will ricochet 200m easily I would have thought, and with a 40gr bullet it will be carrying some power when it gets there too. I'd say you'll get rimfire from a high seat on your land, and rimfire is ok for inexperienced shots as long as you're sensible. You may have guessed which calibre I'd go for. HMR is ok for fox here (glos). If rimfire is turned down, ask for FAC air. Don't forget the trouble of recharging them, you don't get many shots per fill when the power goes up. They're also no good for fox NJC, thanks for the reply as said previously i did consider ammo cost but am putting safety etc first. I personally have no exp with rifles, except my lightning. The land is dead flat roads on 3 sides and the biggest backstop would be cover crop so I think I will probably forget about the FAC or maybe go for a FAC Air Rifle as although no foxes I can still bash the rooks!!! Although at the moment work could be taking me further away (far north as glasgow!!) so in which case no FAC or SGC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 My land is dead flat too. Has a road on two sides (one being the M5!), and is only one field away from a road on another. The motorway didn't create too much bother, I just have to shoot away from it unless I'm right at the other side of the farm which is obvious! If you can get a high seat or sit on those pallets you should be fine IMO. It's best to see where you end up before spending too much on kit and certs, although you could move the guns with you maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naddan28 Posted April 20, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 My land is dead flat too. Has a road on two sides (one being the M5!), and is only one field away from a road on another. The motorway didn't create too much bother, I just have to shoot away from it unless I'm right at the other side of the farm which is obvious! If you can get a high seat or sit on those pallets you should be fine IMO. It's best to see where you end up before spending too much on kit and certs, although you could move the guns with you maybe? Cant really, as will have to apply for my cert in my home county as should I end up working where I want will be home most weekends and as its only a year + living in a rented houseshare, applying for and storing guns there will not be practical at all. Will have to wait and see where I am first, then apply for SGC (should i get what I want) and have a LONG THINK about going co-terminous with a FAC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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