Starter motors

[scotslad]

Alright folks

Hope u all had a good festive

 

 

Does anyone know of a definitive test to prove if a starter motor is working (preferably while still on the engine)

 

I've tried when it was off the engine puting a battery direct onto it, the solenoid would go in/out but the motor never spun. Does that mean motor is done but solenoid is OK?

 

Got an older 6t dumper (about 05) i could do with getting going for some jobs and a digger coming, Its not done much past few months since i got it but got a lot of work for it this spring/summer

 

Was starting fine till the cold weather came at start dec, had to charge the od battery and still starting ok althou a bit of a struggle, bought a new battery for it (and also done a wee spot of welding when battery diconnected)

When i put new battery on it was just clicking, me and neighbour had a quick play with voltmeter and it seemed to be getting power where it should so he thought it was the starter motor.

 

Took it off and had the boy at garage have a quick look when he was doing an mot for me and he thought it was the solenoid (althou must admit i wasn't convinced as if i wired it direct to battery it would pop out and in but the motor would not spin, althou it did have a dodgy/wobbly 's' terminal connection),

But i then took it to my uncle who has a mate that refurbs them, he reckons theres nothing wrong with it.

 

So just completely confused now

 

To me it seems like a starter motor problem, or is there anything i could have fried/melted when i welded it (even thou no battery in place). The few fuses i can find seem ok

Its 180 quid for a new starter but just not sure if that is going to help especially when opinions are varied

[four-wheel-drive]

I had problems with the one on my 4ltr jeep it would start the engine most of the time as long as the battery was charged up but it did seem to be going slow everyone told me it was a dodgy battery and told me to charge it up like you I did not want to spend out a load of money on a new starter.

 

in the end I got fed up with it after a couple of years and I got a new starter what a world of difference it span really fast when I think of all of the waisted time charging battery's etc I would recommend get a new starter.

Edited December 26, 2016 by four-wheel-drive

[bornfree]

Using a fully charged battery and good quality jump leads. Put negative lead on to one of the starter bolts, put positive lead on to the solenoid main terminal. Then use a short length of wire from positive lead to the solenoid start terminal ( usually a push on blade). If it turns over starter is good. Then check battery leads and earth leads.

Edited December 26, 2016 by bornfree

[shoot and be safe]

It sounds like the electromagnetic is working in the solenoid, but the electric connectors are not making a good contact.

Have you tried putting a power supply straight to the motor to see if it spins?

 

I would drop it in to a auto electricians for them to check it over, it shouldn't cost that much to have it checked and repaired if needed.

[scotslad]

Cheers folks so far.

 

When i had it off i had a battery on the work bench too, i tried a few various connections and solenoid would always fire out in when it was meant to, but the motor never ever spun. Even puttiing the + onto the other terminal on the solenoid on the start side the motor has never spun.

To me that says the starter motor is the problem, but my uncle took it down to a bloke that fixes them as a hobby/sideline and has fixed a few for him in the past, he reckoned it was OK, (and he fixed/improved the dodgy terminal on the solenoid).

Thats wot's confusing me, everything seems to point to a starter problem yet a boy that fixes them says its ok.

 

Should the motor be free enough to spin by hand when its off the engine? I couldn't spin the starter spindle when i had it on bench

 

I've had a play with voltmeter and seem to be getting a decent enough earth, well it always reads body/eginge/motor casing all low readings so must be earthing (to my mind)

 

I've got the jump leads and spare battery lying at it the now as had it connected up to the new battery to jump it to make sure the battery wasn't the problem, so i'll hotwire it while on the engine and see wot happens.

Cheers again

[Cannon]

There isn't much to a starter motor. Most light vehicle are pre-engaged types, so the pinion gear should be thrown out and spin when the solenoid gets energised.

 

First check to see if you're getting full battery voltage to the main starter terminal. It should always have battery voltage present even with the ignition off. Then you need to check that the solenoid is getting power. This must be checked during cranking. If you are getting roughly 12 volts here then you need to check the earth connections. Are they clean and secure with no damage present? Starters can be overhauled quite easily, and it is often the case that the commutator is contaminated or the brushes are worn. Overhauling them is certainly not beyond the remit of a competent DIY'er, though a half decent multimeter is essential for resistance tests on the internal components. There are plenty of guides online and on youtube.

 

The above is assuming that the associated fuses and relays are functioning as they should be.

[scotslad]

God knows. Think i'll have to get someone out to have a look.

 

Managed to get it turning over a couple off times just as i was convinced starter motor was gone.

Even hot wiring with the spare battery not always turning over thou, i know the 'start' terminal on solenoid was a bit wobbly but the blok put a 2nd nut on which seems to have fixed its wobble atleast. But i think sometime the jumpleads notalways getting a good contact too.

 

Think must be a bad connection somewhere possibly in abou the barrel but nothing obvious that i can see. I think i've checked most of the obvious things.

 

Cheers for the advice

[TDS]

Can it be sticking or worn brushes ?

Had a similar problem years ago on a lazy car starter...changed the brushes and it flew over

[HAYBURN]

I can only advice using heavy gauge jump leads and connect + lead to + on the vehicle battery and the negative jump lead to a good clean earth point

on the engine. you may have a bad earth from battery to chassis or chassis to engine. you could also still have a duff starter. Atb

 

where is your location, also loads of starter tests on you tube as above.

Edited December 27, 2016 by HAYBURN

[scotslad]

Glad to say finally got it going.

 

Turns out starter motor was OK all along, the problems i was having was a combination off not holding the power on the 'start' terminal long enough for motor to spin and/or my jump leads haven't really been good enough (esp when starter motor was on ongine so u couldn't guarantee it wasn't just a poor jump lead connection) an really ackward to attach jump leads to it on engine and to try and short it (casing designed so u can't, well not with a screw driver anyway)

 

After taking starter off again and finally getting it going with some better borrowed jump leads i put it on engine and connected the '-' battery terminal straight to the 'neg -' on starter motor, to isolate a bad earth.

It started so throu ilimantion it turns out to be the isolator switch, so got the 2 earths just bolted together for the moment till i get new switch.

 

When u put the volt meter across it it does show connectivity althou with some resistance, but it must off been enough to make a difference.

 

Cheers for all the advice

[Westward]

When u put the volt meter across it it does show connectivity althou with some resistance, but it must off been enough to make a difference.

 

You don't need much resistance. The motor takes a lot of current (Amps) and you only need a slight resistance (a very few Ohms) to drop the voltage right down. One amp passing through a resistance of 1 ohm will cause a drop of 1 volt.