hatsanmad Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 Hi guys i got given a tub of blue dot off someone who was packing in reloading. And im wondering if anyone has any load data for it for 12 gauge 3&1/2 inch hulls with steel loads? Looked through the bpi steel book but the load im after isnt in it and when i checked alliants site its not showing me much there either. Im looking at loading 40-42gram of steel. If anyone has anything that might be of use i would really appreciate it. All the best for 2016 hatsan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 That's because they don't recommend it for steel bud in 3&1/2" 12g. You will have to develop it yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 You've got that one wrong, UD. Blue dot is a decent powder for big steel loads. That's because they don't recommend it for steel bud in 3&1/2" 12g.You will have to develop it yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 You've got that one wrong, UD. Blue dot is a decent powder for big steel loads.Being wrong is not a problem but I am not aware of alliant recommending it for steel in a 3&1/2" case, lead and bismuth yes in 12g. That is why I said he will have to develop it himself.....for steel. I love bluedot and not just in shotshells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatsanmad Posted December 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 What would be my best way to develope a load using it. Theres data using it in 23/4-3inch with shot charges upto 1&1/4oz. Any suggestions on how to develope a load please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 (edited) Recipe - 12 gauge steel load. 3.5" fed case, win 209 primer, Blue dot 35.5gn, 3.5" Sam1 wad, 1.5 oz steel shot. Spacers may be required under shot, dependent on size. 1325 fps, 12200 psi. Edited December 28, 2015 by motty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 They do list some 3&1/2" loads just not steel. I would match the weight of shot, look at all the loads for the Max and minimum charge weights and go for middle. Load a couple and see how they feel and compare the spent primer to a commercially loaded spent cartridge primer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 They do list some 3&1/2" loads just not steel. I would match the weight of shot, look at all the loads for the Max and minimum charge weights and go for middle. Load a couple and see how they feel and compare the spent primer to a commercially loaded spent cartridge primer. I would not follow this advice. Please seek dedicated data. Matching the weight of shot of lead vs steel will be dangerous. Discounting dedicated data then going for the middle is nonsense. Why would published data at the top end be dismissed? Loading a couple and testing is a bad way of finding out how dangerous reloading is. Also what the hell does a factory primer condition have to do with any homeloads manufacture. UD. That advice is seriously bad. It's not even published in any shot shell manual /guide. That's just rubbish UD. The reason bluedot is not used much, is because it doesn't get 1500fps+ like other special powders. UD, you are going to get someone in trouble. Find more dedicated recipes then follow one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Geddon Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 I have to say that I agree with cook. The condition of the primers really is not a reliable indicator of pressure. Blue dot is used for steel shot and there are loads for 42 grams. Before Alliant Steel came along ,Blue dot was the best powder for steel loads ,most of them relatively light and modest in velocity . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Thirty one years and counting, still have both eyes and all my fingers. Nearly died in a serious car accident though, go figure! This feller is in no danger at all from my advice. If I told him to use too fast a powder instead and start with the biggest meanest amounts listed first then yes you would of had a point! Spent primers can be an indicator of pressure, any cap flattening against the breech face is an indication of things warming up. To the OP, listen to the experts, I don't know what I am talking about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Geddon Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Thirty one years and counting, still have both eyes and all my fingers. Nearly died in a serious car accident though, go figure! This feller is in no danger at all from my advice. If I told him to use too fast a powder instead and start with the biggest meanest amounts listed first then yes you would of had a point! Spent primers can be an indicator of pressure, any cap flattening against the breech face is an indication of things warming up. To the OP, listen to the experts, I don't know what I am talking about My post was not intended to undermine you ,but from my experience , primers lie. I sent a load in to the proof house , which shot and patterned well. No sign of danger. That load was miles over proof pressure. You can't trust primers as an indication of pressure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 My post was not intended to undermine you ,but from my experience , primers lie. I sent a load in to the proof house , which shot and patterned well. No sign of danger. That load was miles over proof pressure. You can't trust primers as an indication of pressure If it was miles over proof pressure as you put it damage would be imminent!Or was it over service pressure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Geddon Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Highest one was 1200 bar. I did have a Fabarm that was proofed to 1630 bar. 1200 bar is "safe" as in , your barrel won't burst but it will damage your gun in time. It's a bit scary knowing you have fired some at the plate though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 If you want performance, particularly in a small gauge like the 410 you need to getting decent pressures and you can't do that by guesswork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 I put a load in once. 1200bar. That's a whole heap of pressure. That's excess of the s2n of HP ! That is reasonably unaccessible. That's doube the pressure it needs to be! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Highest one was 1200 bar. I did have a Fabarm that was proofed to 1630 bar. 1200 bar is "safe" as in , your barrel won't burst but it will damage your gun in time. It's a bit scary knowing you have fired some at the plate though. This load, where did you get the data from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric lee Posted December 30, 2015 Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 Had an M92S steel load tested just for curiosity having recently bought a Gaep spinner 1200 bar half a grain short of published data (should have been just shy of 900 bar) i must confess i was advised to drop a full 2 grains on spun loads,last time i had it tested sub 1000 bar higher than published but usable, only difference being spun and used once fired, as opposed to new cases, scary where pressure comes from! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Geddon Posted December 30, 2015 Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 This load, where did you get the data from? My big head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted December 30, 2015 Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 My big head Ahhr, I see. Now I did say to the op to refer to what data he has and start around low to middle of the data he has. I never said guess! ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK fowler Posted December 30, 2015 Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 Hi guys i got given a tub of blue dot off someone who was packing in reloading. And im wondering if anyone has any load data for it for 12 gauge 3&1/2 inch hulls with steel loads? Looked through the bpi steel book but the load im after isnt in it and when i checked alliants site its not showing me much there either. Im looking at loading 40-42gram of steel. If anyone has anything that might be of use i would really appreciate it. All the best for 2016 hatsan 42 grams is to much for blue dot most loads are very slow and run on the hot side 1 1/4oz to 1 3/8oz are a better bet with blue dot this is a load from lymans 5th 31/2" Winchester case 43grains blue dot win 209 primer sam1 wad 1 1/4oz steel shot + 1/4"fiber under shot 1475 fps 11500 psi iv loaded this in new ched cases and it shoots good with 3.5mm and 3.75mm shot sizes you load this at your own risk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatsanmad Posted December 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2015 42 grams is to much for blue dot most loads are very slow and run on the hot side 1 1/4oz to 1 3/8oz are a better bet with blue dot this is a load from lymans 5th 31/2" Winchester case 43grains blue dot win 209 primer sam1 wad 1 1/4oz steel shot + 1/4"fiber under shot 1475 fps 11500 psi iv loaded this in new ched cases and it shoots good with 3.5mm and 3.75mm shot sizes you load this at your own risk Thanks uk fowlwer if i did load this load i would be shooting it through a modern semi auto. By the sounds of it i might be best using a diffrent powder and selling the blue dot on. Thanks everyone for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishop Posted December 10, 2021 Report Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) On 30/12/2015 at 16:27, UK fowler said: 42 grams is to much for blue dot most loads are very slow and run on the hot side 1 1/4oz to 1 3/8oz are a better bet with blue dot this is a load from lymans 5th 31/2" Winchester case 43grains blue dot win 209 primer sam1 wad 1 1/4oz steel shot + 1/4"fiber under shot 1475 fps 11500 psi iv loaded this in new ched cases and it shoots good with 3.5mm and 3.75mm shot sizes you load this at your own risk I may pick up some sam1 wads solely to use this recipe with blue dot.I have a good few gamebore 3.5 once fired cases im contemplating using.Anyone able to validate what cases gamebore use?? Sam 1 3.5 inch wads i assume? Edited December 10, 2021 by bishop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smudger687 Posted December 19, 2021 Report Share Posted December 19, 2021 On 10/12/2021 at 12:11, bishop said: I may pick up some sam1 wads solely to use this recipe with blue dot.I have a good few gamebore 3.5 once fired cases im contemplating using.Anyone able to validate what cases gamebore use?? Sam 1 3.5 inch wads i assume? Reasonably sure they use cheddite cases. Quick test would be to measure a once fired case - Cheddites are 86mm, not a true 89mm. May be worth emailing gamebore to check, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishop Posted December 20, 2021 Report Share Posted December 20, 2021 Im geting good patterns although i found a wad on the saltings the other day from a round i fired up at the geese in that fog.Whole layer of copper coated steel #1 pellets still in wad ***!!!!.Well indented too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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