Hungerford Massacre

[Scully]

 

 

I believed then and I still believe now that as a sport we were too tolerant of these sort of people, events have sadly proved me correct. Both Hungerford and Dunblaine were committed by people who shouldn't have been within our ranks in the first place.

As a post of sheer and unbelievable arrogance I believe that is well up there with the best!

It is a perfect example of the snobbery and elitism which dominates shooting sports in the U.K.

There are those amongst us who believe that pure driven shooting is the only type of shotgun shooting which should be allowed, and they regard those who participate in practical shotgun and all manner of other practical disciplines as 'Walts' and worse.

Given your above comments above, how would you decide criteria for those you regard as suitable to own firearms? Their occupation? Bank balance? The social class in which they circulate?

Do tell.

[Vince Green]

As a post of sheer and unbelievable arrogance I believe that is well up there with the best!

It is a perfect example of the snobbery and elitism which dominates shooting sports in the U.K.

There are those amongst us who believe that pure driven shooting is the only type of shotgun shooting which should be allowed, and they regard those who participate in practical shotgun and all manner of other practical disciplines as 'Walts' and worse.

Given your above comments above, how would you decide criteria for those you regard as suitable to own firearms? Their occupation? Bank balance? The social class in which they circulate?

Do tell.

 

How about not being a weirdo? Would that be a start? People who want to dress up in combat gear and play at shooting people shaped targets are Walts and always will be to me.

 

The facts speak for themselves Ryan and Hamilton were not fit to own firearms

Edited August 29, 2017 by Vince Green

[Scully]

Not good enough I'm afraid. Your snobbishness is showing.

Re-enactors ( including Bill Harriman and a senior police officer ) of all theatres of war dress up in contemporary uniform and enjoy themselves.

As part of open days on our ranges we would shoot scaled down Napoleonic uniformed targets on our black powder course.

Ryan, Hamilton and Bird satisfied all criteria as per HO guidance of the day, so again, I ask how do you define a suitable person to own firearms, given that Ryan, Hamilton and Bird satisfied the same criteria that you and I did?

[Vince Green]

Not good enough I'm afraid. Your snobbishness is showing.

Re-enactors ( including Bill Harriman and a senior police officer ) of all theatres of war dress up in contemporary uniform and enjoy themselves.

As part of open days on our ranges we would shoot scaled down Napoleonic uniformed targets on our black powder course.

Ryan, Hamilton and Bird satisfied all criteria as per HO guidance of the day, so again, I ask how do you define a suitable person to own firearms, given that Ryan, Hamilton and Bird satisfied the same criteria that you and I did?

 

I don't care if you think I'm a snob, Ryan and Hamilton were not re-enactors so I don't see that argument has any merit. A plonker doesn't stop being a plonker because we give them the benefit of the doubt, but a plonker isn't necessarily dangerous.

 

Guns attract all sorts of people for all sorts of reasons, not necessarily the right people or the right reasons. Its not my job to decide who is and who isn't suitable but I am comfortable with them erring on the safe side.

[Vince Green]

I've wondered what's the deal with the 100 year ban on info?

 

I've heard rumours about pedo connections etc, but there's so many theories about all sorts of things you'll never get the truth.

 

The speculation has always been high profile names that weren't involved in the shooting but were in Hamilton's circle of (presumably Pedo) contacts were shielded. If you google it up you will find it but its not really within the remit of this forum to start repeating the stuff on here.

[Scully]

 

I don't care if you think I'm a snob, Ryan and Hamilton were not re-enactors so I don't see that argument has any merit. A plonker doesn't stop being a plonker because we give them the benefit of the doubt, but a plonker isn't necessarily dangerous.

 

Guns attract all sorts of people for all sorts of reasons, not necessarily the right people or the right reasons. Its not my job to decide who is and who isn't suitable but I am comfortable with them erring on the safe side.

Still no answer! Not easy is it without the benefit of hindsight?

I wasn't trying to make merit out of the fact that neither Ryan nor Hamilton or even Bird were re-enactors, just simply trying to point out that until they all went doolally, all of them satisfied the given criteria required to make them suitable for FAC, just like you and I and everyone else on this forum.

All you have done so far is prove beyond doubt that snobbery and elitism is thriving within UK shooting sports, and that your criteria is simply qualifications in hindsight!

So your answer would be to exclude the 'wrong type', but you still haven't given any idea as to how it is decided exactly who is the 'wrong type', apart from an unbelievably snobbish dress code!

Well done.

You are a perfect example of everything that is wrong with UK shooting sports.

[Rewulf]

 

How about not being a weirdo? Would that be a start? People who want to dress up in combat gear and play at shooting people shaped targets are Walts and always will be to me.

 

The facts speak for themselves Ryan and Hamilton were not fit to own firearms

 

With all due respect, you could apply that to kids who play first person shooter games.

Millions of them dont end up applying these pastimes to real life,as much as the anti gun lobby would have you believe.

Ive seen grown men play paintball, airsoft, practical pistol with air guns, people turn up to target shooting clubs in full camo (very often) they are having FUN!

We have military silhouette targets at one of my target clubs, they dont often get used because I think members are embarrassed about using them, in case they are called a weirdo maybe ? It wouldnt bother me.

We have often discussed doing an American style 3 gun on our 25m range, which is a combat inspired discipline, I dont see a problem, besides the safety concerns.

I understand where you are coming from, but you are pointing fingers in the wrong direction.

[Vince Green]

Still no answer! Not easy is it without the benefit of hindsight?

I wasn't trying to make merit out of the fact that neither Ryan nor Hamilton or even Bird were re-enactors, just simply trying to point out that until they all went doolally, all of them satisfied the given criteria required to make them suitable for FAC, just like you and I and everyone else on this forum.

All you have done so far is prove beyond doubt that snobbery and elitism is thriving within UK shooting sports, and that your criteria is simply qualifications in hindsight!

So your answer would be to exclude the 'wrong type', but you still haven't given any idea as to how it is decided exactly who is the 'wrong type', apart from an unbelievably snobbish dress code!

Well done.

You are a perfect example of everything that is wrong with UK shooting sports.

 

Whats so wrong with being a snob? I regard it as a great personal attribute, it has served me well thus far

Edited August 29, 2017 by Vince Green

[Scully]

 

Whats so wrong with being a snob? I regard it as a great personal attribute, it has served me well thus far

 

Snobbery isn't a great personal attribute, not even when its being used to avoid answering the question, as it is now.

[Vince Green]

 

Snobbery isn't a great personal attribute, not even when its being used to avoid answering the question, as it is now.

 

Sorry what question? I thought you were just trolling me like you usually do

 

Ah right, I've read back through your posts, now I see. you are asking the sort of question that can't actually be answered because which ever way I answer you will just come back and say no that's not right, because that's what you usually do.

 

I still don't believe that anybody actually needs an AK47 or a 9mm pistol to participate in "sport" shooting so yes. I do believe we are better off with out them and we are better of without the kind of people who got turned on by owning them. Why is that such a problem to you? Why do you have to resort to calling me names all the time because I think that? My opinion of you I keep to myself but you may deduce.

 

I also believe, or would like to think, that the likes of Hamilton and Ryan would not slip so easily through the net today.

 

So back to you, its not possible to reason with a troll so hit me with your next silly response. By the way I am going to Wales in a couple of days so if I don't reply its because I have no internet.

Edited August 29, 2017 by Vince Green

[Walker570]

I've wondered what's the deal with the 100 year ban on info?

 

I've heard rumours about pedo connections etc, but there's so many theories about all sorts of things you'll never get the truth.

The story when I was in the job, was that the officers tasked with arranging his renewal reported that he should not be allowed to have firearms but a certain senior officer said he knew the man better than most and signed it through. That senior officer strangely faded away after the massacre. As you say the 100yr rule makes it very suspicious.

[Scully]

 

Sorry what question? I thought you were just trolling me like you usually do

Really? Yet another poor attempt to avoid the question.

You know damn fine what the question was, you simply can't answer it; unless you regard your arrogantly blatant superiority over others you deem unsuitable as an answer?

Dress code simply doesn't cut it I'm afraid, down here, in the real world. Nor in HO guidance apparently. Some of the nicest people I know aren't averse to DPM.

[Vince Green]

Really? Yet another poor attempt to avoid the question.

You know damn fine what the question was, you simply can't answer it; unless you regard your arrogantly blatant superiority over others you deem unsuitable as an answer?

Dress code simply doesn't cut it I'm afraid, down here, in the real world. Nor in HO guidance apparently. Some of the nicest people I know aren't averse to DPM.

 

Troll

[Cranfield]

As this matter seems to have developed into a personal slanging match, it can close.